A Few Words About A few words about...™ The Lord of the Rings Trilogy - Extended Edition -- in Blu-ray

Discussion in 'Blu-ray and UHD' started by Robert Harris, Jun 14, 2011.

  1. litlgi74

    litlgi74 Auditioning

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  2. cafink

    cafink Producer

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    John, do you actually have the disc in hand, or are those screenshots coming from a different source?
     
  3. ManW_TheUncool

    ManW_TheUncool Producer

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    Other than the screencap of the snowy mountain scene, I actually can't tell which one is closer to what it should be for that shot of Frodo, especially when compared to the flashbacks in TTT as well.

    To my eye -- and based only on that Frodo shot alone -- it looks to me like they've regraded that scene (for both FOTR EE and TTT EE) to yield a somewhat more uniform look for the EE BD release. I see more yellow added in *both* the FOTR EE and TTT EE BD versions of that shot, but the FOTR EE BD version did not get the needed bump in red to match TTT EE BD version. Meanwhile, the FOTR TE BD of that shot seems to be missing *both* the yellow *and* the red to match the TTT EE BD version -- and missing the yellow to match the TTT TE BD version.

    IMHO, if their desire is indeed to yield a more golden hue for the image, then the FOTR EE BD version of that shot comes closer to that than the FOTR TE BD.

    Of course, one major caveat is that I'm looking at these comparisons on a cheapy LCD (at work) that's not been calibrated for color -- and I'm guessing many of you are seeing them in likewise fashion -- so maybe what looks more golden to me on this display might be waaaay green in reality. OTOH, I'll add this. These various "green" shots I'm seeing so far (other than the cyan looking snowy mountain shot) are not anymore green than various others like the recent release of The Sound of Music, which was (in)famously regraded for a more golden look...

    One other thing. I wonder what they actually did to bump up the levels for the flashback of that scene in TTT. Depending on what they actually did, that may have inadvertantly bumped up the reds that I see -- it's one reason why one should be careful about doing such things in Photoshop...

    _Man_
     
  4. PaulDA

    PaulDA Cinematographer

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    My thoughts exactly.
     
  5. Mark Booth

    Mark Booth Screenwriter
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    Here's something that will play with your mind....

    Click the following link to watch the short youtube video. This video is a segment taken directly from the extended edition Blu-ray discs. Watch carefully to see if you feel the image is too cyan or too green. Pay particular attention during the closeup of Gandalf when he says "And what about very old friends". Is the sky behind Gandalf an appropriate shade of Blue?



    When I watched that video (by itself), although it looks too dark, I felt the color appeared to be just fine. Maybe just a tiny little bit on the teal side, but not as bad as the screen caps made it out.

    THEN I went back to the earlier split-screen video of the same scene (the one with the EE Blu-ray on the left and the TE Blu-ray on the right):



    Guess what?.... The first video, which moments before looked pretty much fine to my eye, suddenly seemed way too teal!!

    Seriously, compare the two. Pause the videos in the same spots (particularly that scene with the sky behind Gandalf) and compare. The one taken from the actual discs looks pretty much the same as the left side of the split-screen video. Too teal!

    Bottom line, I couldn't trust what my eyes were telling me when I watched the first video by itself. I thought it looked fine. Now I think it looks too teal.

    I beginning to think I'll just save the money and stick with the theatrical edition Blu-rays. I'm sorry, but this new color timing just seems wrong.

    Mark
     
  6. RobertR

    RobertR Lead Actor

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    Unless one prefers the theatrical cuts, this makes no sense to me. The EE colors are much less "wrong" than the loss of detail, EE, etc. in the TEs. NO one watches a movie while comparing it in split screen to a different version. I'm just going to sit back and enjoy.
     
  7. cafink

    cafink Producer

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    While I'm inclined to agree with those who say that something funny is going on with the color on the new Extended Edition Blu-ray, I have to agree with Robert on this point. The theatrical Blu-rays had plenty of picture quality issues, too--edge enhancement, DNR, and the like. What's special about the coloring problem? Why is it so egregious that it's worth passing on a product you'd otherwise enjoy, when you ostensibly have plenty of other Blu-rays in your collection that are imperfect in some way?
     
  8. Mark Booth

    Mark Booth Screenwriter
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    You guys make good points. My indecisiveness is compounded by the fact that I've never watched the extended editions of any of the movies. I've only owned the theatrical versions on DVD and then Blu-ray. The theatrical versions are long enough.

    But... I am tempted to see what I have been missing.

    Mark
     
  9. RobertR

    RobertR Lead Actor

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    I think you owe it to yourself to watch the EEs, Mark. Yes, they're long, especially ROTK. But as someone said, a good movie is never too long, and a bad movie is never too short. Some may disagree, but I prefer the EEs. See for yourself.
     
  10. Tom Logan

    Tom Logan Stunt Coordinator

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    I like this bit of perspective-giving, but if the grading is in error (and the split-screen video comparison of Gandalf arriving at Bilbo's is damning, IMHO), then let's make sure we call it as we see it. "Imperfect" for arguably the most important disc set in the catalog--at $28 per disc!--is hardly acceptable.

    "What's special about the coloring problem," for me, is that even in the EE clip by itself (without the split screen TE to emphasize the difference), that sky looks like Gandalf is in Transformers, not FOTR. It's egregious. I can only hope the actual discs aren't so bad, as RAH indicates.
     
  11. cafink

    cafink Producer

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    Honestly, I thought Fellowship and Return of the King were better in their theatrical versions. Some of the added scenes were interesting (my favorite is the "which way is Mordor?" bit from Fellowship), but the theatrical versions were tighter and better-paced, in my opinion. Still, I agree that the extended editions are at least worth watching if you enjoy the series overall. I still keep telling myself that I'm going to sit down and watch all three extended editions back-to-back in a single day, just for the experience of it.
     
  12. TheBat

    TheBat Producer

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    while I prefer the ee on two towers and return of the king. I feel that the theatre version of fellowship of the ring is a much better version. I agree with others that the theatre version (fotr) had better pacing.
     
  13. cineMANIAC

    cineMANIAC Cinematographer
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    Now I've got an expensive collection of theatrical version Blu-rays from last year that I have no idea what to do with. Does anyone have a strong, convincing reason I should keep these versions? Also, I don't have a problem with the films being split over two discs just as long they don't make me watch forced trailers or other junk after each changeover. It's a major pain the ass having to sit through ads I don't want to watch every time I pop a disc in.
     
  14. cafink

    cafink Producer

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    Because they are great movies, modern classics that won 17 academy awards between them and garnered almost universal critical acclaim?
     
  15. cineMANIAC

    cineMANIAC Cinematographer
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    No, no, I mean do I need BOTH the theatrical AND Extended versions? I'm trying to decide what to do with the Theatrical versions - I don't envision needing them since I prefer the long versions. Is there anything in the Theatrical versions that isn't ported over?
     
  16. David_B_K

    David_B_K Advanced Member

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    Funny, I'm kind of the opposite. I really missed the entirety of "The Gifts of Galadriel" in the theatrical versions and felt that it could not be cut. The only EE I HAVE to have is FOTR. But once I get the EE set I'm sure that's all I'll watch. They actually all have better pacing in the theatrical versions, IMO; but there is too much cool stuff in the EEs.
     
  17. cafink

    cafink Producer

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    Well, the extended Blu-rays don't include the theatrical cuts of the films, which are the ones that won all those awards and earned all those great reviews. But if that's not important to you, the only other consideration is the supplements. None of the special features from the theatrical Blu-rays are carried over to the extended editions. So you will indeed need both if you want all the features.
     
  18. Mark Booth

    Mark Booth Screenwriter
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    Ralph Potts over at AVS has received the EE discs. He was asked to look specifically at the snowy mountain scene and report his findings:

    Quote

    "Greetings,
    I watched the entire sequence beginning just before the switch to the snowy mountain which begins at 7:22 or so. The scene just before it looks fine as Gandalf tells the Fellowship that they must take the mountain pass. As soon as it switches to the wide angle shot of them traversing the mountain the image has a noticebly bluish tinge (the comparison you reference is right on target). I watched the remainder of the sequence and the shots of the snowy mountain all look this way. The ones that flip back and forth to Isengard (spelling?) look fine.
    I watched the same sequence on the FOTR EE DVD and it does not look this way. Quite frankly I am at a loss for the reasoning behind this."

    End Quote

    I keep scratching my head asking why Peter Jackson would take a scene that has had (basically) white snow for 10 years, and then suddenly shift it toward teal (blue/green/cyan/whatever).

    I'm sorry, but I'm finding it harder and harder to believe that this color shift was 100% intentional. It's just too dramatic of a change in some scenes (Gandalf at Bilbo's front door being another).

    Mark
     
  19. Tom Logan

    Tom Logan Stunt Coordinator

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    One guess is that Jackson is retrospectively getting the films to match the look of the forthcoming Hobbit films. If so, I find that just too Lucas for words.

    My own hope is that somebody sloppily executed Jackson's timing directions, and that we'll get some fix somehow (assuming the discs look as appalling as some of the grabs and clips).
     
  20. Bob_S.

    Bob_S. Supporting Actor

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    I have kept my TE dvds solely for the special features that are not on the EE's. I haven't watched the TE's since I bought the EE's when they first came out. One of my favorite scenes from FOTR comes from the EE, when Frodo and Sam watch the wood elves travelling to the Grey Havens. I just love the music, the wind blowing through the trees and Frodo and Sam's hair and Sam's line: "I don't know why, but it makes me sad". It really pulls me into Middle-earth. When I went to see this last night at the theater, I couldn't wait to watch this scene on the big screen. I can't imagine myself watching FOTR without it.

    Oh, by the way, does anyone know if Peter Jackson has commented on this? I'm assuming he has seen at least some scenes from this set and has given his approval. Is it possible he wanted it this way?
     

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