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Firefly Cancelled--Officially.


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#1 of 117 OFFLINE   Joel C

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Posted December 12 2002 - 10:20 PM

According to timminear.net, Firefly has been officially cancelled ("No new episodes are being ordered"), though Fox promises to air what ones have been shot.

Right. Just like they aired all 13 episodes of Pasadena.

Incidentally, what's the correct spelling of "cancelled"? My spell check takes both one or two "l"s.
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#2 of 117 OFFLINE   DwightK

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Posted December 12 2002 - 10:52 PM

Joel, you're a savior! Maybe it's all in the spelling of "cancelled" not in the definition.Posted Image

Joke on the previous thread aside, This has to be one ofthe most unexpected moves in FOX history. What are the qualifications to become a TV executive who makes programming decisions? Is there any way to sit down and have dinner with one for a nice chat into how their brain works? What motivates them into believing a show would succeed in certain time slots, certain day demographics, competion, etc.

Is there a college course in this that I could take somewhere as I really am interested. There must be some very strange economics involved which is why we, the common person cannot comprehend all the issues.

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#3 of 117 OFFLINE   Patrick Sun

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Posted December 12 2002 - 11:20 PM

From Tim's website:

Quote:
Well, it's official. After much speculation, Firefly has been cancelled.

Tim had the following to say, "We did get word tonight, Fox won't be ordering any new eps. That translates to 'cancelled.' We will finish shooting the ep now in production (I'm directing, in fact Joss came down to the set to break the bad news to cast and crew -- we wrapped early, but are back at it in the am), we'll finish post on all eps, and Fox says they're going to somehow air all eps."

Sad news, indeed. And I doubt there's any other studio/network that wants to pay what it cost for the production values needed for Firefly for a lowly "performing" show in terms of the ratings these days.
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#4 of 117 OFFLINE   Bill Griffith

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Posted December 12 2002 - 11:40 PM

Most unfortunate.

I really liked the show. But airing it on Friday nights what would you expect the ratings to be like. Should have aired it Sunday, would have done much better (for me at least). I think I missed 2 shows because of its slot.

#5 of 117 OFFLINE   PhilipG

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Posted December 12 2002 - 11:53 PM

Quote:
Incidentally, what's the correct spelling of "cancelled"? My spell check takes both one or two "l"s.

The correct English spelling is "cancelled". However, if you believe there's such a thing as "US-English" (as coined by Bill Gates), then the misspelling is probably okay for you too. Posted Image

As for Firefly, I never watched it, but I think it's a terrible shame whenever non-Trek sci-fi shows are cancelled. Meanwhile, Enterprise continues in its descent past the bottom of the barrel.

#6 of 117 OFFLINE   Jeff Kleist

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Posted December 13 2002 - 12:49 AM

*sob*

It is a day or mourning

Another Sci-Fi show murdered before its time, without conclusion

Thank you MLB for not just playing 1 game and getting it @#$%@#$ over with. Thank you Fox for not even giving it the respect you gave that shitburger Dark Angel,

And thank you Joss, Tim, Ben and the entire cast and crew for giving us such a wonderful show, while I guess they CAN take the sky from us, but we will not forget it

Your High Priest is available for Grief counseling

#7 of 117 OFFLINE   Michael St. Clair

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Posted December 13 2002 - 01:53 AM

Not one of my friends watched a single episode of 'Firefly', though most of them watch some sci-fi shows regularly. But they go out Friday night, and they don't have a Tivo like I do.

Fox has ordered some great shows in the last couple of years, but they set them up to fail.

'Odyssey 5' gets a larger episode order. I think cable, especially premium cable, might be the best place for quality sci-fi.

Oh, and to blame the World Series for the death of 'Firefly' is silly.

#8 of 117 OFFLINE   Jason Seaver

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Posted December 13 2002 - 02:08 AM

Quote:
Another Sci-Fi show murdered before its time, without conclusion

Thank you MLB for not just playing 1 game and getting it @#$%@#$ over with.
Oh, get over that. Firefly was always going to be a high-risk show, and John Doe seems to have survived under similar circumstances. Be glad that Fox was willing to take a flier on this show, hope for a DVD release, and see what the people involved come up with next.

Quote:
What motivates them into believing a show would succeed in certain time slots, certain day demographics, competion, etc.
Well, part of it's probably "what do we have free?" Monday was promised to David E. Kelley (which seemed like a reasonable idea at the time). Thursday is already very competitive in Firefly's demographic. Sunday at 9 was a logjam even if WB hadn't put Angel there. Which leaves Wednesday and Friday. Wednesday, you're looking at The West Wing and WB's much-hyped Birds Of Prey.

Meanwhile, on Friday, there's relatively little on that appeals to teen/20-something males, it's where The X-Files hit it big, and it's where both Sci-Fi and Showtime have had success with their science fiction programming. And it's the date that's going to get pre-empted the least by baseball, so it's a good place to try and nurture a new show.

Do things happen differently if Firefly is on Wednesday and Fastlane is on Friday? Who knows? I tend to suspect that sci-fi just isn't going to succeed on a big-four network unless it's something contemporary - something like The X-Files, The Pretender, or John Doe which doesn't require a leap to another world/time - the numbers just aren't there any more.

Ah, well. Here's hoping these guys' next projects are as much popular successes as Firefly was an artistic success.
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#9 of 117 OFFLINE   Ron McBadger

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Posted December 13 2002 - 02:39 AM

Quote:
Meanwhile, on Friday, there's relatively little on that appeals to teen/20-something males, it's where The X-Files hit it big, and it's where both Sci-Fi and Showtime have had success with their science fiction programming.


Success seems to mean very little to the Sci Fi channel no matter what night as they seem to cancel shows on a whim.

Now all you Firefly fans can joins us Farscape fans and mourn the loss of another decent science fiction tv show. I blasted Firefly early but have come to like the show over the last few episodes. As for what killed it...I am no expert but I really think that Fox should have shown the episodes in order with a pilot...or instead of showing the stand alone episodes first they should have shown us the arc episodes right away to get us hooked. Because these last couple that were aired were the best ones yet and were close to what Farscape had acheived as far as excitement and the willingness to tune in next week to see what is going to happen to our wayward group of misfits.

As for Enterprise it has gotten so bad in my mind that I have stopped watching it and probably will not watch it again till the writing changes.

#10 of 117 OFFLINE   Jeffrey_Scotts

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Posted December 13 2002 - 03:24 AM

Well, I hate to be the type to say I told you so...but I did! In fact, I was the first to report the story from ET Weekly magazine. A few people insisted I didn't know, but I guess you can take their word now. Bottom line is I WAS RIGHT!

Never watched it except for 3 episodes and couldn't stand it. But I do wish more chances for shows are given by Fox, just like UPN does with junk shows like Enterprise and New Twilight Zone.

#11 of 117 OFFLINE   Michael St. Clair

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Posted December 13 2002 - 03:32 AM

Quote:
Well, I hate to be the type to say I told you so...but I did! In fact, I was the first to report the story from ET Weekly magazine. A few people insisted I didn't know, but I guess you can take their word now. Bottom line is I WAS RIGHT!

Um, whatever. The article you posted didn't say cancelled, and didn't mean cancelled (unless the editors at EW are grammatically incompetent). The article as posted could easily signify an indefinite haitus, which is not unheard of at Fox (shows like Family Guy and Andy Richter have been yanked before with no firm plans about their future). We never questioned your reporting of the article.

Quote:
Never watched it except for 3 episodes and couldn't stand it.

Well, there are lots of things I don't like but I'm not as spiteful as you about it. If you take glee in our show being cancelled, I pity you for how empty your life must be. Too much brings me pleasure in my life than to get off on baiting other HTF members about something they like.

#12 of 117 OFFLINE   Jason Seaver

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Posted December 13 2002 - 03:34 AM

Quote:
But I do wish more chances for shows are given by Fox, just like UPN does with junk shows like Enterprise and New Twilight Zone.
Geez, don't emulate UPN and be all about the brand name. Firefly was an example of Fox doing something right, and it just not working out. Shit happens.
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#13 of 117 OFFLINE   TheLongshot

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Posted December 13 2002 - 03:39 AM

Quote:
Thank you MLB for not just playing 1 game and getting it @#$%@#$ over with.


Get over yourself, Jeff. There are many more beefs you can levy before Fox than having the show skip a week for MLB. (How about not showing the pilot, skipping a couple of weeks for movies, poor marketing?) As for Futurerama, you need to blame the executives, who know when the NFL goes over, and earlier in the season, was doing Simpson reruns.

Quote:
Meanwhile, on Friday, there's relatively little on that appeals to teen/20-something males, it's where The X-Files hit it big, and it's where both Sci-Fi and Showtime have had success with their science fiction programming.

Problem is, Sci-Fi hasn't worked on Friday for Fox. With the exception of X-Files and maybe Millenium, all the shows on Friday have failed. Brisco County Jr., VR-5, Strange Luck, Brimstone, all just lasted one season. Hell, even X-Files ended up being moved to Sundays. It suceeded despite its time slot, not because of it.

Jason

#14 of 117 OFFLINE   Patrick Sun

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Posted December 13 2002 - 03:50 AM

Supposedly this was culled from the official Firefly board:

Quote:
Message from Joss on the Phoenix Board:

joss - Dec 13, 2002 7:49:36 am EST #7717 of 7737 Mark
Kiba owes me her life.

Four AM. Can't sleep. Who'd have thought?

There's a couple of things I'd like to say. And a few things I really can't. First of all, I'm prouder of this show and the people I worked with on it than I can express in words, monkey noises, or hyroglyphics. I believe this has been some fairly great TV. And the experience of making it... I've had crew members who've been working for 20 years say they've never worked around such excitement, support and love. You walk on that set, you're transported. The cast: 9 count 'em 9 incredibly talented actors who are all decent, wonderful people. This phenomenon cannot be explained by science.

Second of all, don't think for a second that I have given up on this show. I think it has been mistreated shamefully, but the Fox network has indicated that they would not stand in the way (which they can) of my finding a new home for the show. That's no easy prospect. But I will do everything in my power, as always, to keep this bird in the air. Of course I'll post if there's any news.

But even if the show goes back up elsewhere, I'm going to lose a good portion of my crew. Production will halt, they'll need to find new jobs. You can't imagine how that feels. How much they brought to the table, how hard and well they worked. And their Christmas bonus is this. As much as the cast, the staff, and my not so secret lover Minear, I honor those guys, and hope to get them back on board.

So for now, I proudly take my place beside Profit, The Ben Stiller Show, the Tick, and Action. But I won't rest until I've found safe harbour (no, not the Gregory Harrison show) for this vessel.

I've got the time.

It ain't like I'm sleeping.

-joss.

So...if a miracle happens and another network wants the show, there still might be a slim chance that Firefly might find a new home, but it's an overly optimistic view.
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#15 of 117 OFFLINE   Jason Quillen

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Posted December 13 2002 - 03:50 AM

Quote:
Well, I hate to be the type to say I told you so...but I did! In fact, I was the first to report the story from ET Weekly magazine. A few people insisted I didn't know, but I guess you can take their word now. Bottom line is I WAS RIGHT!


Ugh. What did like, 3 people post the definition of 'indefinitely' in that thread and you still don't understand?

At the time of that EW article Firefly was going on hiatus. Now it has been officially reported. Tim Minear is one of the executive producers of the show and it was his website that broke the news - your telling me EW knew that first?

The happiness you seem to take in a show that quite a few people were fond of is just childish.

JQ

#16 of 117 OFFLINE   Jeff Kleist

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Posted December 13 2002 - 03:50 AM

Until professional sports stops pre-empting programming (and suprise, the majority of programming it pre-empts ends up being CANCELLED) I will NEVER stop blaming them.

DEATH BY SPORTS

Earth 2
Space Above and Beyond
Futurama
Firefly

MLB took a week during the crucial audience building time for the show. Could it have made a difference? Maybe, maybe not, but they still did, THEREFORE they carry partial blame for their inability to finish their playoffs quickly

The NFL can do it in 1 game for each round, why can't they?

#17 of 117 OFFLINE   Mark Turetsky

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Posted December 13 2002 - 03:51 AM

Quote:
Well, I hate to be the type to say I told you so...but I did! In fact, I was the first to report the story from ET Weekly magazine. A few people insisted I didn't know, but I guess you can take their word now. Bottom line is I WAS RIGHT!


Let's see, Tim Minear found out yesterday, and you posted the "news" on Tuesday. You must have amazing sources to find out news like this before the creators of the show.

#18 of 117 OFFLINE   PaulHeroy

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Posted December 13 2002 - 03:53 AM

*sob*

With the loss of Firefly and Farscape, there's not much left. As time goes by it's more and more amazing that Babylon 5 got its full 5 years. Meanwhile, as others have noted Enterprise is going full bore on following the modern Trek pattern of telling run of the mill, boring stories with bland writing, but it'll almost certainly get a full 7 years.

BLEAH. The state of TV SF is getting pretty bad, and the unwillingness of networks to allow shows to grow and find an audience is distressing. I've been watching Odyssey 5 but it's never quite grabbed my attention fully. Jeremiah is mostly pretty good and with JMS doing it you know it's got some good stuff planned. Buffy & Angel have both teetered on the edge of too much soap opera but are still good.

#19 of 117 OFFLINE   ChuckDeLa

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Posted December 13 2002 - 03:54 AM

While I'm very sad to hear this news, and I hate for a Joss project to get canned.... I have to say that Firefly lacked that certain magic that makes a show special. Maybe it needed more time to find its legs, but I'm not too surprised that it couldn't hold a sizable audience. Perhaps Fox is to blame for showing it out of sequence, but Firefly seemed to flop around from episode to episode without any sense of purpose, and at times it felt like a series in its waning years that was running out of plot ideas. I wanted desperately for the show to be great, but it simply... wasn't.

I hope Joss has better luck on his next project, whatever it may be.

#20 of 117 OFFLINE   Jason Seaver

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Posted December 13 2002 - 04:26 AM

Quote:
The NFL can do it in 1 game for each round, why can't they?
The NFL is a different beast than MLB. The injury risk there is much greater, and part of the challenge of MLB is having a deep enough rotation/bench to be able to compete on a daily basis.

And if Firefly couldn't survive being pre-empted one week, well, maybe its prospects weren't that bright anyway.

Quote:
and suprise, the majority of programming it pre-empts ends up being CANCELLED
Okay, you used the word "majority". So, I'm presuming you've got statistics which will back this up? You've done an exhaustive study of all national pre-emptions over the last fifty years, and arrived at this conclusion? Or is it just that you remember the shows you like being cancelled much more clearly?

Quote:
Meanwhile, on Friday, there's relatively little on that appeals to teen/20-something males, it's where The X-Files hit it big, and it's where both Sci-Fi and Showtime have had success with their science fiction programming.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Problem is, Sci-Fi hasn't worked on Friday for Fox. With the exception of X-Files and maybe Millenium, all the shows on Friday have failed. Brisco County Jr., VR-5, Strange Luck, Brimstone, all just lasted one season. Hell, even X-Files ended up being moved to Sundays. It suceeded despite its time slot, not because of it.
Still... What better option did Fox have for Firefly? Maybe if they'd kept it held back until mid-season, there would have been a better slot, but, really, what could they have done better other than starting with the pilot?

Personally, I might have tried flip-flopping Firefly and John Doe for a couple weeks, just to see whether it really was the slot or the show. Maybe moved it to Monday once girls club crashed and burned. But, people have blamed changing time slots as much as anything for shows dying early, and that might put an already at-risk show in even more trouble.
Jay's Movie Blog - A movie-viewing diary.
Transplanted Life: Sci-fi soap opera about a man placed in a new body, updated two or three times a week.
Trading Post Inn - Another gender-bending soap, with different collaborators writing different points of view.

"What? Since when was this an energy...


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