Scott Atwell Star Trek Discussion thread (Series and Films) (1 Viewer)

[Nelson Au]

Oh man, that stupid spell check! I meant to write human physiology and not psychology! I was thinking of Gunsmoke as you said Roddenbery does cite it as a model for some of the characters. I made an assumption it might be common amongst other series to include a leading lady. More then likely, it's an audience broadening move. Interesting thinking about the food dispensers, I had not thought that thoroughly how it was physically done in TOS. What you suggest, sort of like a fancy vending machine that makes your meal for you, makes sense! I think I've seen things like that happening in Japan. Speaking of fake rabbits in waistcoats, I just happen to accidentally tune into ABC tonight and caught a few seconds of Once Upon A Time in Wonderland and a pretty scruffy looking CGI rabbit! The CGI wasn't super top notch, it was not bad, but not great. It just seemed a wild coincidence since we discussed Shore Leave!

 

[FanCollector]

A fancy vending machine is EXACTLY what I was describing! Perfect summation. Which also clarifies how the tribbles could end up coming out as they did.Don't be discouraged...someday ABC Studios will redo all the effects for new discs of Once Upon a Time in Wonderland and the rabbit will look great. Is it my question? I was out and about all day today, but I will come up with one for tomorrow.

 

[Nelson Au]

Yes Lee, it's your move. I read through The Squire of Gothos and Arena chapters. There wasn't too much in terms of surprises. The main bits that were news to me was Justman warning against using the orange environmental suits from The Naked Time! I can see their dislike of them visually, but they were unique at the time and I'm sure no one had any kinds of ideas to be able to do a suit economically. The other part that caught my attention was Stan Robertson's dislike for the ending. I'm glad Coon ignored that one bit of input! Maybe I've seen this episode too many times, but I guess it wasn't the ironic ending to me anymore, though I can remember the day I was old enough to get it, that I really thought that was a cool ending.I was expecting more to he made of Roddy McDowall's audition. And the business of the failed optical effects of Kirk slicing through Trelane with his saber was cut and I didn't know that! The final result was actually fine. And the business of the french wig has been discussed before, but it was fun to read it here.The big news about Arena was the introduction of Joseph Pevney. He was quite the slave driver it sounds! But not in a bad way in the way Finnerman recounts their meeting. It's interesting how he and Marc Daniels were such pros and were able to push these episodes along and get the job done and get everyone home early.The description of how everyone was pleased with Coon's idea for Arena and then learning he had accidentally copied Fredric Brown's story is known, but it was fun to read how he dealt with it. It's interesting that the Kellam research feedback was that they couldn't do the sudden stop while at warp speed. That makes a lot of sense, but it was fun to see visually. And then they warned about the viability of a canon made of a bamboo shaft being able to contain the explosion without reinforcement. So that was cool to read as we do see Kirk wrap it with twine, but I like that Coon still had it blow apart. The chapter also confirms, Vic Perrin was selected because he was the Control Voice! I might have to find time this weekend to watch both Squire and Arena!

 

[Nelson Au]

Well, a few more random thoughts. I did watch The Squire of Gothos today. I paid closer attention to William Campbell's performance and to the set design of Trelane's drawing room. I haventonagree, that's a pretty great set and Matt Jeffries should be proud! I could see that Campbell's performance was ranging to close to menacing to the child like wonderment upon meeting Kirk and his crew and in playing with them. His line about it being his game and his rules was really nicely done. I can see the child in the character. I also had a listen to The Empath. There is the speech at the end where Kirk argues that the Vian's have lost the ability for compassion and were only intellect. That's a fine Kirk speech. But I forgot about what the Vian's said about humans. And I found that to be a very powerful commentary for 1968. They argue that no other species has the qualities that humans have, the will to survive, the love of life, the passion to know. And the willingness to give their life for others. That Kirk and Spock and McCoy were Gem's teachers. This is great stuff that goes back to the first season. With the turbulence of the 1960's and the uncertainty of nuclear war, mankind can rise above all that.

 

[Ockeghem]

Nelson,I too love the speech of the Vians. Another wonderful dialogue is the one between Hodin and Kirk in The Mark Of Gideon. I especially like what Hodin says with regard to his/their beliefs on life in all of its forms.

We watched Space Seed again today (on the heels of the new film) so that our youngest children would have some context. They were quite captivated by the story of Space Seed. We'll be watching The Wrath Of Khan tomorrow.

 

[Nelson Au]

Scott, I'll be curious which version of Khan your kids liked! It's great they found Space Seed captivating.

 

[FanCollector]

I am inspired to say a lot about the last few posts, but a little pressed for time at the moment. But there will be responses! (Fair warning...)Triviawise...can you name all the instances in which someone besides Dr. McCoy uses the small medical scanner (nee salt shaker)?

 

[Ockeghem]

Lee,How about Dr. M'Benga and Nurse Chapel for starters?

 

[FanCollector]

In which episode(s)?

 

[Nelson Au]

Lee, I'll be looking forward to your thoughts about the last few posts. I have to add that after I made my post about the Vians, I realized what the Vians appreciate about humans are what the Metrons find interesting too, but they had a problem with our half savage nature. I already read a few pages into the Alternative Factor chapter, now that's becoming more interesting to see how that story really started out as and then became so watered down, it totally lost its flavor. I only read up to the part where Coon removed the entire Masters subplot of her love affair and I can see how Roddenberry felt they had to do that kind of thing once, either here or Space Seed. I think they choose wisely, to quote the Knight in The Last Crusade. It worked much better in Space Seed.In regards to trivia, I have to be the ultra prop nerd here. The salt shakers were used as McCoy's operating tools, so do you mean his scanner with the spinning thing inside?

And here is a salt shaker, a real Danish salt and pepper shaker that is shown in the images below as in the series and the ones the prop guys got off ebay for the New Voyages efforts. I've been meaning to trying to get a set myself, but leaving them unpainted with the green and red as they are originally wood in those areas.

 

[Ockeghem]

In which episode(s)?

Lee,I have no idea. Just offering some guesses.

 

[Nelson Au]

Well, if it's the scanner with the spinning thing, Spock uses it often, once in Elaan of Troyius when he was scanning Elaan's necklace. In The Empath, Spock uses it to check McCoy after the Vians had tortured him.

 

[FanCollector]

Reading Stan Robertson's memos from NBC has been one of the most interesting opportunities offered by the Cushman book. On the one hand, his ideas are clearly serious and meant well. Sometimes he even makes legitimate story points. On the other hand, he seems very wary of anything out of the ordinary; he wants action, always heroic characters, and very direct storytelling. Star Trek had a lot of those things anyway, but he seemed insistent on avoiding any deviations. His misgivings about The Squire of Gothos just seem so bizarre. I know we have seen the finished product and that colors our interpretation, but even before the episode was made...what would be the point of the story without the ending? It would be a dull supervillain story, and how would Kirk get out of it anyway? I wonder if the fact that the script was delayed in getting to Robertson changed the nature of his response. If he had no serious complaints about the script, then it would beg the question of whether he really had anything to contribute in the first place. (I reread his memos on this one, and I was struck by his use of the phrase "what WE are trying to say." He clearly felt like a major partner.)I have written about the levels of Campbell's performance before. I really can't imagine a better one. Good for Gene Coon in believing he could do it. (Incidentally, I don't think Cushman spent much time on Roddy McDowall because it was just a casting idea. I can't imagine McDowall would have had to read for a guest spot on Star Trek in 1966. If they wanted him, it would just have been an offer without an audition, so he probably never even knew he was under consideration.) Totally agree about Trelane's drawing room. It's impressive and also completely in character.The ending of The Empath is what I consider a glorious exception. Generally, having Kirk's eloquence alone be the means of solving a problem would seem like a cheat. But in that episode, it makes sense and works beautifully. Kirk listens to the Vians' speech that you mentioned and when he realizes they are not villains, but rather humanitarians who have lost perspective, he uses his oratorical skill to save McCoy. It isn't something that would have worked often, but it was just right in The Empath. As for the Vians' assessment of Kirk, Spock, and McCoy, it shows the line the series had to walk in making the heroes representative of humanity but also exceptional specimens. In a sense, the script suggests that humans are Linke and Ozaba, but deep down, if we work to find them in ourselves, we can be Kirk, Spock, and McCoy. What's even better about the episode is that all the allegory and symbolism is played out without ever sacrificing characterization. Kirk and the others remain individuals while simultaneously standing in for human potential.Scott, I remember first seeing Space Seed in 1982, knowing that the movie sequel was coming out shortly after. It would have been even better seeing it without knowing the sequel was coming, as your daughter has just experienced. How did she enjoy it?Speaking of which, Nelson, I think Coon was right to favor Space Seed over The Alternative Factor regarding the betrayal of the crewwoman, but I do wish they had found an acceptable replacement for The Alternative Factor, just to add another layer to the story.Yes, I meant the motorized medical scanner. Was that not a different salt shaker also? Now I'm glad I asked the question. I learned something too.

 

[FanCollector]

Yes to both of those examples, Nelson.

 

[Ockeghem]

Lee,It just dawned on me that to prove I might be correct you wanted me to name the episodes. Sorry about that. How about M'Benga in A Private Little War and Nurse Chapel in Elaan Of Troyius? (Nelson already named the latter example above.) Also, didn't Dr. Wallace use it in The Deadly Years? I think that Henoch uses it as well in Return To Tomorrow, Dr. Daystrom uses it in The Ultimate Computer, and Spock uses it in Assignment: Earth.

 

[FanCollector]

Well, you guys made short work of what I thought was a hard one! Six for Scott, two for Nelson, and I have one more answer. (Scott, I credited you for Elaan of Troyius also since you correctly named a second character who used it.)

 

[Ockeghem]

Lee,

When I gave that answer, I didn't even realize that I had named another (different) character who used it in Elaan Of Troyius. That would have made for a very difficult question (i.e., episodes in which more than one character -- excluding Bones -- used the salt shaker).

 

[Nelson Au]

Hey guys, nice job Scott!

Not to take any credit away from Scott, but the scanner that Daystrom uses while in Engineering to scan M5 is actually a different prop! its similarly shaped but has a flashing light in it. Sorry to be so nickpick-idy!

 

[FanCollector]

You're right! Is that the same one in Assignment: Earth?

 

[Nelson Au]

Lee, if you are referring to me, I just had a quick look at Assignment: Earth, and Spock is using the same scanner that Daystrom used with the flashing light!