Yamaha 2400 vs. Denon 3805

Discussion in 'AV Receivers' started by Mike~Sileck, May 19, 2004.

  1. Mike~Sileck

    Mike~Sileck Supporting Actor

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    Okay, so I'm down to these receiver choices. They both have zone two support, which was a necessity. Someone I havent looked into that much is any video upconverting. I'll be using the receiver as a switch for my GC and XBOX (both Component), so video quality is a priority.

    I've posted a lot about power ratings in the past, but I've decided to spend around 1000 and get either a 5 channel or preferably a 7 channel amp for 150 watts. This way, I can divide the power amongst the receiver and the amplifier. I could use suggestions here also.

    I will be playing Video Games, listening to Music (preferably through a stereo -> 7 channel mode), and doing heavy dvd watching. Please let me know all ideas, comments, suggestions. Thanks so much

    Mike
     
  2. Kevin Alexander

    Kevin Alexander Screenwriter

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    Have you listened to both?
     
  3. Mike~Sileck

    Mike~Sileck Supporting Actor

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    I havent listened to either, nor do I have methods to do so unless I bought both (not happening, thus this thread, lol)

    Mike
     
  4. Pako

    Pako Auditioning

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    I was in the same situation as you. One thing that finally sold me on the Denon 3805 was the component input's bandwidth of 100 MHz ver. the Yammy's 60MHz bandwidth. This is a problem for 1080i content (according to my understanding). The other thing that sold me on the Denon was the warmer sound it had on my Klispch speakers, which tend to be a little on the bright side. The Yammy had more of a brittle feel to it in the highs. Both are great, but if your doing a lot of heavy 1080i content through your component inputs, the Denon appears to be the only way to go.
     
  5. Wayne Ernst

    Wayne Ernst Cinematographer

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    About the only weak spot with the Denon 3805 appears to be the remote control. Other than that, it really has to come down to which receiver sounds best to you.
     
  6. Mike~Sileck

    Mike~Sileck Supporting Actor

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    Pako, thanks for that point about the bandwidth, and this isn't an old thread by any means, I started it today (5/19). Anyways, I am slowly leaning towards the Denon, I just have a question tho. I noticed that you can have a 9.1 system with only the Yamaha where as the Denon, if you run 7.1, and you want zone 2, you need an amp, b/c the Rear Surround output is also the Zone 2 output. If I'm running the first 5 channels through an amp, can I assign the other outputs to my rear surround and zone 2? I doubt this is possible, but I'm just curious. Anyways, please fill me in on any other details regarding these receivers.

    Also, I need ideas for a 5 or 7 channel amp for around 1000. Thanks a lot!

    Mike
     
  7. Kevin Alexander

    Kevin Alexander Screenwriter

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    The Yamaha really impresses me. On the video side, 60 Mhz bandwith is more than sufficient for HDTV viewing. With nothing but respect, Pako calling his experience w/ Yamaha's highs "brittle" is inaccurate outside of his personal opinion. Yamaha is not harsh or brittle - it is clean and detailed. I really wish you could listen to both because both are great receivers. It is the ONLY way to decide.
     
  8. Pako

    Pako Auditioning

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    Had a nice thread all typed up, but I guess I can't post URL's until I have 15 posts. Anyways, to summarize what I just wrote (quite nicely I might add).

    For an additional $269.00 (difference in cost plus cost of $69 mic for calibration) you get:

    * 1 additional component input for a total of three.
    * 100MHz component bandwidth (honestly didn't see a difference between the Yamaha and the Denon. Minimum for 1080i is 30MHz.)
    *Denon Link (for digital transfer of DVD-A SACD content)


    They're both going to sound great, they're both going to do what you want.

    Check out Denon's site on the multizone. You can read about it in the manual. Basically, in a 5.1 setup, you can power zone 2 with the extra channels, but you need a extra power amp for zone 3. In a 7.1 setup, you would need an additional power amp for zone 2.

    One other note, from users of both receivers...I have been told that if your a tweeker, and you like to "play" with all the different settings and controls, get the Denon. If you want to just plug it in, and have if sound good 'out-of-the-box', with little effort after it's setup, get the Yamaha. (I can't confirm or deny this)

    Hope this helps. Which ever receiver you get, I am sure you won't be disappointed, they're both great products.
     
  9. Alan Wise

    Alan Wise Stunt Coordinator

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    Mike,
    Three weeks ago I bought my Denon AVR-3805. I used my 120 day upgrade policy Tweeter Etc. on my Yamaha RX-V640. My upgrade had come down to three receivers, the Yamaha 2400, the Denon 3805 and a floor model Denon 5803 (killer price of $ 1986.00 was luring me). I initially was favoring the Yamaha becuase my last receiver was a Yamaha and I had liked it very much. I tested all three with my demo disks (Santana Abraxys for music, Finding Nemo, and Twister for Movies). I then threw out the 5803 as the 3805 had more features, was new in the box, and sounded equally well, plus a lower price. At the end of my testing I bought the Denon 3805. It was not that the Yamaha did anything wrong, just that I felt the Denon did everything a little better. When I got home and set everything up I noticed almost immediately a bonus. My TV (Sony HD-RPTV)viewing was much cleaner with the Denon than it was with the Yamaha. My wife, who humors me with this hobby and claims that she can't tell one piece of equipment from the other, commented on the increased picture clarity. I am using the same Comcast/Motorola 6200-2005 Digital/HDTV box as before. I am using the exact same cables, routed in the exact same place as with the Yamaha. The only thing that I can ascertain is the difference in video switching band width.
    I would be interested to find if any other new 3805 owners have experienced this.

    Best Regards, Al. Wise
     
  10. JasonBrandon

    JasonBrandon Agent

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    Which would you say has a better amp section? I need to drive B&W 705's and an HTM7.
     
  11. Mike~Sileck

    Mike~Sileck Supporting Actor

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    Thanks for all of the responses. I'm really looking into this a great deal, as you can tell. Anyways, I need some help determining what amp I should by. Im looking for a 5 or 7 channel 150 watt amp, hopefully under 1000. Thanks a lot!

    Quick question, it would be okay to buy a 5 channel amp, and use the other 4 channels through my receiver's amp, right? I mean theoretically this would increase the WPC on the receiver side, since it has considerably less to drive than normal. plmk, thanks

    Mike
     
  12. MuneebM

    MuneebM Supporting Actor

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    I have the exact same speakers as Mike~Sileck, JBL Studio Series all around. They all have 1" titanium tweeters, and some would qualify these speakers as slightly bright. That being said, my Yamaha 2400 sounds absolutely amazing with these speakers. Furthermore, the Parametric Equalization is a huge plus, it made my speakers' in-room freq response as flat as possible and the sound is much fuller now than it used to be out-of-the-box.

    I've never tried the Denon nor do I know whether it offers parametric equalization, but if it does not, definitely go for the Yamaha. Yamaha's parametric equalization can really tame the sound of your speakers in your room, consequently improving the sound quality significantly.

    The Yamaha 2400 combined with JBL Studio speakers sounds so great that if the Denon is "warmer" I wouldn't get it, because I wouldn't want my sound to be any other way than it is now [​IMG]

    http://66.46.69.23/sigserv/pl/index.pl?p=11
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  13. DavidGT

    DavidGT Stunt Coordinator

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    I sure did Alan. You picked the right one. I was on the fence also down to 3805 and 2400. I agree that the 2400 is not bright to my ears. Sounded smooth and clear as the 3805 but the 3805 definitely had stronger/solid imaging.
    Funny thing you mentioned about the 5803. Just for fun the salesguy let me listened to it so I can sleep peacefully since I've always wondered what if sounds like.
    Well the 5803 is very nice of course but I knew instantly the 3805 was a keeper for me because it sounded very close to the 5803 at about 1/3 price. The decision came pretty easy after that.
     
  14. Mike Up

    Mike Up Second Unit

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    Since I did actually evaluate the same class and same brand of receivers, I'll throw in my opinion. However, my experience is with last year models, the Yamaha RX-V2300 and the Denon AVR-3803.

    I've owned the Yamaha RX-V793, RX-V995, and currently own the Yamaha RX-V2095 which is doing bedroom duty.

    I bought the RX-V2300 and was happy as it actually matched the sound quality of my more expensive and higher current RX-V2095. This was a feat as the RX-V2095 was nearly twice as much as the cheaper RX-V2300. The sound was identical in soundstage, imaging, tonal accuracy, and high level amplifier strain.

    The down side is that I found the RX-V2300 to have some defects which were similar to what I've seen on a recent RX-V596 that I installed. It had a bass management defect where "ONLY" on 6 channel stereo, the bass management was operating in reverse logic. Speakers set as small weren't sending the bass to the subwoofer where as speaker set as large "WERE SENDING" the bass to the subwoofer. Working in an opposite nature. The RX-V596 I installed had a bass management problem were the subwoofer would shut off in DPL, but worked in other DSP modes. Not exactly the same but both defects in bass management circuits.

    The second problem on the RX-V2300 was cosmetics, the unit had a scratch and the front panel door was aligned incorrectly.

    Although I've been a loyal Yamaha supporter all these years, the latest quality problems made me go to the competition. I quickly called my salesman's manager and was exchanging the RX-V2300 for the Denon AVR-3803.

    Now I will state that I "believe" that the new Yamaha RX-V2400 is a completely different design than the older models based on it's different sensitivity, "THX SELECT", volume control(which is very similar to Denon's), and other design traits. Since this is Yamaha's first THX receiver line, I believe they made many changes that seem to follow designs of other THX receiver manufacturers. Previously, the sensitivity was 150mv instead of the newer 200mv and used a volume control that didn't compensate output for channel levels that were over 0db. While minor changes, they are different from every other model of Yamaha which has basically been unchanged for many years.

    This could be a positive in perhaps sound quality could be better than older models or a negative with an inexperienced design. It's a toss up to the opinion of the user. Since I have no experience on the RX-V2400, I can't say anything about it.

    However, I did write a review on the sound quality difference between the Yamaha RX-V2300/RX-V2095 and the Denon AVR-3803 here. I found the Denon AVR-3803's sound quality a big step up from the Yamaha RX-V2300/RX-V2095 models.

    The real shocker is when my mom was staying with me for a while, she was in the other room and I was doing comparisons between the Denon and the Yamaha. At loud listening levels she pointed out that the currently playing receiver was much less distorted sounding than the previous receiver. I was playing the Denon currently. Usually my mom could care less about sound quality but she did find the difference very easily. The Denon just played without amp strain where the Yamahas did.

    I now own the Denon AVR-3803 and don't think I would go back to Yamaha unless they addressed their shortcomings that I pointed out in the review.

    Good luck on your decision and have a good one.
     
  15. Mike Up

    Mike Up Second Unit

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    I didn't check out the video pass through quality on the RX-V2300 but I did on my previous Yamaha RX-V995 and RX-V2095. They had noise in the deep blacks that could not be easily seen in a dark room, but it was there. The Yamahas also had video channel bleed when using the video out selector on any setting other than source. The Denon AVR-3803 has no noise that I can see anywhere and no video channel bleed. I have seen no negatives on the Denon as it seems to be as clean as the original. IMO, the Denon's video circuits are MUCH cleaner. This was using composite and S-Video. Another bonus for the Denon IMO.

    Have a good one.
     

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