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Thou Shalt Not: A message from consumers to DVD producers


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#1 of 122 Vince Maskeeper

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Posted June 04 2003 - 02:51 AM

I've been thinking about this for a while, but figured maybe the time had finally come. It seems with all the varying opinions of DVD producers, manuafcturers and studios on how DVD should be presented- it seems like the time has come to try to put together some solid guidelines from Consumers on what we really want, no MUST HAVE from DVD product.

I thought maybe I would take the best ideas and put together a finalized declaration of the Thou shalt not's of dvd production and packaging.

-vince
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#2 of 122 DeathStar1

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Posted June 04 2003 - 03:18 AM

Am I the only one ticked by the fact that most companies now make you sit through their logos and 'these comments do not represent the company' warning threads, among other stuff, before getting right to the menu or movie?

It takes a minute or longer now just to get to the main menu, let alone start the movie up. At least in the days of VHS you could FF past this stuff.

Also, why do PCDVD players allow you to snap stills, but most disks disable this feature? There are ways to bypass it(wich I won't mention as a potential taboo subject) but it's a pain in the neck to do involving the moving of computers and desks in order to hook up wires for a few simple wallpaper snaps.

Anyone else have this as a pet peeve of yours?

#3 of 122 CaptDS9E

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Posted June 04 2003 - 03:19 AM

NO fullscreen. almost screwed that one up :-)

#4 of 122 Lars Vermundsberget

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Posted June 04 2003 - 03:21 AM

Be careful. We shall not always have widescreen.

#5 of 122 James L White

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Posted June 04 2003 - 03:27 AM

OAR!!!!!!!!!!!!
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#6 of 122 DaViD Boulet

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Posted June 04 2003 - 03:37 AM

* All DVDs should present program material in its origianl aspect ratio (whether film, TV shows, whatever) and modified aspect ratio presentations may be included as an option *in addition* to the origial presentation format.

* All program material with an aspect ratio 1.59:1 (which includes the common 1.66:1 aspect ratio) or wider should be presented in 16x9-encoded (anamorphic WS) form and *not* merely letterboxed in a 4x3 frame.

* All 2.0 DD soundtracks should be encoded at 348 kbps minimum and not the usual 192 kbps rate which sounds clearly inferior to linear PCM.

* The rule of thumb for mastering should be to use minimal filtering. A higher-average bit-rate should be the first choice with challenging material...NOT the filtering of HF detail. More and more folks are watching DVDs projeted on large-screen systems and the level of filtering often employed during mastering can render a DVD image void of all fine detail on a big-screen. Filtering should only be applied when the maxiumum bit-rate that the DVD can yield still results in distracting MPEG artifacting.

* traditional DNR algorithms produce horrid artifacting on large-screen presentations (often confused with MPEG artifacting) and should be avoided at all costs. Back-ground detail and imagry tends to suffer the most...as does detail in moving objects such as an actor's face during a zoom-in or close up. DNR should be used only as a last-resort when source materials are in excessively poor condition and should be used sparingly and with great oversight to ensure minimal artifacts when viewed on a large-screen display.

* Edge Enhancement or ringing associated from such "EE" should never be added to the video signal under normal circumstances. If any haloing or ringing is visible on a 100" screen from 1.5 screen-widths away then too much HF emphasis has been applied. A better image results from less filtering and more real detail.

* Film-grain and other film-related artifacts that are a natural and artistic part of the film process should not be eliminated or filtered our during disc-mastering. Expections would be when the only remaining source elements are much more grainy than the fine-grain prints that the director would have approved for theatrical presentation. Excesssive print-damage may also be cleaned up for home-video presentation...but inherent film grain should not automatically be considered a 'defect' that needs to be "fixed" for DVD.

Botom line: The job of the mastering/compression/and final DVD image is to represent the source film elements (per the inetentions of the director) with as much fidelity as possible.

* When multi-channel audio elements exist, these should be used for DVD sound mastering even if the surround-channel is mono (yielding a 4.0 or 4.1 DD configuration). 2-channel "Dolby Surround" matrixed mix-downs should not be used unless no discrete source elements exist.

*If the inclusion of "extra" content such as commentary, deleted scenes, or documentaries begins to tax the bit-alocation available for video to the point where picture quality will suffer (leading to the temptation to filter out HF detail to aid in compression) then the "extras" should be eliminated or moved to a 2nd disc. The concept of "super bit" vs "regular" DVD should not exist. Every DVD should be mastered to provide optimal picture and sound as a first-priority. Extras are a great selling point and collectors will pay a few dollars more to have them included on a 2nd disc if necessary to preserve image/sound integrity of the feature presentation.

More to come....
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#7 of 122 Andrew Chong

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Posted June 04 2003 - 03:40 AM

Thou shalt not multi-dip (double-dip/triple-dip/etc.).

Thou shalt not dub any non-English speaking person whether his or her involvement was in front of or behind the camera.

Thou shalt offer subtitles for any non-English speaking person whether his or her involvement was in front of or behind the camera.
ac

#8 of 122 wally

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Posted June 04 2003 - 03:46 AM

Thou shalt not rush a DVD to market by; producing quick shoddy transfers and soundtracks, skipping research into available supplements.

I’d rather wait to buy the one and only SE than have to purchase the Collectors Edition, then Mega Edition Ultra Bit, then Jumbo Mega Edition with DTS, and Excessive Jumbo Mega Edition with 30 seconds of restored material.Posted Image

OAR is a given

#9 of 122 Clinton McClure

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Posted June 04 2003 - 03:47 AM

Thou shalt not issue separate OAR/P&S releases...put them on the same disc, one per side.

#10 of 122 Michael St. Clair

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Posted June 04 2003 - 03:54 AM

A DVD of any film that was originally released in mono or stereo will include the original soundtrack in addition to any newer mixes that have been added.

#11 of 122 Bill Williams

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Posted June 04 2003 - 03:56 AM

* Thou shalt not advertise other non-related films on a DVD while leaving out the trailers to the film that you are watching. Case in point: Star Trek: Nemesis. Why they included the trailer to The Others on the DVD but not Nemesis' own trailers is a travesty.

* Thou shalt not have long unnecessary gaps in the audio commentary where the narrator says nothing. Case in point: Ben-Hur, where there are long gaps between moments where Charlton Heston speaks.

* Thou shalt not reissue DVDs that already had excellent full-package versions with single-disc, movie-only versions. Cases in point: Independence Day, Close Encounters of the Third Kind, Lawrence of Arabia, and the upcoming Gladiator. Do DVD producers and studios think we're really that gullible to even consider getting a stripped-down version the second time around when the first version had all the extras to it? Which would you rather buy, a hamburger with all the trimmings or just a piece of meat between two pieces of bread with nothing on it, as plain as it can be? (The only exceptions I would have to this rule would be the SuperBit titles, because of the higher quality of the SuperBit processing for the film's audio and video. They are excused.)

* Thou shalt not re-package and re-issue DVDs with just a couple of extra different featurettes just to lure the consumer into double-dipping again. Cases in point: Men in Black and The Fast and The Furious: Tricked Out Edition. Both had good solid presentations the first time around and then were repackaged with one or two new extras and re-sold under different titles such as "Collector's Edition" or "Tricked Out Edition". Who are they fooling? (Exception: the new T2 Extreme DVD, because of its higher quality reproduction rate.)

* Thou shalt not package season box sets at a nearly-cost prohibitive price tag to break the consumers' pocketbook. This one is especially directed at Paramount with their Star Trek season box sets for TNG, DS9, and eventually Voyager. $100 a pop isn't going to cut it, when other studios are releasing their season box sets at more affordable prices, like the Buffy box sets, which are far more affordable. Not all consumers are that rich, Paramount. There are many who are finding more affordable deals online through eBay or Amazon.com. Be kind to those of us who are working-class people.

That's my two cents' worth. Enjoy! Posted Image
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#12 of 122 Jeff Jacobson

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Posted June 04 2003 - 03:59 AM

A program's soundtrack should not be polluted with extra sound effects that were never intended to be there. (Like what Rhino did with The Transformers boxed sets.)

#13 of 122 Michael Reuben

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Posted June 04 2003 - 03:59 AM

Thou shalt implement clear, consistent, standardized and legible labeling procedures for such things as aspect ratio, 16:9 enhancement, soundtracks, subtitles, closed captioning and running time. The model should be the system used on the back cover of DVDs by Universal and Dreamworks, and recently adopted by Fox.

M.
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#14 of 122 Jon Robertson

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Posted June 04 2003 - 04:05 AM

Thou shalt not waste mine time with irksome, spoiler-filled animated menus, nor shalt thou force commercials upon mine eyes after entering thy disc.

#15 of 122 Craig S

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Posted June 04 2003 - 04:05 AM

Thou shalt not disable the ability of my DVD player to switch audio tracks on the fly.

Thou shalt not deviate from the standard height & depth of the Holy Keepcase in thy DVD packaging.

Three truths about movies, as noted by Roger Ebert:

 

* It's not what a movie is about, it's how it is about it.

* No good movie is too long, and no bad movie is short enough.

* No good movie is depressing, all bad movies are depressing.


#16 of 122 Russell G

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Posted June 04 2003 - 04:04 AM

Thou shall always allow us to chapter forward past promotional material we do not wish to see, including the FBI/ INTERPOL/ copyright warnings and animated menues.

#17 of 122 Bill Williams

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Posted June 04 2003 - 04:08 AM

"Thou shall always allow us to chapter forward past promotional material we do not wish to see, including the FBI/ INTERPOL/ copyright warnings and animated menues."

I agree! Here here! That's another shot against the recent Nemesis DVD. Well said! Posted Image
"I have in my heart what it takes to run with the big dogs in this life, and nobody can say otherwise."

"Attention all personnel. Tonight's movie is a holdover from last week and will be shown right after supper, which is also a holdover from last week."

#18 of 122 Jeff Kleist

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Posted June 04 2003 - 04:18 AM

Quote:
Thou shalt not multi-dip (double-dip/triple-dip/etc.).


Welcome to the video business. The whole thing is based around making you rebuy. And they're not going to stop just because it pisses you off. Sell your old one on Ebay, buy the new

Quote:
Thou shalt not reissue DVDs that already had excellent full-package versions with single-disc, movie-only versions.


See previous comment, also it costs money to pay royalties on the documentaries, and more importantly, it takes double the time on the line to press a 2-disc set. By moving it in and out as a 1 disc and a 2 disc set, not only do they cover the "I don't care about extras" crowd, but they reduced the space in the warehouse the title takes up, save the money in the interim, and it'll be back. Fox is cycling back in a lot of their 2 disc sets over the next year, hopefully this time Abyss will be anamorphic.

Quote:
* Thou shalt not package season box sets at a nearly-cost prohibitive price tag to break the consumers' pocketbook. This one is especially directed at Paramount with their Star Trek season box sets for TNG, DS9, and eventually Voyager. $100 a pop isn't going to cut it,


As I've said in many posts. The reason why X-Files and Trek are so expensive is the HUGE royalty payments to the actors involved. Easily 1/3 of the wholesale price on both shows is going JUST to actor/producer/creator royalties. Buffy and the other shows do not have these ludicrous contracts.

#19 of 122 James L White

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Posted June 04 2003 - 04:23 AM

*thou shalt include a "play all" option on TV discs.
*thou shalt release obscure titles(Max Dugan Returns and Moving Violations are 2 that shalt be on DVD) on DVD, in their OAR with good a/v and some extras for a reasonable price.
* Thou shalt stop using snappers cases or you will be doomed to DVD hell, that's you WB!!!!!!
* thou shalt not release faulty DVDs
* thou shalt not announce a release only to pull it form the schedule
*thou shalt pick up the pace on the Simpsons DVDs
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#20 of 122 Rob Gardiner

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Posted June 04 2003 - 04:48 AM

What David Boulet said. Posted Image Posted Image





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