Option B... PB2-Ultra (1 Viewer)

[steve nn]

In going back over Edward J M review, I see the extra extension I am experiencing is to be pretty much expected. In the past there has been no EQ applied with my QSC amp running the Three 25-31CS+ config, so room boundary support was the extent of it.

>>>Due to room gain, the standard 25 Hz tune provides excellent in-room extension to about 20 Hz. The 25 Hz tune is my preference for most music (except pipe organ) with easy to follow bass lines and a natural, effortless character. The 25 Hz tune doesn't provide the absolute deepest extension, but it does offer maximum output capability and is recommended for large rooms and/or very high playback levels on DVD.

 

[Craig Chase]

Steve - Cool stuff on the new subwoofer. It looks like another guy prefers the "Ultra" driver's sound over the "Plus" sound.

Perhaps one of these days I will have to try a blind test with a PB2-Ultra and the Maestro...

Ron - I bet it would be a hellofa test...

 

[steve nn]

Perhaps one of these days I will have to try a blind test with a PB2-Ultra and the Maestro...
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Now that would be fun Craig! Are you sure your up for that though? Indeed it would be very interesting with all accepted supporting measurements and graphs of course.

>>>It looks like another guy prefers the "Ultra" driver's sound over the "Plus" sound.

 

[Craig Chase]

Steve, Between Home theater Forum and Home Theater SPot, I have yet to read where one guy has gotten his "Ultra" and not noticed an improvement over the previous "Plus" driver.

We all look to get more performance in our systems, and yes, I have heard a subtle difference in the "percussive" ability when changing from the "Plus" driver to the "Maestro" I am using now.

The *feeling* I get from my experience SEEMS to be very similar to what a lot of guys experience with the "Ultra" driver.

I am also speaker from two year's experience with the plus driver, in a total of 7 different subwoofers.

But for some reason, some people can comment on this, while others are not permitted. My sole purpose is total curiosity... AND the belief that SVS is a darn good company. In my opinion, There was a REASON the Ultra driver was introduced... To give the "total audiophile" a reason to look hard at SVS.

Just last week, I got into a pretty polite "PM" exchange with a gent on AVS who had stated "No SVS is actually built for the serious audiophile" ... Rather than tackle it publicly (sure to get a thread delete) ... we talked via PM... and it was quite polite. Hopefully this gent WILL try an "Ultra" series.

It appears from all the posts that I have read the the PB-2 Ultra competes with the likes of the DD-18, Thiel SW series, the Maestro, and other high end subs...

 

[steve nn]

"percussive" ability
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I like that term Craig. Mind if I use it in the future?

>>>But for some reason, some people can comment on this, while others are not permitted.>Just last week, I got into a pretty polite "PM" exchange with a gent on AVS who had stated "No SVS is actually built for the serious audiophile" ... Rather than tackle it publicly (sure to get a thread delete) ... we talked via PM... and it was quite polite. Hopefully this gent WILL try an "Ultra" series.It appears from all the posts that I have read the the PB-2 Ultra competes with the likes of the DD-18, Thiel SW series, the Maestro, and other high end subs...

 

[Tom Vodhanel]

>>>Cant say I hold to the belief that it takes a TV-12 Ultra driver to achieve serious audiophile performance

 

[steve nn]

Hi Tom. I appreciate your input. I noticed when you cut and pasted, you did not get my next statement.

>>>(Cant say I hold to the belief that it takes a TV-12 Ultra driver to achieve serious audiophile performance (I am a big fan of the dB 12 driver also)

 

[frank manrique]

I believe that every SVS subwoofer model, including their new 'lil fellow, is far more than suitably adept for "high-end" audiophile applications...TV-12 driver or not.
Why? Because they all created to be as accurate subbass reproducers as possible, unlike a great, great number of "high-end" subwoofer-wannabes.

I also believe that it is highly doubtful that engineers like Mike, et al, design subbass systems (like the Maestro) with the sole intention of catering to the high-end audiophile community exclusively as they seem to be more concerned with the design and manufacturing of reasonably accurate transducers, unlike "true" high-end speaker and subwoofer manufacturers who indeed prefer to exclusively cater to the sort of consumer who pledge blind undying loyalty to the high-end audiophile tenet...

-THTS

"...hi, my name is Frank...and am a hi-fi aficionado and not an audiophile!..."

 

[Tom Vodhanel]

Hi Steve,Frank.

No offense taken or intended.. I should have included your entire sentence, sorry about that.

By my definition, the "audiophile" is one looking to enjoy maximum audio performance at a given price point. If anyone tries to imply that a real audiophile wouldn't consider a ISD based, dB12 based or PB10 subwoofer...I believe they are very mistaken.

Tom V.
SVS

 

[steve nn]

>>>>>>I also believe that it is highly doubtful that engineers like Mike, et al, design subbass systems (like the Maestro) with the sole intention of catering to the high-end audiophile community exclusively as they seem to be more concerned with the design and manufacturing of reasonably accurate transducers, unlike "true" high-end speaker and subwoofer manufacturers who indeed prefer to exclusively cater to the sort of consumer who pledge blind undying loyalty to the high-end audiophile tenet

 

[Tom Vodhanel]

>>>That was my reply to Craig concerning and you most certainly know I have the PB10-ISD on order. So I am just a little miffed if you guys are talking to me or are you talking to Craig? I keep seeing Steve though. Did I post my thoughts backwards?

 

[steve nn]

I understand Tom. I really do and tried to let you know a few posts back. I just felt like I possibly was being misunderstood but thats not the case at all. Like I said.

While I have your attention Tom, Has my ISD shipped yet?? Come on now.

 

[frank manrique]

quote:
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Sure Frank. One thing I wouldn't mind you clarifying though is why are you telling me your thoughts on the issue. I stated my thoughts prior...
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Steve,

My intention in posting was to comment about the prevailing issue in a genetic or general sense; it wasn't aimed at you, Tom, or anybody else in particular.

To reflect that fact I've edited the portion of my previous post in which you became the primary focus...

-THTS

"...hi, my name is Frank...and am an SVS bassaholic..."

 

[steve nn]

Thanks Frank. I went ahead and did the same. It's really not that big of a concern, but admittedly I wouldn't want my true opinion mis-stated. Communicating over the internet can be a bit tricky at times would you not agree?

On the lighter side> I Have had the chance to do much more listening with the PB12-Ultra/2 tonight. What comes to mind is this is the most behaved sub I have ever had. Very easy to dial in and exhibits allot of leeway in my listening environment. All my other SVS products have been absolutely stellar/audiophile imo but this PB12-Ultra/2 rises like cream in a gallon of fresh farm milk.

 

[terence]

Damn! Now that is something! Steve you are really peaking my intrest....STOP it! That's all i need is start sub/s upgrade thing all over again.

 

[steve nn]

That's all i need is start sub/s upgrade thing all over again.

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Well you know it's bound to happen Terence. You knew the risk you were taking when you started this endeavor. I remember way back when,- when I thought a little HTiB would have been great with a extra Sony WM-40. The thing is it appears as though SVS will be coming up with plenty more this next year. From the looks of their News Page we might be hearing something official next week??? Time is on your side buddy. I Really like what you have going for you now though.

 

[frank manrique]

quote:
__________________________________________________ _______

Communicating over the internet can be a bit tricky at times would you not agree?
__________________________________________________ _______

And how!...

-THTS

"...hi, my name is Frank...and am an SVS bassaholic..."

 

[steve nn]

And how!...
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I hear, I mean see/understand your words and expression.

If you happen to make it back over Frank. I see Ed's review is getting ready to post on the PB10-ISD. You have spoken in the past about possibly picking one up and adding it to your No.2 Theater. Is the likelihood of that happening growing? It would be fun to see you add it to your repertoire. I have a spare corner in the main next to seating that will do very nicely as a second option.

 

[Matt G.]

Here are some thoughts I posted over on the HT SPOT about my new PB2-Ultra last week:

Last night was the first night I had to spend some quality time with my new PB2-Ultra since I received it on Monday. Besides basic calibration, I have not adjusted the PEQ yet. I ordered the Rives Audio Test CD 2 yesterday (which has tones pre-calibrated for the Radio Shack SPL meter) and I will adjust the PEQ when I get that. I spent the last two days moving the thing around and trying to improve the null I have at my listening position (which didn't happen). I ended up putting it in the same place my PB2+ was: The right front corner a few feet away from my right Rocket 750. I was tired of fooling around with it and last night I had a few hours to myself and decided I would just wait for my new calibration CD to come in before I dove back into FR hell again...that, my freinds is not a fun part of this HT hobby we have (not for me, at least).

I spent about 3 hours listening to some music: about an hour of Tool, most of Eagles Hell Freezes over (DTS) and a few cuts on the Led Zeppelin DVD...at very loud levels (-10 to -5 under reference). It was nice to just throw in some music and forget about the response curve for a while. After living with the PB2+ for about 4 months, I had a pretty good idea of what SVS bass sounds like and pushed it to it's limits as often as I could. That is one hell of a sub for those who have not heard it...for those who have one, rest assured, you are not giving up much to the Ultra, although you can call me subjective, but there are differences in the sound of the two drivers at high volume levels (which shouldn't be surprising considering the design goals of the Ultra driver).

When the PB2+ was pushed to its limits, it would call attention to itself. You would get more of a boomy sound (still amazing, however) that I tried to avoid. When I played music on the PB2+, I tried finding that "edge" on each CD (and sometimes on tracks within a CD) where I could push it without sounding boomy or oppressive by adjusting the gain. I never turned the gain on the PB2+ much over 1/4 on the dial...never had to.

The Ultra is different…I adjusted it hot (maybe +5dB) before I started listening to music and left it there all night. That was a first. I never found myself getting up and turning down the gain slightly when the bass called attention to itself. For the first hour or so, I found myself thinking “dead center anchor” was a good way to describe the sound. The PB2+ was always seamless, but the Ultra is even more refined when blending in with my Rockets. It was like the sub was not there at all and I had forgotten all about it after a while (if you can imagine that)…just dead solid low end that makes you feel like you upgraded your entire setup, not just the bass. That’s a nice feeling. Those who think a big sub is not suited for music haven’t heard a PB2 (any model will do) yet…have you?

After the first couple of nights of fretting with the response curve, I have to be honest, I was starting to feel some buyer’s remorse in giving up my PB2+ for the new PB2-Ultra. I loved that sub very much, and started wondering if I had made the right decision knowing what I had before and paying the premium to have SVS’s best. Last night made me a believer in the Ultra, however. I look forward to continue to explore its limits. As some have said: “worth every penny…”. Add me to that list.

 

[Kevin C Brown]

Matt- Good stuff.