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Amplifier volume level


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#1 of 9 OFFLINE   pinkjosh

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Posted January 19 2011 - 04:18 AM

In my current Onkyo 7300 HTiB... a reasonable sound comes when I set my amp master volume more than 45. My question is why there is no or very little sound coming if the volume level is between 1 and 45.

Has it something to do with the connected blu ray player volume?  OR has it something to do with the fact that the condition is because the amp is capable of driging 6 - 16 ohms impedance speakers and it is currently connected to 8 ohms speakers.



#2 of 9 OFFLINE   Ed Moxley

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Posted January 19 2011 - 09:17 AM

No, 8 ohm speakers are easier to drive than 6 ohm speakers. So, the speakers shouldn't be the problem. Did you connect the microphone and run the Audyssey speaker calibration and room correction? If not, you need to. If you did, maybe try running it again.


You said volume level 45. Is it a regular 45, or is it a -45? In the -(minus) numbers, the lower the number, the louder it is. Our listening volume for tv is usually around -40 to -28, depending on our mood, and what time of day or night it is. When my wife goes to bed, I'll usually turn it down to about -45.


Samsung HL61A750 (LED DLP)            Onkyo TX-SR805
Oppo BDP-83 Blu ray                                  Polk Audio LSi9
Polk Audio LSiC                                  Sony SS-MB100H
SVS PC12-NSD (Sub)                       ...

#3 of 9 OFFLINE   pinkjosh

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Posted January 20 2011 - 04:30 AM

Oh I never tried it.

I will do that to see if the AVR has negative volume setup capability.

By the way do you mean to say that volumne at -1 will be lounder than volumne at +69 ? Why they have -ve and +ve volume level?



#4 of 9 OFFLINE   Ed Moxley

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Posted January 20 2011 - 06:16 AM

-1 and +69? Hard to say exactly (depending on how receiver is made), because once the - numbers get to 0, then they go into + numbers which is getting louder, but I don't think they go to +69. I have no idea why they have + and - number labeling. Maybe someone else does...........


Yes, definitely run Audyssey. It does a good job calibrating the speakers, and making room correction settings. Only thing is.......after running it, it likes to set the speakers to "Large", or in Onkyo's it's "Full Band". Since you use a subwoofer, you want to change them manually to "Small", or whatever the opposite of Full Band is on the Onkyo. Sorry, I forget what it's called.


When running Audyssey, the mic needs to be about ear level when sitting down, and pointed up. It will help if you can mount it to a tripod. You'll want to put it in the main seat, then in maybe two other seats that get used when watching movies. I'd do at least three positions. Some folks do more, and some do less. I think three is good all around working positions for it. Things should be better then.

Good luck!


Samsung HL61A750 (LED DLP)            Onkyo TX-SR805
Oppo BDP-83 Blu ray                                  Polk Audio LSi9
Polk Audio LSiC                                  Sony SS-MB100H
SVS PC12-NSD (Sub)                       ...

#5 of 9 OFFLINE   John Brill

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Posted January 20 2011 - 08:29 AM



Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed Moxley 

-1 and +69? Hard to say exactly (depending on how receiver is made), because once the - numbers get to 0, then they go into + numbers which is getting louder, but I don't think they go to +69. I have no idea why they have + and - number labeling. Maybe someone else does...........

 
The best explantion I ever read on the subject was posted on Audioholics by MDS... I'll post the link here as a spoiler since it's on another forum and I forget what the rules are here.  Howerver, to make a long story short, most AVR's have a -80 to +20 scale which correspond well to SPL meters.  Some AVR's have a 0 to +100 scale which is essentially the same scale but meant to show volume as increasing.






#6 of 9 OFFLINE   pinkjosh

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Posted January 22 2011 - 04:19 PM

I am afraid the question is still unanswered.

my AVR does not have its volume level in -ve. it starts from 1 and goes until 69 and then it says MAX.

I did calibrate it already using Auddyssey setup.  The thing is that the volume is nearly nothing if I set it below 40.. it start increasing after that only.. and my listening level that is normal level takes it to be set up around 60-62.  I wondered that at normal listening level of 62, I am only 7 level away from the max listening level.

I need to know what is the significance of level 1 to 40.. if there is no volume coming out ???



#7 of 9 OFFLINE   Patrick Hannon

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Posted January 22 2011 - 11:29 PM

It is most likely just the design of the volume setting control.  My Yamaha has settings of -80 to +5 (my max level setting, it can go to +15 I believe).  I have calibrated so that 0 corresponds to my reference level which is ~82dB using various test tones, e.g. Digital Video essentials, AVIA, etc.....I find an 85dB reference a bit too loud.  My movie listening is done at 0 for movies that use dialogue normalization and at -4 for those that do not.  Even with these settings, there is very little volume from about -35 or so down to -80, a "background level" with the sound just noticable is usually around -30 to -35. Other receivers can be set differently with an even increase in loudness as you go up the scale and others little at the start and more at the top en.


I remember years and years ago when some Pioneer integrated amps came out and all the university guys thought they were the greatest amps ever...the volume settings gave lots of volume with the control just turned on, sounded so much louder than amps that had to be "turned up" to get the same level....all in the design. Like in Spinal Tap.....rhis amp is louder, it goes to 11, these only go to 10!


Hope this sheds a little light..


P.E.H.



#8 of 9 OFFLINE   Jim_V

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Posted February 03 2011 - 09:22 AM

I've always suspected it has to do with sound level differences working on a log scale, instead of being linear.  As P.E.H. said, that would make it an intentional design.  You shouldn't equate how far you have to turn the amp up in order to get a set volume with the power capability of the amp or receiver.  It's not like an accelerator in a car.  You won't use up the amp sooner just because you had to turn the volume up higher.  I've got to turn the volume WAY up on my Onkyo 808 and I'm driving very efficient Energy C2 speakers.  As long as you aren't clipping, enjoy at the level you want.



#9 of 9 OFFLINE   pinkjosh

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Posted February 04 2011 - 12:12 PM

so does it mean amp's power capability has no relation with its volume level.  I mean is it not like if amplifier has, say 1000 Watts then minimum volume (whatever -ve or +ve) will seek least power from amp and highest volume level will seek max amp power, in this case 1000 W.  I mean is it like that or its different concept ?