Shooting at Virginia Tech (1 Viewer)

[MarkMel]

It's my understanding that VT is like a small city. If that's the case and you compare the first shooting to a shooting in a small city, the city's not going to get shut down over something that seems to be an isolated incident at the time. I don't know how anyone could've predicted what he was going to do. Of course this is all just Monday morning quarterbacking.

The unfortunate thing is that I don't think that you can ever prevent something like this from happening. If someone snaps, no amount of prevention would've helped. Other than full military type security with x-ray and metal detectors. But, even with those preventative measures things happen.

And no one want to live under conditions like that.

 

[Chris Lockwood]

Did this pattern ever happen before with a mass killing- where there was a time gap like that between the killings? That was one of the oddest things about it. It certainly wouldn't have taken the guy 2 hours to get to the other part of campus, so I wonder if we'll ever find out what happened. Maybe the second part of the killings wasn't originally planned?

(I'm not talking about serial killers whose crimes were spread out over weeks, just the one day incidents.)

 

[Jeff Ulmer]

Does anyone else think that all the media attention these nut jobs get after an incident like this only encourages others to seek the fame brought on by these events?

 

[MarkMel]

Oh absolutely. There are those that have some real fascination/admiration for these mass murderers/serial killers.

Books have been written about it.

 

[KurtEP]

I'm not sure the drive for fame motivates others, but I'm very suspicious that the extensive coverage will give the idea to other people suffering from similar emotional problems.

I noticed with school shootings that you never heard of them until a number of years ago when there was one in Alabama or Arkansas, I forget which. After that, there were a number of copycats for a few years (including one at my high school, sadly). Then they kind of died down as the idea faded out of the public consciousness. Then there was Columbine, and the copycats after that, most of which were averted.

The way I think of it is that it's like a tear in the fabric of society. Before something like this happens, no one could imagine doing it, so they don't. After it happens, other people can imagine doing it and actually carry out their thoughts. Unfortunately, it's almost impossible, and probably not desirable, to not report something on this scale. I question, though why a school shooting at my high school (in PA) would get coverage in the USVI where I was vacationing at the time. It's a local issue. Reporting it that far just spreads fear and gives people ideas. Of course, it also sells papers, so it gets reported.

 

[MarkMel]

Well, our information is so instantaneous now. That's why it seems that there is so much more crime than in the past, even though the stats say otherwise. Pre internet we wouldn't hear about every murder in small towns all over the county. Now, we hear of all of them within minutes of them happening.

Sadly I think this makes the single murders less sensational and the multiple ones much more so. I also think that this desensitizes everyone to the smaller crimes.

 

[Steve Christou]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20070418/...shooting_dc_40

 

[Cees Alons]

Apparently, after the first killing, one of the students who witnessed it pointed the police to the wrong guy (I believe he thought he recognized him), who was taken from his home and interrogated at the police station - until the second alarm came in.


Cees

 

[andrew markworthy]

I've worked at several Brit universities for the last twenty or so years, and from my experience it is possible to shut down a campus very quickly indeed (we got in our practice with the IRA and have carried on from there). But, as has already been said, it's a no-win situation. If the campus had been shut down, the guy might have killed other people instead (e.g. although shooting students is sickening, what if he'd been frustrated in this aim and gone to a local kindergarten to slake his revenge?).

For what I hope are obvious reasons, I can't discuss any details, but all Brit universities have a set of emergency plans to deal with 'obvious' emergencies, such as major fires, gunman on the loose, release of poisonous gas, etc. I can't believe that US universities don't have similar contingency plans.

Incidentally, the UK media are having their usual field day with how easy it is to buy a gun in the USA. Contrary to what you guys might think it's pretty easy to own a gun in the UK if you're law-abiding and sane, but you have to go through a lot of checks (e.g. physical and mental assessment by a doctor, approval by the police) before you can get one. The fact that a guy with a history of mental illness could stroll into a store and buy a gun by simply declaring himself to be sane has got us Brits in a spate of our usual moral self-rightiousness on this issue.

 

[Marvin]

Sometimes, this moral self-righteousness is entirely justified.

 

[Steve Christou]

http://www.time.com/time/nation/arti...rss-topstories

 

[Malcolm R]

But was there actual documented "history"? I admit I haven't immersed myself in the 24/7 coverage of the event, but I thought though he was urged repeatedly to seek help, he never did?

And even if there was, it's often tough to get through the iron curtain of doctor-patient confidentiality.

While it is a tragedy, and I feel bad for those directly involved in the events, I do think we're kind of verging on going overboard with all the press coverage and lowering of flags and such.

 

[andrew markworthy]

According to the UK media, he was admitted to a mental hospital on one occasion. In addition, there are reports of the guy being sent to see counsellors, of tutors concerned about what he was writing in his work, fellow students refusing to work with him, etc.

 

[Holadem]

Well, some magnanimous souls, most of which where nowhere close to VT have taken it upon themselves to forgive Cho, who is just another victim of this tragedy:


http://wcbstv.com/seenon/local_story_107170729.html

...

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H

 

[Henry Gale]

Yes, now that you mention it.
I don't have the exact timeline at hand but just over 40 years ago when Charles Whitman (who just got bounced out of the record book two days ago) killed a bunch of people in Austin.
I believe it was the night before he climbed the UT Texas Tower that Chuck killed his wife in their rented house in South Austin. At some point he then went to his mother's condo (near 17th & Lavaca) and ended her life.
Then he went to the campus.
Whitman obviously planned this; he had guns, ammo and lunch all packed.

You brought up some other interesting points that I have not heard answers to.
The initial shooting in the dorm. Who was that female victim?
I've read that one of the deceased co-eds went to the shooter's high school, was there something going on with them?
If he chained the doors was he at Home Depot during those 2 hours buying hardware, or was that done earlier?
I loved reading that his gun purchase had "been traced". He had the receipt in his backpack, very little detective work needed.
Just because I made that snide comment, I also want to mention that I think the local officials did everything just right, and everything they possible could. The person at fault was named "Seung".

 

[Dome Vongvises]

Honestly, you really don't expect stuff like this to happen. And even then, I can see how things work out from the university perspective, but how do you implement those same plans with students? The only drill I ever got as a kid was a tornado and fire drill.

 

[Christ Reynolds]

For what reason? I'm aware of the people that picket at the funerals of dead soldiers. I can understand how their fucked up logic makes them want to go to funerals and picket...it's the war thing.

I don't understand why any group would want to picket the VT funerals. What are they against? People not getting murdered? The victims were a bunch of kids, seemingly unrelated. I don't understand why any group would do this, apart from pissing people off and getting on tv. I'm not advocating more violence, but if something happens to them as a result of picketing, I have no sympathy.

CJ

 

[Jerome Grate]

I don't know how to comment without causing a mini debate but to start, my prayers goes out to those who lost loved ones in this horrific massacre. You would think the safest place to be would be the college campus and of course no one could have expected this. I was watching some of primetime live last night and for the short interview with those students advocating the need to carry firearms to prevent an incident like this from escalating. IMHO the problem here and it's pure speculation is that the constitution gives the right to bear arms to citizens I can agree with but resident aliens, no friggin way. If there was a regulation in place that prevented this mad man from purchasing this gun "legally" could have prevented this from happening. I know I'm going to get blasted for this, but clearly if this killer ran into this obstacle this could have had an inpact on the whole thing.

This "call to arms" mentality is also questionable. Everyone is a Monday Morning quarterback and claims if they were allowed to have their firearms things might have been different. No one knows how anyone would react under those strenous circumstances. Nervousness sets in, hearts pounding, hands shaking and sweaty as you see the person next to you gun down and now you are going to draw your weapon. This is not TJ Hooker or Lethal Weapon where you can shoot someone with pinpoint accuracy. This was real and those who advocate that the possession of a firearm would have made a difference is out of touch. Probably not the best time to talk about this, but still an issue.

As to the President being fired and the head of campus security, I've got to say yes, fire them. There was too much history with this guy, crazy writings reported by his professor, stalking two women I believe to the point it was reported to the police eventhough charges were not filed, psychiatric evaluations and I also thought he set a dorm room on fire are clear indications collectively you have someone unstable and does not meet the criteria of the campus and should be expelled. Now with an individual with so much death on his mind even if you expelled him from the campus, his desire would be strong enough to find his way back but his actions occured as a student and not an outsider. I feel strongly about this in so many issues here and it's sucks that he took his own life after. Christianity teaches me to pray for him as well and I will but it doesn't change how I feel about the whole incident. Sorry for ranting a little.

 

[JohnS]

WOW!!

is anyone watching the news right now??

Reports are coming in that NBC has received a package with photos, writings and videos by the shooter.
And they had a VT news conference, and a VT administrator, was telling the info, and people started getting upset about the recent news, and he had to leave and walk away, when he was being bombarded with statements with people saying "shouldn't have the university known about this"
He almost tripped over something trying to leave.

Fox is saying that the shooter must have planned this entire thing really well, having sent this supposed package between the first and second shootings


Yes, this is the same church organization that stands just outside the enterence of the funerals for the deceased american soilders who fought over in Iraq. It was announced this moring that the plan on picketing as much as they could at the VT funerals.
Fo what reason? I don't know. But these church people that do this are F-d up!

CJ

 

[Henry Gale]

Don't want to be a part of sidetracking this thread, but I've got to stand up and shout here...NO! It's not "the war thing".
I'm not even going to address the sick Kansas group's "thing"...but it's way beyond rational thought.
If it will ease your mind, there are a LOT of volunteer bikers that do a fine job getting between those scum and the funerals.