DVD Review HTF Review: Schindler's List (Highly Recommended!) (2 Viewers)

[PaulEB]

We can argue forever about this, but there are many examples of fine DVD presentations out there. DVD has been around for some time now and it should be pretty clear how to go about putting out a truly special edition of a DVD. Lord of the Rings comes to mind. I believe if Speilberg had used LOTR as an example to go on he could have provided Schindler's List with a package equal or better. My belief is he really does not want to devote a lot of effort to DVD as opposed to Peter Jackson who really cares and goes the extra distance.

I really cared about Schindler's list and was hoping for a really special DVD, but I don't think this DVD is.

 

[Ernest Rister]

"My belief is he really does not want to devote alot of effort to DVD as opposed to Peter Jackson who really cares and goes the extra distance."

Spielberg does not want to devote alot of effort to DVD? And you say this about a DVD with how many 5.1 tracks? With a heartbreaking documentary about the real people whose life stories the film is based on?

Peter Jackson can make 1,000 movies about killer zombies, killer ghosts, giant apes -- add them all up, they still won't equal the achievement captured on the VHS tapes Schindler's List.

 

[Robert Anthony]

Wow.

Who woulda called this thread, huh? I never saw 13 pages of THIS coming. At all.

 

[Ray H]

Spielberg just doesn't have the same philosophy on DVD as Jackson or other directors. It's obvious that a director like Jackson, Ridley Scott, or David Fincher love the DVD format and support documentation of everything about the movie. Spielberg, on the other hand, doesn't. He won't give a commentary and doesn't want to share too many of his secrets. I don't fault the guy for that. If he wants his movies experienced in a certain way, I'll be satisfied with the movie. It's always nice to have DVDs loaded to the gills, but if the filmmaker doesn't want that, why should I argue with him?

 

[PaulEB]

One 5.1 track is enough as far as I am concerned. More is not always better, especially when one of them is not a commentary.

 

[Dome Vongvises]

Count your blessings: neither David Lynch (not counting Eraserhead ) nor Roman Polanski are in charge of the DVD production.

 

[Jough]

Hi, my name's Jough Dempsey. I'm as non-anonymous as I can possibly be on the Internet. If Spielberg would like to call me and discuss the matter, I'll give him my home phone number. But I won't wait by the phone for his call.

I didn't accuse him of any "crimes against the home theater community." I don't know where you got that, Ernest. Nor was I attacking you personally. If you want to talk about adolescent bickering on the internet, you need look no further than your own posts.

My point was that a film as long as Schindler's List would fit fine on a single side if not for the multiple audio tracks.

SL is NOT meant as an educational aide - it's not a documentary - it's a melodrama. It's a very good melodrama - perhaps one of the greatest of all time - but there are more honest and less emotionally manipulative materials on the same subject matter that do work better as educational tools.

Anyway, my point was that there might not have been a DTS track on this disc if Spielberg didn't own part of the company.

And I don't understand the DTS fetishism on this board. A higher bitrate does not always equal "better." A lousy sound mix will still sound terrible in DTS.

 

[greg_t]

It isn't doing any good to continually discuss this. The dvd is released and has excellent sound quality and video quality. I understand the desires to have it on one disc, but it is not going to happen. You will either have to flip the disc or not watch the movie. 200 people died in Spain and we are debating this like it's a big deal. It's a dvd.

 

[Ernest Rister]

Accusing Spielberg of lining his pockets by including a dts track on a DVD like Schindler's List is borderline offensive to me, Mr. Dempsey.

 

[Bill J]

Why can't they watch it with subtitles?

 

[Jough]

I don't see why it would be, since it has absolutely nothing to do with you.

But it's not an accusation. It's a fact. Spielberg makes money every time a DVD includes DTS.

It doesn't offend me - he's in business to make money - but it's something to consider. Of course he's going to want to use his own company's sound mix - and profit from it.

But what's good for Spielberg isn't necessarily good for the DVD consumer.

In this case, he sacrificed the integrity of his own film to push his sound format (and offer a single disc to multiple markets, thus foisting the English DTS track on two markets that may not have had to buy the DTS track on that disc that is not in their language).

An excellent point above: why dub the film at all? We read subtitles in the U.S. when we view foreign films. Are dubbed tracks really better received than subtitles in Quebec and Mexico?

 

[greg_t]

Does he? To my knowledge, and I could be wrong, but I believe the studios license the DTS encoder from DTS. I don't think they pay on a title by title basis. It's at the studios discretion to include a DTS track or not, and it likely adds costs on their end as they have to have the mix encoded into DTS, which takes time, resources, and quality control (hopefully)

I can see that Speilberg may profit due to DTS's licensing of the encoders, but I can't see where adding a DTS track to Schindlers list makes him money since Universal already has the encoder licensed and uses it for various titles that are not associated with Speilberg. And it may not be his choice whether or not a DTS track gets added. The newest release of The Color Purple from late last year does not have DTS. If it benefits him to include one, why didn't the Color Purple DVD have one? The Back to the Future DVD's, released by Universal, with Speilberg has an executive producer of the films, also have no DTS track.

 

[DanFe]

On the contrary. If I want to buy a different region 2 disc set, I will not have to flip the disc over because it will be either on one disc or 2 discs. Either way, that is preferable to a fragile flipper.

 

[Jough]

Yes, and there are children starving in China. So eat your brussel sprouts.

There will always be horrible things happening to someone somewhere in the world all the time always.

That doesn't mean that my life and desires are less valid.

 

[Robert Anthony]

wow.

That sounds pretty insensitive, man. I mean--okay, I get your point, but what you just basically said was this:

"I don't give a shit about a bunch of bombed spaniards, that aint got a THING to do with my DVD viewing habits. I want this disc all on one side, and all dead people in Spain don't change that."


do we REALLY want a thread about the DVD release of Schindlers List to come to the above? really?

The whole tint of this thread, the perspectiveless sense of entitlement and pouty rationalizations, it's pretty distasteful, especially in light of the movie we're all wringing our hands over.

A discussion on the DVD release of Schindler's List should be more than 13 pages long, and the majority of those 13 pages, I don't think, should be filled with what it's currently filled with. Especially since, as someone else above has said, there's NOTHING THAT CAN BE DONE ABOUT IT NOW. We're essentially crying over spilt milk now, and coming up with retroactive solutions as to how NOT to spill what's already soaking into the carpet.

Which isn't really doing anything but pissing each other off.

I don't get it. is flipping the disc over REALLY that important?

 

[Nate Anderson]

Okay, I'm not going to wade through 13+ pages of posts...I have to get to bed at some point...

I just finished watching the film and it is as powerful and haunting as ever. There are scenes from the film that are burned into my memory from the first time I saw it.

That being said, I am going to be watching some Family Guy or something to give myself some comedic relief...

I did appreciate one of the lighter moments in the film, when Schindler was interviewing for typists and he was basically flirting with all of them, until the unattractive one who could actually type, and then he's looking away with a poutish look on his face. I had forgotten about this scene.

Also, I am not surprised at the sparse bonus features...the film really speaks for itself. What is there is designed to support the film itself. There is little need for the usual "behind the scenes" items and I for one applaud Steven and Universal for being bold enough to leave them off.

 

[Aaron Garman]

Robert, you said it all. Why are we sitting here complaining about getting up and flipping a disc over? It's sad when we can complain about something so meager, so little when we could focus our discussion on something more meaningfull. I mean let's face it, 13 pages of mostly rants on flippers vs. 2 discs and the inclusion of multiple 5.1 tracks. Why are we talking about how well the film is actually presented on DVD? It captures everything Spielberg wanted us to see and hear. Sure, there is a break in the middle, but it doesn't take long to flip a disc.

This is a very important film that deals with some very difficult subject matter. The message it sends is the evil of being intollerant to other people just because who they are. The Nazis killed millions of Jews. Belongings were stolen, families separated, and generations lost because of Hitler and his Final Solution. The film is simply amazing because it shows us a story of one man, a Nazi himself, that realizes the absurdity of the entire chain of events going on and does something about it. Originally, he was in it for the money but he saw that he had the chance to save these people. Some have complained about the lack of features on the DVD, but the documentary with real survivors is just tremendous. It sheds more light on what the film has already shown us and makes what Schindler did even more moving and uplifting.

Now, I like the fact that we here on the forum have the freedom to complain and whine about things but haven't we gone a little bit too far this time? We are all good people, and I'm sure most of us are fairly intelligent. Imagine if we focused our minds more on legitimate complaints than on petty little things such as the flipper. I love reading this forum and participating, but this thread is a sort of black eye to the forum. It shows how far some of us can go because we just love to gripe about everything. We can change that though. Let's give credit where credit is due (to Universal's fine DVD edition of this film) and talk more about the film and perhaps that documentary. Goodnight!

AJG

 

[Jough]

Robert - it's not that I don't give a shit about dead people in Spain - it's just that one thing has nothing to do with another. Why did the other poster even bring it up?

Yeah, there are always other things to worry about and tragedies in the world. But what does that have to do with DVD specs?

Bringing it up off-topic is ill-considered. Why do people who can't figure out a way to discuss the issue at hand always bring up some non sequitur about how insignificant this is after a brush fire in Burma that killed 47 children. Or an earthquake in Tierra del Fuego. You get the idea.

I guess compared to the Holocaust EVERYTHING is insignificant. So fuck it, why bother talking about DVDs or movies at all?

I don't see what's so wrong about wanting the best presentation of a classic film on DVD. No one can do anything about the dead in Spain, but a DVD's specs *is* something that someone can do something about. Focusing on the negative that we can't control doesn't negate focusing on something that we can.

Some people are offended that I've suggested that Steven Spielberg makes money. Others don't want a flipper, or would rather have packaging that had a bottom to the case so the insert didn't slip out all the time. Or are stuck (excuse the pun) on how to remove the glue from the back of the case.

Since this is a thread about the Schindler's List DVD, those topics are appropriate. The Spanish dead is NOT an appropriate topic for this thread. And one has nothing to do with the other - unless someone can offer evidence that the Schindler's List DTS track killed 200 Spaniards.

 

[Aaron Garman]

My argument was that we are complaing where no real complaints need to be filed. We should complain when it is meaningful and important, but having the film split to two sides being a MAJOR downside to this release is just absurd. We have the film, with great picture and sound, in OAR no less and people are mad because they have to get up and flip the disc. Try a CAV laserdisc set once and see how you feel about that one flip! If we end up complaining about everything constantly and all the time, people may stop listening to us. We should complain on major issues that really need to be complained about such as no OAR releases, weak sound mixes, and censored films. Studios are going to look here and see nothing but groaning over small things like flippers and snappers. Again, let's focus are efforts more on things that are just, well, more worthwhile. I just feel there is no reason to complain about this release because it was very well done. Well, except for the extra DTS trailer on disc 2 (that's just superfulous!).

AJG

 

[Keith Paynter]

That's a bit glib. Spielberg's Jurassic Park debuted the DTS audio format in theatres, but he doesn't make money off of every DTS movie print shown in theaters or every DTS disc sold by Universal, Columbia Tri-Star, Anchor Bay, etc.

On DVD DTS is compressed, just like Dolby Digital. There are better sounding DD mixes. This is a fact. If you want the best sounding DTS audio, invest in some DTS laserdiscs, full bandwidth stored on the PCM digital tracks laserdisc offered. Many DTS laserdiscs were miles ahead sonically than their DVD counterparts (Jurassic Park and The Hunchback Of Notre Dame immediately come to mind).

Keeping things on topic (enough with the world crisis stuff - this thread shouldn't be locked because of insensitive badgering), I think if they had kept it down to 2 soundtracks (English DD and DTS) and added more subtitles, there could have been more room to fit the movie on one side. As it is I saw a lot of artifacting in some of scenes with sold backgrounds (outdoor shots with lots of sky, walls indoors, and I swear that as Amon (Fiennes) and Oskar (Neeson) were talking in their earliest negotiating scenes, you could see horizontal lines in Amon's hair as he moved back and forth.

The Deluxe edition is pretty much fluff. Even my numbered LD box set was an expensive overpackage, featuring a copy of the novel and a CD soundtrack with 'exclusive' artwork on the disc, so I only felt obliged to buy the basic DVD. The Shoah mini documentaries are interesting and important the first time around, but not something that bears repeated viewing. Only E.T. and Jaws had interesting documentaries about the film itself, and they were trimmed well back compared to the LD box sets. Supplements should not have the throwaway value of a forced trailer, they deserve to be an interesting visit you could watch again and again.

Unlike LD (here we go again), nobody's really marketing dual-side-playing hardware to avoid flipping, but lots of companies make changers. A disc like should not have been a DVD-18, but 2 DVD-9's. The inclusion of a donation voucher attached to the (sparse) booklet seemed a bit crass (sorry if this sounds insensitive). I will say that the hardcover book-like case was a very clever concept.

There isn't really a large need for Spielberg to explain this film. The movie does this very well on its own, and what it does is remind people that the Holocaust is not something that should be forgotten.