What's required for external amplification? (1 Viewer)

I've been wondering for awhile now, what exactly do I need to acquire to externally amplify my front tower speakers??? I have an old 5.1 receiver from 2002, a set of Polk towers, and a Carvin CP900 amplifier just sitting around in a spare room not doing much...I'd LOVE to hook it up to the towers and let the receiver do a bit less work while it powers the remaining 3 speakers but I have NO IDEA how to hook it up this way....what do I need?


Oh and I have an external xover as well.


It wouldn't surprise me if I need a different receiver, but I just can't seem to find the answer to my problem/question...

You either need an AVR with "pre-outs" (the "pre" meaning "before amplification") for each channel you want to amplify externally, or you can go the full "separates" route and just get a pre-processor (which is an AVR but without any internal amplification) - but in this case you would need external amplification for every channel.


I'm no expert in external amplification, but I'm not certain the external crossover will really help you no matter which way you go. Either route will have crossover controls, so a separate module is most likely redundant.


To find an AVR with preouts, you need to step up a few notches from the base models. Members here can provide specific model numbers. If you can provide a budget, I'm sure members here can steer you to the best option.


Once you have your AVR with preouts and your amplifiers, you connect them using RCA cables (typically).

You just need a receiver with pre-outs for the mains. Most high-end receivers have this and some mid-tiers have it. Then you connect the line out from the receiver to the amp, the rest of the speakers are driven by the receiver. (If you only have two speakers, then instead of the receiver you can use a pre-amp.)

Onkyo 838(prior years 7X7) and up.
Denon 5200(dont remember on the 4)
Marantz starts with a 7.
Most Elite at $1000 and up
Yamaha V 6XX typically, then RX-A800 and up.

My budget it's "as cheap as possible". Lol I was expecting to be able to st this up for$200ish. . . Is that completely unreasonable? Oh and I mentioned the xover because the Carvin amp does not have is own xover all an external one is necessary.

The cross over settings will be in whatever box you decide to go with - so you don't need an external one. The bass will be removed and sent to the sub before the signal goes to the amp.


A dedicated pre-pros can be found for 5-700 bucks...but those will need external amplification for your other channels.


Outlaw Model 975 7.1 HDMI AV Surround Processor - $549


Emotiva UMC-200 - $699


Looks like you are better off going with a new, referb receiver instead....

Older Onkyo 705, 706, Integra DTR 5.8 and 5.9.

Start hitting up Ebay.

Is there another reason other than "I have an amp, so I may as well use it" that you are considering this change?


Specifically, what Polk speakers are you using?


You mentioned letting "the receiver do a little less work...". Do you know how much work the receiver is actually doing?


If your speakers are efficient, then they don't need much power, and external amplification may not yield much in terms of actual audible improvement.


Room size and desired volume levels also come into play. Filling a large room with near reference level sound may well require a beefier setup, but a small to medium sized room at levels most would consider "typical" for surround sound movie watching may not warrant much of a change.

Ok so the old JVC amp its pushing all 5 speakers currently and good into Overload at my desired listening levels during high intensity scenes. I believe it would "do less work" and not go into Overload if I had an external amp on the towers. That is ONE reason why I want to amplify them externally. The SECOND, and most important, reason it's because these Polk Monitor 70s are tastes to take up to 275w RMS per side so I really believe that my receiver is not doing them justice as far as overall clarity at high volume. The room is approximately 18' x 13' with a 10-11' high ceiling.

Also forgive my improper wording, I'm on my phone using Swype and don't always see these mistakes:X

Maximum speaker wattage is irrelevant. Your Monitor 70 likely need less power than your surround and center.

Not maximum power, RMS power. I also use this system a LOT in 2ch mode for music.

kevox said:

Not maximum power, RMS power. I also use this system a LOT in 2ch mode for music.

Click to expand...

Speakers DO NOT have RMS power.

Amplifiers do.

Who cares if you use it 2.0 or 5.1. Power requirements are EXACTLY the same.

Again...

Your Monitor 70 likely require LESS power than your center and surround.

Once we know what those are...the "likely" will probably become "definitely".

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that speakers produce power, lol. I mean they're rated to take up to a recommended amount continuously - RMS power - and more than that is not recommended by the manufacturer. On the flipside, severely underpowering is not going to give you the optimum performance of said speaker. This is why I believe amplifying my 275w RMS capable towers with the Carvin amp instead of leaving them on the JVC - which is probably delivering around 50w RMS per channel (rated at 100w peak x 5) - will produce superior results.


I mentioned that I use it in 2ch mode a lot because...not to be rude but it does matter.....At very high volumes, something's gonna give and I dont want it to be my amplifier that falls short before anything else. It may be a better choice to power the center channel & rears first in 5.1 mode for watching movies, but on teh flipside that would be useless with music. I listen to music with this system more often than I watch movies so that is where my focus is.


But to let you know what else I have in there...
Polk CSI5 center channel
Infinity Reference rears (these are super entry level and also about a decade old)

I'm not seeing where the Polks are 250 RMS, I've never seen that kind of spec from any speaker (I found a manual here: http://ec1.images-amazon.com/media/i3d/01/A/man-migrate/MANUAL000074437.pdf).


But if your current receiver is going into overload, then I agree that would be a good reason to add in the Carver (or just get a new receiver).

kevox said:

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that speakers produce power, lol. I mean they're rated to take up to a recommended amount continuously - RMS power - and more than that is not recommended by the manufacturer. On the flipside, severely underpowering is not going to give you the optimum performance of said speaker. This is why I believe amplifying my 275w RMS capable towers with the Carvin amp instead of leaving them on the JVC - which is probably delivering around 50w RMS per channel (rated at 100w peak x 5) - will produce superior results.

I mentioned that I use it in 2ch mode a lot because...not to be rude but it does matter.....At very high volumes, something's gonna give and I dont want it to be my amplifier that falls short before anything else. It may be a better choice to power the center channel & rears first in 5.1 mode for watching movies, but on teh flipside that would be useless with music. I listen to music with this system more often than I watch movies so that is where my focus is.

But to let you know what else I have in there...
Polk CSI5 center channel
Infinity Reference rears (these are super entry level and also about a decade old)

Click to expand...

There is absolutely, unequivocally, no such thing, at all, that is accurate about this so called myth of...

"Underpowering speakers".

Do you drive your car at maximum speed everywhere?

Or do you drive 20-25 in school zones?

I hope you start walking, cause by your logic...you are under powering your car not driving it constantly in wide open throttle...

And some edumacation regarding what power handling actually means....

Monitor 70 is 90db "maximum" rating of 270.
CSi5 is 90db maximum of 200.
Infinity Ref 152(I picked one out of the dozens of Infinity Reference models made 15-10 years ago) is 87 maximum of 125.

Here we go...

1 watt is 87, 90 and 90
2 watts is 90, 93 and 93
4 watts is 93, 96 and 96
8 watts is 96, 99 and 99
16 watts is 99, 102 and 102 (this is already deafening in a small room)
32 watts is 102, 105 and 105(large room deafening)
64 watts is 105, 108 and 108(serious hearing damage)
128 is 108, 111 and 111(your surrounds stop here and you are pissing off your neighbors)
256 is 114.

Splitting hairs...
Your center caps at 113.5.
Your mains cap at 114.2.

Big ass difference....

Do you have a powered sub in the mix? If so, are your speakers set to small?


Adding a sub will do alot to take the stress off of your receiver. Redirecting the bass to a sub with its own amp will allow your receiver to handle the mids and highs. The amount of power you need to produce bass is much higher than the power for mids and highs.


Also, JVC isn't really known for making good receivers/amps. Upgrading to a better receiver would be my first choice.

Sorry about the SUPER late response guys!

Al. Anderson, you know I can't seem to find where I read that the 275w was RMS - now that I look again I dont see anything either. My bad, who knows what they are then lol.


David Willow - yes I do have a sub. A XXX18 paired with a Peavey IPR1600. I wouldn't be surprised if the JVC internals are the problem.

schan1269 - I understand what you're saying and I'm not going to start a flamewar about the subject but take a competition level subwoofer and power it with 50w and see how it performs....speakers perform better with certain ranges of amplification. That's an extreme example of course but it applies to mids & highs just as well.

Flame war?

Over what?

Buying high efficiency that doesn't require much power...

Or buying low efficiency that does require lots of power.

Every speaker that has ever been designed, and that ever will be designed, is based on picking two of these three things....

Efficiency
Extension
Size.

Period.

Extension and efficiency are, and always have been, and forever will be, the two most mutually exclusive.

Power is nothing but...

"How loud do you want it?"