I'm such a noob... (1 Viewer)

[Drmrforman]

Will shortly be maintaining a 2nd location in a smallish apartment. I want to buy adequate but not overwhelming equipment and at the component level I'm looking at I don't find price to be the issue. The issue is trying to ascertain if the parts will work together well. I have decided on a Sony Bravia KDL 46X850 TV and am considering either the Sony BDP-S760 or OPPO BDP-93. If I get a receiver, I am thinking of the Marantz 1603. I plan to "settle" for a soundbar for this space and they all look unexceptionally different so far.
So these questions occur to me:
1) Do I even need an A/V receiver? Or will this setup perform well enough with just TV/BDP/sound bar?
2) It appears that CC will not be available on cable TV channels using HDMI connections. What are the workarounds using non-HDMI connections?
3) To my unsophisticated eye, it appears that some of the higher end soundbars may make an A/V receiver unnecessary. Am I correct? Can you recommend any of that nature?
4) I will really need remote headsets if I can't get CC; it's a small apartment and I want to be a good neighbor! Should I be satIsfied with optical or older hookups, or are there some using HDMI connection?
5) Is anyone aware of incompatibilites between the items I'm considering? Or do you have other recommendations in similar areas that you know work?
6) Please recommend some sites which will show me details about how to string wires/cables between components.
Thanks

 

[Steve Tannehill]

Hi, Mary, welcome to HTF!
I'm not sure how to answer some of your questions, but I'm sure someone will come around and chime in.
1) Some sound bars (like the Polk SurroundBar I have) require A/V receivers. Some do not, they are amplified.
2) Closed Captions (that's CC, right?) are generated by my cable set top box, although I use component video connections on it. I'll try my other HDMI set top box and see what it does.
3) Some sound bars are amplified. I have no experience with them.
4) I'm not sure what you mean by optical or other hookups....headphones require a headphone jack, which is typically provided on an A/V receiver. There are corded and cordless headphones. They use a 1/4 inch stereo plug, not HDMI.
5) Don't know
6) Ask away...the people here are very resourceful.

 

[gene c]

3) You are correct. The proper amlified soundbar will not require a receiver. I don't know much about soundbars either. Sounds like you need one good enough to be used without a sub ($$$). Maybe this will help http://www.crutchfield.com/App/Learn/Article/Menu.aspx?g=316150&tp=47370
4) An optical connection will perform exactly as an HDMI for audio from a cable box. The red and white connections will be stereo only.
6) http://www.crutchfield.com/App/Learn/Article/Menu.aspx?c=9&tp=498
If you plan on using headphones then you only need stereo anyway. I know there are fairly good wireless headphones out there.
I think a $500 OPPO dvd player might be a bit much for your situation. Get a decent $150 one and spend the rest on the soundbar and headphones.
I can't beleive you like your neighbors so much that you're willing to for-go (how do you spell that ) a good surround sound system. You're a better person than I am!
More good info http://www.aperionaudio.com/catalog/Home-Theater,45.aspx

 

[schan1269]

1. You will probably want a Yamaha YSP...just pick one. The top two (4100 and 5100 even decode DTD HS-MA/Dolby True HD) have no peer from any other company.
2. CC works no matter what connection...as mandated by the FCC.
3. Redundant question from number 1.
4. Most higher end devices will have 1/8th or 1/4 headphone jacks. If you make sure you buy a soundbar with one...you won't have to mess with "workarounds".
5. Everything works with everything else. As long as you aren't buying some "craptastic throw-away one piece non-upgradeable" HTiB.
6. If you buy the "correct stuff", you will only have 2-3 connections at most. If you buy a Yamaha soundbar, you'll need 3 HDMI...that is it.

 

[Drmrforman]

Casey--I don't want to go through the LED/LCD vs. plasma pros and cons. I mentioned the small space; I feel I am already pushing it with a 46" screen and will not go larger. I was actually hoping to find an acceptable 42" TV but gave up. However, I would be interested in a succinct critique of why you are not a Sony fan.
Gene--I fear I must forego the surround sound due to space awkwardness. On the issue of headphones, I am trying to be nice to my husband: he's an early bird and I'm a nighthawk. I like him a lot better than my neighbors! And should I be inferring from your statement about the Oppo being a "bit much" that the Sony is not going to shine any brighter with this BDP?
Sam--the Yamaha looks great and probably sounds better than it looks. Again, worried about it being too much for room (~8 1/2" tall). And I don't think it has wifi or USB port; you need to hook it to BDP/DVD or CD player to do firmware updates. And you need the updates for 3D per the Crutchfield tech specs. On the CC thing, I also got that from Crutchfield in an article titled "The Ins and Outs of HDMI." Written Jan., 2011, it is probably dated but said:
No closed captions displayed when using HDMI connections
Unfortunately, the HDMI spec doesn't include any requirement for carrying closed captioning data. So, if you connect a video component like an HD cable or satellite receiver or DVD/Blu-ray player to your HDTV using HDMI, you won't see conventional closed captions. If you need to view closed captions from your cable or satellite box, use a component video connection — the closed captions will pass through and you'll still enjoy a high-def picture.
I guess I can therefore assume the CC issue has changed since 1/2011.
I notice no comments on the Marantz so I'm going to assume there are no negatives yet.
Thanks for all your comments. I will continue to consider them.

 

[schan1269]

Ok...
About the CC...
Your TV has internal closed caption...it has had to since, what...1992??? (as far as the CC in the TV. Our Mitsubishi, the CC works on all inputs. It will even CC a BD. The Panasonic will only CC content from OTA and Directv. The Hitachi's internal CC is only set up for its own internal tuner. Regardless, we have Directv and their CC is sent along the HDMI)
If your cable/sat box has CC. Use the CC in your cable/sat box.
And 8 1/2" tall is "too big"?
And which particular model Yamaha was that? They only make like 12 different ones. And last I checked...Yamaha has models with USB that work with Iphone/Ipad/Ipod and Android.

 

[gene c]

On the Marantz, it's a fine receiver with a small cabinet. A bit lower power output (not a biggee) and fewer connections than most full size receivers. Not really a good value compared to some other receivers unless the small size is important (and for you it probably is).
"Forego" didn't look right when I typed it but it does when you did (again, ). Thanks.
Soundbars may not look that different from one another but they are. If you go that route make your choice carefully. A trip to the local brick and morter might be a good idea.
As for the "neighbors" comment I'm glad you threw a husband into the conversation. Have to admit, it's usually the husband who stays up late and has to keep quiet . The times they are a changin'. I've turned into an early bird myself .
You can get many different opinions about specific products. I prefer LCD over Plasma but displays really aren't my thing. My brother Samsung LCD looks great in all situations. My Panasonic plasma (the cheaper model) looks great in HD but horrid in SD.

 

[Drmrforman]

Sam--glad to know your DirectTV sends CC over the HDMI cable. I googled terms HDMI & CC and found lots of people complaining that they were unable to get CC using the HDMI connection, but they all seemed to be before 2012. Without doing an exhaustive search into issue, I am going to assume that the HDMI spec has been upgraded to include carrying CC.
On the Yamaha, Crutchfield carries four soundbar models that I could find, none of whose specs showed any USB, wifi or Ethernet hookups. 8.5 inches may not seem large to you, but I don't want to decorate our small living space with components. I want to have the whole setup be as innocuous as possible. I realize that generally speaking sound quality tracks size, but compromises must be made. The 4100 & 5100 include IPhone/iPod compatibility using a wireless transmitter add-on that does not generate wifi usability.
Frankly, I wish my husband would get into the game and do the work for us. However, he's too busy doing real work (reason why we even need the 2nd living situation) so I am happy to spend the effort.

 

[Steve Schaffer]

Sam--glad to know your DirectTV sends CC over the HDMI cable. I googled terms HDMI & CC and found lots of people complaining that they were unable to get CC using the HDMI connection, but they all seemed to be before 2012. Without doing an exhaustive search into issue, I am going to assume that the HDMI spec has been upgraded to include carrying CC.
On the Yamaha, Crutchfield carries four soundbar models that I could find, none of whose specs showed any USB, wifi or Ethernet hookups. 8.5 inches may not seem large to you, but I don't want to decorate our small living space with components. I want to have the whole setup be as innocuous as possible. I realize that generally speaking sound quality tracks size, but compromises must be made. The 4100 & 5100 include IPhone/iPod compatibility using a wireless transmitter add-on that does not generate wifi usability.
Frankly, I wish my husband would get into the game and do the work for us. However, he's too busy doing real work (reason why we even need the 2nd living situation) so I am happy to spend the effort.

A little clarification on the CC issue:
closed captions cannot be generated by the tv itself from external devices connected via HDMI. HD satellite and cable boxes can generate closed captions and these will be sent out via HDMI. Blu Ray and dvd discs with encoded subtitles will likewise allow transmission of subtitles over HDMI. Some discs, however don't have encoded subtitles but do have CC encoding as used by analog tv stations--these will not be available over HDMI. If the disc has subtitles in the setup menu you're ok, if not you won't get CC. In other words the tv's closed captionning decoder cannot work with HDMI sources, but source devices can send subs or CC generated by the source device via HDMI.

 

[Drmrforman]

Steve S.-- Thanks for the clarification. The text for Crutchfield I quoted in post #6 of this thread made it seem that CC would only be carried from cable box/sat via component video connections. I can't say that I understand your explanation, but I'm going to stop worrying about whether I'll get CC from my HDMI cable to TV connection!

 

[schan1269]

I will further clarify the CC issue...
Mitsubishi equipped their TV's to do CC from everything...HDMI, DVI, component, S-Video and composite. Apparently, they are the only manufacturer who saw fit to do so(the only FCC requirement is the TV's own CC work off the internal tuner)
DVD/BD it is up to each individual "studio" to determine if they want to put CC on their disc(Mitsubishi in allowing their CC to work on all sources gets around this...although...they DO NOT guarantee the accuracy of CCing the TV had to "cobble together"...and by the way...CCing information still has to be "on the source")
Likewise, Panasonic has chosen(on some models) to allow their CCing to work from sat/cable boxes over HDMI(and of course, they make no guarantee it works "accurately").
But, the "set top box" manufacturers are required to have CC in the box anyway(hence why most TV manufacturers choose to not put the effort into making THEIR CCing work on incoming inputs)
As far as I know, there are some games(PS3/Xbox) that have closed captioning...you have to turn on the CC in the PS3 and Xbox(I do know Xbox used to have CC/subtitles off HD-DVD)

 

[schan1269]

Even though this pic isn't very good...
Directv HD-DVR feeding Onkyo TX SR707 feeding Hitachi 42" plasma...all via HDMI
Closed caption in action. The CC was turned on in the Directv HD-DVR.
[ATTACHMENT=340]closedcaption 001.JPG (824k. JPG file)[/ATTACHMENT]

 

[Al.Anderson]

1) Computer systems are generally handled two ways: (1) as computer speakers, sound controlled by the computer, or (2) as a standard surround system with the computer as an input, sound controlled by the receiver/amp.

2) The receiver sends the appropriate band to the speakers, which is configurable. That is you can set the speakers to small or large; large would send the entire frequency band, small would send everything above the defined LFE frequency (typically 80 Hz). Moreover, usually this is tweakable; e.g., the crossover frequency can be set to something other than 80, like 40 or 60, and you can set any specific speaker to whatever you want, like the center to 100 Hz if that's best for that speaker.

And a general comment, it's usually preferred to create a new thread rather than piggy-backing (especially on a very old thread).

 

[JohnRice]

1) Computer systems are generally handled two ways: (1) as computer speakers, sound controlled by the computer, or (2) as a standard surround system with the computer as an input, sound controlled by the receiver/amp.

2) The receiver sends the appropriate band to the speakers, which is configurable. That is you can set the speakers to small or large; large would send the entire frequency band, small would send everything above the defined LFE frequency (typically 80 Hz). Moreover, usually this is tweakable; e.g., the crossover frequency can be set to something other than 80, like 40 or 60, and you can set any specific speaker to whatever you want, like the center to 100 Hz if that's best for that speaker.

And a general comment, it's usually preferred to create a new thread rather than piggy-backing (especially on a very old thread).

I have to admit. I didn't understand the questions.