WKRP...Complete Series Coming Soon! (See Post #109) (1 Viewer)

[HenryDuBrow]

That scene with Fever and Carlson is great. Such a superb show that deserves the best possible treatment. Incidentally, wonder if Waters or Gilmour are WKRP fans...

 

[derosa]

That scene with Fever and Carlson is great. Such a superb show that deserves the best possible treatment. Incidentally, wonder if Waters or Gilmour are WKRP fans...

 

[HenryDuBrow]

Love it!

 

[jimmyjet]

Thanks for the explanation, Kevin. As a music fanatic, I've been buying foreign box sets (particularly Bear Family) on American singers forever. I had always heard it was easier/cheaper to license overseas in many cases. I guess that applies to DVD/Blu as well.

hey ron,

i have over 100 bear sets !!

i know for a fact that they license a number of sets at one time. some go oop. but then usually come back later, when a new deal gets struck.

 

[jimmyjet]

I just finished watching the show on Antenna TV and I got angry all over again at what has happened with a possible DVD release of it. I hadn't seen it for awhile and I forgot what a great show it is. I remember watching it first run from the pilot on. Pardon the childish sounding diatribe, but I'm way tired of this music rights preventing release crap. I release everything is a business, but things have gotten ridiculous. Felix Unger hums a few bars of a song nobody even remembers and it has to be replaced due to rights problems. Are you freakin kidding me? Further Maude releases are unreleased due to music rights. What? Somebody is overcharging Sony for a tiny handful of songs heard during the entire run. Sunset Strip and Hawaiian Eye are held up cause some moron wants too much money for a bunch of nightclub covers of standards anyone under 70 doesn't even remember. I'm truly tired of it. We classic TV fans pay the price because owners to the rights of obsolete archiaic music are so greedy. That's just flat not right.

Rant complete...

hi frank,

dont let it upset you too much. you will get most of the shows that you want. both sides will eventually work out deals, so that each can make some money.

we just saw this with the wonder years.

there may be a few holdouts with each show, but a 90% clearance rate is phenomenal.

there are many winners and a few losers.

the replacement of music is one thing, but the editing of the dialog is a whole other issue - at least for you guys with wkrp.

plus, most of these good shows stand fine without the music.

as long as the replacement makes sense.

any business model that puts a dollar worth to their song is a horrible failure, from a reality standpoint.

a realistic worth of the song is to ascertain how much said song can bring in.

if said song is in a mediocre tv show that is only gonna garner in some sales, the measure of the song's worth is based solely on that revenue.

the same song in a hit show that will make a lot more has more worth in that show.

a flat fee for a song is totally out of whack.

and i dont buy the argument for a second that it brings down the value of the song in other circles. that isnt how capitalism works.

the music rights holders also better take a stern look at just how important their song is to the worth of the show.

music is a rather small part of the overall picture. not miniscule, but certainly nowhere close to the video portion of it.

for example, one of the scenes that i posted from the wonder years was really neat, with kevin and winnie dancing to a very nice romantic song.

but the truth of the matter is that i could pick 100+ other songs that are equally romantic, and equally nice.

and to be honest, i would never know that the music had even been replaced, upon second watching.

so while i would prefer to keep the show totally original, the only real losers are the music holdouts.

the message that the wonder years displays is still the same, because of the writing, acting, etc.

 

[Sky Captain]

A good example of how ridiculous these rights (music and otherwise) issues have gotten is Adventures In Paradise. Reportedly the Michener estate is asking too much money for the rights. Do these people have such inflated egos that they really think a distributor is going to pay them a gigantic amount of money for a show 95 percent of the public doesn't even remember let alone care about? Other than us, the niche market, who would buy it enough to garner a profit for them? A distributor would be completely stupid to pay an inflated price for a show like that. So instead of charging a reasonable price for the rights and taking the money and run, Micheners heirs want to play hardball and get nothing for the show. Stupidity. End result - We never get a chance to see the show again.

I just finished watching the show on Antenna TV and I got angry all over again at what has happened with a possible DVD release of it. I hadn't seen it for awhile and I forgot what a great show it is. I remember watching it first run from the pilot on. Pardon the childish sounding diatribe, but I'm way tired of this music rights preventing release crap. I release everything is a business, but things have gotten ridiculous. Felix Unger hums a few bars of a song nobody even remembers and it has to be replaced due to rights problems. Are you freakin kidding me? Further Maude releases are unreleased due to music rights. What? Somebody is overcharging Sony for a tiny handful of songs heard during the entire run. Sunset Strip and Hawaiian Eye are held up cause some moron wants too much money for a bunch of nightclub covers of standards anyone under 70 doesn't even remember. I'm truly tired of it. We classic TV fans pay the price because owners to the rights of obsolete archiaic music are so greedy. That's just flat not right.

Rant complete...

A good example of how ridiculous these rights (music and otherwise) issues have gotten is Adventures In Paradise. Reportedly the Michener estate is asking too much money for the rights. Do these people have such inflated egos that they really think a distributor is going to pay them a gigantic amount of money for a show 95 percent of the public doesn't even remember let alone care about? Other than us, the niche market, who would buy it enough to garner a profit for them? A distributor would be completely stupid to pay an inflated price for a show like that. So instead of charging a reasonable price for the rights and taking the money and run, Micheners heirs want to play hardball and get nothing for the show. Stupidity. End result - We never get a chance to see the show again.

Good to see somebody getting pissed off at the rights holders of the music of these TV shows and not the hapless video companies releasing the shows on DVD. Those people are the true culprits.

 

[Sky Captain]

IIRC, WKRP had Led Zeppelin's "Stairway to Heaven" originally, but now you can't license that song at any price.

So did SCTV, in a skit called 'Stairways To Heaven' about a compilation LP composed of covers of Stairway To Heaven by artists as varied as Buffy Saint Marie to Rich Little. You can see the skit when the episode with the skit is rerun on TV, but the surviving members of the band have made it impossible to see it on DVD, so Second City Entertainment had to leave it off of the DVD. Sad.

Here's the original skit:

SCTV Stairways To Heaven

 

[younger1968]

There are so many good episode, like the fish story or turkey drop or other episodes. I have S1 and love it despite the issues!!

 

[Brian Himes]

Ok, I've been following this and the Wonder Years discussion for quite a while. So, I'm going to chime in here .

the replacement of music is one thing, but the editing of the dialog is a whole other issue - at least for you guys with wkrp.

And there lies the problem with any potential release of WKRP. The audio and video components for this show are not separate (The Wonder Years was shot on film but completed on video tape so it sounds like the audio and video portions are separate and therefore easier to edit). The show was shot on video tape. So, there is no way to remove the music from any given scene without removing the entire audio portion of said scene. Therefore, in order to do the release properly, the DVD producers would either have to get the original cast to re-record their dialogue so it could be re-inserted into the scene with new music or hire voice actors to mimic the original actors voices and record the dialogue. Then if there are any sound effects (bells, paper shuffling, etc) or foley work, all of that would have to be re-recorded and put back into the scene. All of which is going to cost money. Then if the dialogue revolves around the original song in a scene (like Pink Floyd's Dogs) then whole new dialogue will need to be written and then recorded. Again, either by the original cast or voice actors. More money added to the bottom line for the writers of the new dialogue.

Therefore, in my opinion, the only way for WKRP to really work on DVD is for 100% of the music to be included. There is just no cost effective way to eliminate it from the show. Unless they edit out entire scenes from the show, which as has been proven time and again, does not sit well with fans. Virtually every scene that takes place at the radio station contains music. Remember those speakers hanging on the wall in the lobby, the bull pit, Carlson's office and several other places throughout the station? Those speakers were always playing what ever was supposed to be being broadcast over the radio at that time. Most of the time it was music. Lose all of those scenes and there won't be any show left.

Considiering all of the above, I am still not convinced that WKRP will ever get released on DVD at any cost. Inspite of your whole Polyanna view, which I find admirable, that eventually everything will get worked out, is just not realistic. At least when it comes to WKRP. Continuing to compare this with the annoucement of The Wonder Years coming simply doesn't work. Which by the way, at this moment we don't know exactly how much, of the original music has been cleared. It has been stated that 'virtually' all of the music has been cleared. So at the moment we don't know what 'virtually' means. However, a fans view of how much music is 'virtually' and a studio's view of how much music is 'virtually' are probably going to be slightly different. The two shows are two different animals. What may work for one is certainly not going to work for the other by the shear nature of how the shows were originally produced.

 

[Vahan_Nisanain]

Repeating my post from a page before:

Rather than going back and redubbing some of the original dialogue, why couldn't they just drown it out with the replaced music, like Game Show Network did on some episodes of The Newlywed Game?

Someone, please answer this question. I tried asking it, but my post got lost in the shuffle.

 

[MishaLauenstein]

Why can't they just LEAVE the original dialogue?

No one knows most of these songs anyway, so who are they going out of their way to fool? People who are already annoyed because the song they want isn't there.

Just replace the music and leave the original dialogue.

 

[derosa]

Just replace the music and leave the original dialogue.

As was explained above, the show is shot on video tape so there is only
one single audio track that cannot be separated into various parts.
In order to replace the music, all the audio has to be replaced.

If you're making a cake, and you've mixed the eggs into the flour,
you can't easily take them out.

 

[Vahan_Nisanain]

But what about drowning out the original audio, like GSN did with Newlywed Game reruns?

 

[LeoA]

You'd drown out the voices, too. Who wants a show where you can't even hear much of the dialogue because it's drowned out?

 

[Frank Soyke]

Ok, I've been following this and the Wonder Years discussion for quite a while. So, I'm going to chime in here .


And there lies the problem with any potential release of WKRP. The audio and video components for this show are not separate (The Wonder Years was shot on film but completed on video tape so it sounds like the audio and video portions are separate and therefore easier to edit). The show was shot on video tape. So, there is no way to remove the music from any given scene without removing the entire audio portion of said scene. Therefore, in order to do the release properly, the DVD producers would either have to get the original cast to re-record their dialogue so it could be re-inserted into the scene with new music or hire voice actors to mimic the original actors voices and record the dialogue. Then if there are any sound effects (bells, paper shuffling, etc) or foley work, all of that would have to be re-recorded and put back into the scene. All of which is going to cost money. Then if the dialogue revolves around the original song in a scene (like Pink Floyd's Dogs) then whole new dialogue will need to be written and then recorded. Again, either by the original cast or voice actors. More money added to the bottom line for the writers of the new dialogue.

Therefore, in my opinion, the only way for WKRP to really work on DVD is for 100% of the music to be included. There is just no cost effective way to eliminate it from the show. Unless they edit out entire scenes from the show, which as has been proven time and again, does not sit well with fans. Virtually every scene that takes place at the radio station contains music. Remember those speakers hanging on the wall in the lobby, the bull pit, Carlson's office and several other places throughout the station? Those speakers were always playing what ever was supposed to be being broadcast over the radio at that time. Most of the time it was music. Lose all of those scenes and there won't be any show left.

Considiering all of the above, I am still not convinced that WKRP will ever get released on DVD at any cost. Inspite of your whole Polyanna view, which I find admirable, that eventually everything will get worked out, is just not realistic. At least when it comes to WKRP. Continuing to compare this with the annoucement of The Wonder Years coming simply doesn't work. Which by the way, at this moment we don't know exactly how much, of the original music has been cleared. It has been stated that 'virtually' all of the music has been cleared. So at the moment we don't know what 'virtually' means. However, a fans view of how much music is 'virtually' and a studio's view of how much music is 'virtually' are probably going to be slightly different. The two shows are two different animals. What may work for one is certainly not going to work for the other by the shear nature of how the shows were originally produced.

As much as I love the show, I tend to agree. The main difference between WKRP and the Wonder Years is that great sales for the latter are almost a guaranteed slam dunk It is almost certain to recoup the massive investment Time-Life must have put in to license all that music. It's an iconic show that people have been clamoring for many years
WKRP, on the other hand is a different story. Certainly the music licensing costs would be comparable due to the volume of music in the show, but projected sales IMO wouldn't even be in the same ballpark. Sure WKRP was a very popular show in it's time, but it is more than 35 years old and most people under 40 aren't real familiar with the show anymore so I'm wondering if distributors might shy away from paying all that money for the music when sales have a decent chance of falling flat. It's a shame, but it is a business.

 

[jimmyjet]

dont give up hope.

there is one thing that this show seems to have, and that is intense support from those that do like it.

which is exactly what star trek had, and look what happened with that show !!

 

[Frank Soyke]

dont give up hope.

there is one thing that this show seems to have, and that is intense support from those that do like it.

which is exactly what star trek had, and look what happened with that show !!

Jimmy, while I really admire your optimism, Comparing WKRP to Star Trek????? C'mon man. Forget about not being in the same ballpark, that ain't even the same sport. I love WKRP but there is no comparison there.

 

[jimmyjet]

LOL - just remember that star trek was not a hit show during its original run.

it took literally years of lobbying to get the studios to come out with anything about it.

if i recall, it was a movie of most of the original cast ?

people living today think of star trek as some monumental amount of tv. and it is, TODAY.

it wasnt for a long time.

so back then, if i had made the comment about star trek being liked by an intense support, and gave an example of some other big hit show -

you would have told me the same thing - star trek aint like that big hit show !!

 

[jimmyjet]

i have to chuckle - lots of you guys are just like an older friend of mine.

you dont want to be encouraged, cuz you are afraid of being disappointed.

so you play this rationalizing game of how nothing is gonna turn out well.

which is supposed to lower your expectations, keeping you from being disappointed.

and then be ecstatic when the show comes out !!

now be honest with me - am i hitting pretty close to home plate ??

 

[smithbrad]

LOL - just remember that star trek was not a hit show during its original run.

it took literally years of lobbying to get the studios to come out with anything about it.

if i recall, it was a movie of most of the original cast ?

people living today think of star trek as some monumental amount of tv. and it is, TODAY.

it wasnt for a long time.

so back then, if i had made the comment about star trek being liked by an intense support, and gave an example of some other big hit show -

you would have told me the same thing - star trek aint like that big hit show !!

Actually, if you look a bit closer to the details you will see the comparison still does not qualify. WKRP while a successful show during its original run and in syndication has only spawned one failed spin-off attempt that occurred in 1991. It's original run was 30+ years ago.

When Star Trek TOS went off the air in 1968 it only took 11 years for the demand from syndication to be great enough to generate the response of a theatrical movie. In that same 30+ years timeframe Star Trek has responded to consumer demand with nine theatrical movies, three successful prime-time spin-off series, and an animated series. Not to forget all the merchandising and VHS, DVD, and now Blu-ray releases. It also includes another spin-off series after that period of time.

So while WKRP has maintained a good following and been successful in syndication, it has not proven to be in the same league as the accomplishments of the Star trek franchise.