Annika Sorenstam--You Go Girl! (1 Viewer)

[Mike Voigt]

As I said - golf is, or in my opinion should be - a game of finesse, not sheer power. If I want sheer power I'll go find me a nice V-8 or V-12 somewhere. Or a good NASCAR race.

I think they should be given the chance - THE CHANCE - to succeed in the PGA. Not cut out right from the get-go - that is so blatantly misogynistic and myopic it's not funny. Prove you can.

Incidentally, you don't establish a handicap on a single game. Why then do you expect to establish rights to play on a single game?

Give her a chance to show her mettle. For that matter, give any woman a chance to show her mettle on the course. If they can do it, they will. It may take time, and those who cannot handle it will be weeded out. Both men and women, mind you.

But to cut them out a priori - no. After all, it is not a boys' club only.

 

[Jeremiah]

Mike, it's common knowledge that women will not be able to cut it on the PGA tour, it's not a knock against women, it's just the truth(even women golfers know it). Strength does play a part in golf, and it should, that is one thing that seperates the great/good from the also rans; if you don't have length you will not get many birdies or be able to save Par's unless you play perfect golf. Golf shouldn't be about Par 3 or short Par 4's. When you are in 8" rough, finesse will do you no good, when you are on a long Par 5 finesse will not help you gain ground by getting there in 3.

The best womens golfer today(maybe ever?) finished in the bottom 12% and missed the cut on a course she hand picked as the best chance she had to do well. What does that say about the other women who aren't even in Annika's league?

In the beginning a lot of women might try and play with the men but when they start missing cut after cut(and they will) they will go back to the LPGA b/c that is where they can make a living. What's the point of a women playing on the PGA tour when they are ranked with the guys that barely make the cuts? Pride? That doesn't pay the bills.

 

[Mike Hutman]

So what is the LPGA?
Can the men that don't normally make the cut go over to the LPGA and make a living?
They should make a MPGA (mixed tour) , for both men and women. That would be fun to watch.

 

[Allen_Appel]

It's ridiculous to state that women will *never* be able to compete with men in the PGA. I think as soon as someone with the strength of a Serena Williams or the height of a Chamique Holdsclaw decides to set her sights on golf, she'll be able to compete with today's players. It's only recently that monster drives even came into play, both from improved equipment and players like Tiger and Daly. Golf is a "game of inches", and holes are won on the greens, not the tees. If Sorenstam had been a better putter, she would certainly have made the cut. I wonder how she compares to great golfers of old.

 

[Mike Voigt]

You're conveniently forgetting that most all golf games are lost on the greens - where strength is just about useless.

If Annika had done better at her play on the greens, she would have "made the cut" - there were at least 3 if not 5 opportunities on the first day (!), never mind Day 2. This happened again on Day 2.

With that in mind - where would she have ranked with 6-10 less in her score?

And, before you say it - everyone has a bad day, even Tiger. So do not judge by a single circumstance alone. It is not fair, and frankly, it reeks of prejudice.

 

[Micheal]

So do not judge by a single circumstance alone. It is not fair, and frankly, it reeks of prejudice.

I don't think that anyone is being prejudice. It's just that she's the best the women have to offer, she picked the course that she thought she could excel at, and she finished in the bottom of the pack. Why don't we wait for a female player that totally dominates the LPGA, game in and game out. She may make the cut.

 

[Scott Merryfield]

It's only recently that monster drives even came into play, both from improved equipment and players like Tiger and Daly.

Not true. Jack Nicklaus, in his younger days, was one of the longest hitters on the PGA Tour. Augusta National modified several holes to "Jack-proof" the course in the late 1960's, just as they did more recently to "Tiger-proof" it. Yes, a solid short game and putting are needed to succeed on the Tour, but the shorter hitters have little or no chance on the longer courses. It's tough to compete when you are hitting 2 and 3 irons into greens that the longer hitters are hitting 8 and 9 irons. That big a difference in clubs means more greens in regulation and more short birdie putts.

 

[Jeremiah]

It's tough to compete when you are hitting 2 and 3 irons into greens that the longer hitters are hitting 8 and 9 irons. That big a difference in clubs means more greens in regulation and more short birdie putts.

Sorry Scott just read your post.

 

[Jeremiah]

It's tough to compete when you are hitting 2 and 3 irons into greens that the longer hitters are hitting 8 and 9 irons. That big a difference in clubs means more greens in regulation and more short birdie putts.

Sorry Scott just read your post.

 

[Micheal]

Can we finally drop this ridiculous argument? The LPGA is a restricted competition league, just as boys high school basketball, boy's junior golf and the Senior PGA Tour are restricted. I do not see anyone claiming that a PGA professional should be allowed to play on the Senior Tour because Arnold Palmer gets a sponsor's exemption to the PGA tournament at Bay Hill.

All hell would have broken loose if they didn't allow her to play with the Men. Yet if a Man were to try the same thing he would be ridiculed. Sounds sexist to me.

 

[Scott Merryfield]

All hell would have broken loose if they didn't allow her to play with the Men. Yet if a Man were to try the same thing he would be ridiculed. Sounds sexist to me.

There is nothing sexist about it. The PGA is not a competitively restrictive league -- there are no age or gender restrictions. By your logic, Tiger Woods should be allowed to play high school golf because Ty Tryon played in a PGA event while in high school, NCAA golf because Phil Mickelson played in a PGA event in Tuscon while in college, in the U.S. Amateur because amateurs play in the Masters and U.S. Open, or on Senior Tour because Jack Nicklaus and Arnold Palmer get sponsor's exemptions to PGA events.

So why is restricting the LPGA to women sexist, while the above restrictions for high school, NCAA, amateur and senior PGA golf are okay? Anyone who finds these other restrictions acceptable, yet objects to Sorenstam getting a similar sponsor's exemption, is the one being sexist.

 

[Hunter P]

Amen, brotha.

 

[Brian Perry]

All hell would have broken loose if they didn't allow her to play with the Men

It's possible that Annika would never have received a sponsor's invitation to a PGA event, and I don't think there would have been any outcry. Now if she had been denied the right to qualify, that would be another issue entirely.

 

[Lew Crippen]

It's possible that Annika would never have received a sponsor's invitation to a PGA event, and I don't think there would have been any outcry.

Actually she had been invited to about seven stops on the PGA tour (as written in a previous post). She chose Colonial because of its emphasis on other factors than distance off the tee.

 

[Micheal]

I guess my problem is that I listen to sports radio. All I heard for months previous to Annika playing was a lot of bitching about whether or not she should play. By the time she hit the course I was already sick of her. I have never seen something so pointless get so much press. Not to mention that just about everyone knew she wouldn't make the cut anyway.

A guy has to go to court in order to be allowed to drive in a cart from hole to hole but aside from that anyone can play.Maybe there should be restrictions, if the LPGA can have them why not the PGA?

I'll just say this, if it wasn't for her being a woman from the LPGA we wouldn't have heard boo about this. Do you disagree with that?

Anyone who finds these other restrictions acceptable, yet objects to Sorenstam getting a similar sponsor's exemption, is the one being sexist.

So it's okay that men can't play in the women's league but women can play wherever they want?

 

[Scott Merryfield]

So it's okay that men can't play in the women's league but women can play wherever they want?

Did you bother to read the rest of my post? Other leagues, including the LPGA, the Senior PGA, the NCAA, high schools and little league organizations, place restrictions on people eligible for competition. This is done to help ensure that there is some form of competitive balance within that league. Should 30 year-old PGA Tour players also be allowed to play on the Senior Tour (restricted to players 50 years or older) because Arnold Palmer gets an exemption to play a regular tour event? It's not allowed because it would upset the competitive balance of that restricted league, not because of age discrimination.

The PGA, on the other hand, has no such restrictions, since it is intended to be a competition among the best players in the sport. The Tour has certain requirements for being allowed to play on the Tour on a regular basis (none of which mention gender, btw), but also includes within their rules the allowance for sponsor's exemptions for special cases. These have gone to local high school players, NCAA players, senior golfers, handicapped players (Casey Martin never earned his tour card) and even former NFL quarterbacks (former Redskin Mark Rypien missed the cut by 36 strokes on a sponsor's exemption at the Kemper Open one year). In each of these cases, exemptions have gone to people who were not currently trying to gain full-time membership to the PGA Tour.

BTW, a player is limited to a certain number of sponsor's exemptions in a season. Tiger Woods earned his full-time tour card by playing under sponsor's exemptions after turning pro -- he won a tournament that fall, earning his card for two years and thereby avoiding Q-school. Casey Martin used up his sponsor's exemptions one season, but failed to earn enough money to gain his card. He then tried to earn it via the Buy.com Tour the next year (but also failed).

 

[Lew Crippen]

12. Sponsor exemptions (a maximum of eight, which may include amateurs with handicaps of 2 or less), on the following basis:
A. Not less than two sponsor invitees shall be PGA TOUR members not otherwise exempt.
B. Not less than two of the top 35 finishers and ties from the last Qualifying Tournament, as well as 2-15 from the 2002 Nationwide Tour money list, if not all of them can otherwise be accommodated. (Note: PGA TOUR members may receive an unlimited number of sponsor invitations. Non-TOUR members may receive a maximum of seven per year).

You will note that the rules governing sponsor exemptions both require that some tour members be given an opportunity and at the same time allow for sponsor’s to include a wide-range of potential candidates. Just think: the sponsor may invite amateur’s with a 2 handicap to play. What chance would a non-scratch , amateur have of making the cut. You will also note that there is no restriction as to sex or age.

For some reason, many in this thread (and on sports radio ) seem to think that the PGA tour is a men’s only affair. Just because so many believe this to be the case (and apparently, for some reason, wish it to be the case), does not make it so.

 

[Patrick Sun]

And the other problem was that some golfers, like Vijah Singh, also thought the PGA is a men-only league.

In the PGA, if you qualify, or have enough game/fame to get a sponsor's exemption, you can play in a PGA event.

 

[Micheal]

Did you bother to read the rest of my post? Other leagues, including the LPGA, the Senior PGA, the NCAA, high schools and little league organizations, place restrictions on people eligible for competition.

Yes Scott, I did.

What I would like to know is this. Why is it okay for a league that only allows women but not a league that just allows men? Can someone please answer this question. (Yes, I've read all the posts but just saying "Here are the rules" doesn't answer my question) I want to know how people feel about this, not quotes from the PGA regulations handbook.
Either have one league for everyone or break them up into specifics like age and gender. (For BOTH sexes.)
Am I the only who thinks that it's wrong for a woman to play in the LPGA and the PGA but a man can't? Isn't this a double standard? I'm sure that if the PGA made a move to be a "men only" tournament we would never hear the end of it. Why is that?

I'm really about what's fair to both sexes but when you allow one gender to do things that the other can't..., that's sexist. Plain and simple.

 

[Scott Merryfield]

What I would like to know is this. Why is it okay for a league that only allows women but not a league that just allows men?

I'm sure there are many leagues that are men-only -- the PGA just doesn't happen to be one of them. It just works out that way because in golf the best women cannot compete consistently when facing the best men, which means that no current woman player would be able to earn or retain a tour card. The PGA, through sponsor's exemptions, has chosen to allow such "competitively-challenged" players to enter the occasional tournament to benefit the fans, player and tour. For example, fans love to see Arnold Palmer when he plays at Bay Hill, but there is no way he could earn a tour card to play in the event.

Heck, the golf league I play in is men-only.