Buffy Season 3 problems ? (1 Viewer)

Matt Naglieri · Jan 3, 2003

I just got my copy yesterday and noticed a slight problem with at least the first episode.

In season three the shows theme song was re-recorded so it sounds slightly different then the version used for seasons one and two. Now the problem lies in the fact that in episode one the old theme is used and it sounds muffled. I quickly checked another episode on the disc and it was fine but have not had time to check the others.

Now what is getting me ticked off is that the region 2 version has the correct theme so this was deliberately changed for the US release and i'd like to know why.

I'm hope someone could shed some light on this and report on any additional problems that may turn up.

Dave Mack · Jan 3, 2003

I'm hoping that Season 3 is flagged correctly. The 1st 2 sets are flagged for FILM mode (prog. scan...) and since Buffy is edited on VIDEO, you get combs at virtually EVERY edit. If you force your player into VIDEO mode, you get shimmering on credits and other anaomalies.
Also, the quality was pretty shoddy on those.
Here's hoping Season 3 looks better!

D

Matt Naglieri · Jan 3, 2003

The 1st 2 sets are flagged for FILM mode (prog. scan...) and since Buffy is edited on VIDEO, you get combs at virtually EVERY edit. If you force your player into VIDEO mode, you get shimmering on credits and other anaomalies.

I noticed this issue on season 3 as well. I believe that this wouldn't be an issue if you were using both a progressive scan dvd player with a progressive scan television but if i'm wrong hopefully someone will correct me.

as far as picture quality it looked pretty decent but just about identical to the UK release.

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Dave Mack · Jan 3, 2003

Hey Matt, Actually it is unfortunately... I have both a Prog. scan player and Hdtv capable of displaying Native 480P signals, and on Season 1 and 2, and The "Sex and the city" sets it is the case and VERY annoying! The "Friends" Box set is flagged correctly. (VIDEO mode)
How can this be the 3rd BUFFY set released this way? In my opinion, it is a defect!
YES, they are shot on Film, but edited on VIDEO and the video edits break the 3/2 pulldown cadence.
:frowning: Bummed in NYC....

Matt Naglieri · Jan 3, 2003

It is rather unfortunate especially since i'm getting my first HDTV tomorrow and was looking foward to watching it again.

I have also noticed the same thing with the combing in the uk pressing especially season 2 which was released there I think 2 years ago and they have had more then adaquate time to correct this.

While it is an exception value compare to other sets that shouldn't mean quality gets compromised.

Also I should mention that inside is a flyer for season 4 which is due in june. In the UK they are presented in widescreen however I have a bad feeling they will screw it up since it wasn't aired that way here and I've heard numerous times that Joss Whedon prefers buffy cropped to 4:3.

Adam_ME · Jan 3, 2003

Yes, please. Someone let me know if the combs are in the Season 3 transfers. I hated the way those looked in Season 2. Also, I still haven't gotten a definitive yes or no on whether Fox included the "Previously on Buffy" intros on each episode. At this rate, I may as well just hang onto my Region 4 set.

As for which aspect ratio the Region 1 Buffy Season 4 set will have, while I do prefer the widescreen composition for the episodes, they do reveal numerous mistakes such as crew members and even the cameraman himself. So if Joss does force Fox to go 4:3, it's not the worst thing that could happen.

StevenJ · Jan 3, 2003

I don't mean anything mean, but does it make a difference if the theme on only the first episode is different?

James Reader · Jan 3, 2003

Also I should mention that inside is a flyer for season 4 which is due in june. In the UK they are presented in widescreen however I have a bad feeling they will screw it up since it wasn't aired that way here and I've heard numerous times that Joss Whedon prefers buffy cropped to 4:3.

And it should be presented in 4:3. Why do people obviously assume that as something was shot using widescreen equipment it was composed that way and will look better that way? Could it be some widescreen television owners are just as desperate as 4:3 owning 'Joe Six Packs' to 'fill their screens'?

Many scenes on the UK discs have dead space to the left and right of the picture and in some cases, items clearly not intended to be shown are visible (for instance, hands shaking branches on one of the episodes).

Season 5 seems to have sorted most of these problems out and would be the first season I would say should be presented on DVD in the widescreen format.

Of course, Angel is composed for widescreen and should be presented that way on all releases (Season 1 in the UK was 4:3)

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Dan Rudolph · Jan 4, 2003

Angel's first season was fullscreen. It went to wide as of season two.

James Reader · Jan 4, 2003

Angel's first season was fullscreen. It went to wide as of season two.

It was filmed with widescreen capable equipment though. I belive it was offered in Widescreen for showing on Channel 4 in the UK (who turned it down and - eventually - showed it in 4:3).

This reason (along with other international broadcasters decisions to only take the 4:3 version one supposes) is the reason given for the 4:3 release on DVD - FOX insist that no television uptake of the widescreen presentation resulted in no suitable widescreen masters being created.

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Christian Preischl · Jan 4, 2003

Believe me, Angel Season 2 has just as many WS glitches as Buffy does. They still composed it with mainly 4:3 in mind.

Chris

Dan Rudolph · Jan 4, 2003

I'm sorry, typo there. Angel wwent to widescreen (for US broadcasts) as of Season 3.

Matt Naglieri · Jan 4, 2003

StevenJ

Also, I still haven't gotten a definitive yes or no on whether Fox included the "Previously on Buffy" intros on each episode.

I haven't watched every single episode but from what I can tell the majority of them do have it.

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Michael Reuben · Jan 4, 2003

I haven't watched every single episode but from what I can tell the majority of them do have it.

They aren't there on "The Prom" or either part of "Graduation Day". I can't recall now for certain whether they were there originally, but I believe they were.

M.

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Robert Ringwald · Jan 4, 2003

Buffy season 4 and up will most likely be in widescreen simply because they'll use the same masters that were used for other regions.

Derek Miner · Jan 4, 2003

As I said in my earlier post it's correct on the UK version so someone at fox deliberately went out of their way to change it and if it was that important to make the change then I would believe it is equally important to warrant an explanation.

That's not necessarily true. Buffy has always aired in the UK on a delayed schedule. In that time, new masters are prepared in PAL. The US broadcast master could have had the "old" theme music by design (or because the "new" theme wasn't ready perhaps), but when the UK version was mastered, the new theme would have been ready by then.

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Matt Naglieri · Jan 4, 2003

That is a possibility however there are sound effects combined with the opening music and they do not match up with what is being shown. What is used was specific to season 2 and basically there is something unique about the opening credits each season.

I seriously doubt that it was aired that way here in the US but I won't dismiss the idea that it might have been until I hear something official. Hopefully someone might know more about this.

James Reader · Jan 4, 2003

That's not necessarily true. Buffy has always aired in the UK on a delayed schedule. In that time, new masters are prepared in PAL.

Er. I'm not an expert on this matter so anybody is free to correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think FOX do prepare PAL masters for international sales.
I say this because many people have mentioned how poor Buffy looks when shown on SKY ONE (a subscription based satellite channel which is majority owned by News International and shows Buffy first in the UK) while I'm sure I have read on the [Doctor Who] Restoration Team forum [available here - but any such posts are long gone now] that the BBC themselves convert the Buffy masters to PAL before they show it.
As I say I could be wrong. Not being able to get access to SKY myself (I live in a flat and dishes are not allowed and cable is no longer being laid in my area) I have no first hand knowledge of SKY's Buffy transmissions.

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Michael Reuben · Jan 5, 2003

I'm hoping that Season 3 is flagged correctly. The 1st 2 sets are flagged for FILM mode (prog. scan...) and since Buffy is edited on VIDEO, you get combs at virtually EVERY edit

I've watched 4 complete episodes from the season 3 box. They appear to be flagged for film mode, but I did not notice any combing artifacts. The image quality is a noticeable improvement over season 2.

If you're correct that the episodes are "shot on Film, but edited on VIDEO and the video edits break the 3/2 pulldown cadence", then I'm not sure what DVD mastering could do to correct the problem. It sounds like the problem is inherent in the source. However, this is the first I've heard of the problem, so there may be a technical dimension of which I'm unaware.

M.

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Dave Mack · Jan 5, 2003

Hey, Michael
Actually, they should be flagged for VIDEO mode, like The FRIENDS box sets are. Is your player in an AUTO mode, or a SMART mode? If so, your player might be dropping into VIDEO mode at the edits, therfore covering up the combs, but depending on your deinterlacing chip, it can take anywhere from 4 to dozens of frames to go back into a FILM mode. If you can "force" your player into FILM mode, you will probably see the combs. I watch BUFFY in forced VIDEO mode to eliminate them, but there is some shimmering then ESPECIALLY on the credits and the pic. looks a hair softer.
At least the episodes should look better on Season 3 thanx to the bigger budget and the switch to 35 mm....

D

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