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Timbre Matching - Consolidated thread

Discussion in 'Speakers' started by Rick Moore, Aug 1, 2003.

  1. David_Stein

    David_Stein Well-Known Member

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    a short answer, ill let someone else get technical:

    when you are watching movies (DD, DTS, other surround modes), sounds will be spread across multiple speakers and even will move from one speaker to another as it moves across the screen. different speakers (from different manufacturers as well as different lines within a single maker) have different sonic characteristics due to many things (one that a lot of people point to is the tweeter type and size). if your speakers are timber-matched, as a sound moves from speaker to speaker the sound will sound exactly the same in each speaker. if they aren't then there will be differences in the sound (maybe in one speaker the bass of a helicopter moving across the screen sounds muddier).
     
  2. John Garcia

    John Garcia Well-Known Member

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    I don't really know why you feel it necessary to BARE anything while discussing timbre...[​IMG] j/k
     
  3. Neil Joseph

    Neil Joseph Well-Known Member

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    Yes, you would like the Ferrari moving across the soundstage to continually sound like a Ferrari and not sound like a Yugo as it moves via the centre speaker for instance. Ideally, the same type of speaker could be used for the front, centre, surround and rear centre speakers. Also, even when identical speakers are used, they can have different sonic characteristics if they are mounted at different heights. If equal height of all of the speakers cannot be obtained (which is under a perfect world because it hardly ever can), then the next best thing is to "aim" the speakers in such a way that the tweeters point towards the listener's ears while seated.
     
  4. Craig Woodhall

    Craig Woodhall Well-Known Member

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    once I switched to all Paradigm reference, when sounds pan around, they sound identical no matter what speaker it is coming from.

    Craig
     
  5. Scott Beaver

    Scott Beaver Member

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    Nathan,

    You will definitely get the "best" sound with another 170. However, all of the speakers need not match in order to enjoy rear channel material. I used mismatched rear surrounds while waiting for a replacement for a speaker that was DOA from the factory. Though not perfect, it enhanced my home theater experience and was enjoyable.

    I say give the speaker you already have a try. If the mismatch is annoying or detracts from your enjoyment, shell out for another 170. Otherwise, enjoy rear channel encoding on your Energy.

    -Beave
     
  6. Cagri

    Cagri Well-Known Member

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    I sometimes find it difficult to understand the administration principals of these boards. People sometimes ask questions about solid problems seeking for some help and noone replies, but on same subject with same topic there are two threads on the board and not only 3 members but also a moderator replies, and it's a subject covered completely in many previous threads in the past as well...
     
  7. Kevin C Brown

    Kevin C Brown Well-Known Member

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    How do you test, listen for timbre matching? Nobody has really touched on this one aspect of it yet. [​IMG]

    I use 3 ways pretty much:

    1) The white noise tests on Avia, the Chesky Ultimate disc, pick your favorite DVD test disc, and any internal pre/pro test tones. Listen for differences in how the white noise sounds at the listening position. I've found most differences are in the higher frequencies when I've checked out various speakers in my system.

    2) There is this great track on the Chesky Ultimate disc, where they pan a musical selection among the 5 speakers. Really nice for comparing real material. #17 with Ana Caram.

    3) Then, I just watch a lot of movies. Here, the main thing I listen for, is if any speaker *stands out* from any other, or from the overall soundfield. (Pans too, obviously, although I've never really been able to hear timbre matching problems this way when watching a movie. Pans might be more useful, if for example the video is turned off so you can focus on the audio.) All the levels are calibrated, all phases correct, etc.

    For example, I was a big proponent of all direct radiators for surrounds and rears in a 7.1 system. I'm beginning to rethink that, because of #3. The surrounds specifically, can be just too localizeable with some elements of some movies. Still investigating maybe changing placement, or swapping speakers for this one...

    How do *you* do it? [​IMG]
     
  8. Philip Hamm

    Philip Hamm Well-Known Member

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    Interesting topic, and one that is relevant to my recent thread on rear centers that no-one has answered.

    I do the same thing, listen to the white noise sweeps and notice the differences. Now you've got me rethinking my rears..... [​IMG]
     
  9. peter m. wilson

    peter m. wilson Well-Known Member

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    Hi Kevin,

    It's the phrase timbre matching that I'm wrestling with.

    I own (excluding the sub) 3 different sets of speakers. For the sake of this discussion, and since I run a 7.1 system (a pair is a set sometimes)

    My generallity here is that if you buy a set of speakers at the same time, they should be automatically timber matched (thats the idea of buying a pair or a larger set of the same speakers.

    I have a set of 5 Totem Model 1 speakers including the center which are supposed to be timber matched automatically. I use these for music and for HT

    I have a pair of Axiom QS4 dipoles which I also expect are timber matched. I use these for HT (surrounds B) and sometimes for HIREZ music if it is a live album.

    I have a pair of Monitor Audio Bronze B1's which I also expect are timber matched. I use these as effects speakers for the EX or ES portion of films offering this feature. Sometimes for sports I'll use 7ch stereo or some other DSP option on the reciever and invoke all spakers at once which would be 10 including the subwoofer.

    Now, I have an upgraded Denon 5800 which through it's setup features and proprietary pink noise sound measuring features, and with the help of a RadioShack SPL meter, I have adjusted distances and calibrated everything to 75db to the sweet spot in the room.

    This is as close to timber matching that I feel is possible for my setup.

    If you look at things differently please explain.

    Peter m.
     
  10. Chu Gai

    Chu Gai Well-Known Member

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    If you find deficiencies, then what approach do you take?
     
  11. David_Stein

    David_Stein Well-Known Member

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    thats a simple answer: and its that these kinds of questions have simple answers, whereas the real problems have answers that may require that the threadstarter wait for someone who has the same or similar equipment, has experienced a similar problem, and knows the answer (and if no one knows the answer, there may be no replies)
     
  12. Chris Quinn

    Chris Quinn Well-Known Member

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    Well Cagri, it tells you that you get more responses if you included nudity in your thread title. [​IMG]
     
  13. peter m. wilson

    peter m. wilson Well-Known Member

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    Hi Chu,
    To whom are you addressing.
    Peter m.
     
  14. Justin Ward

    Justin Ward Well-Known Member

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    My Titans/Atoms/CC-170 sound slightly different with pink/white noise tests. I've never been able to notice a difference with normal program material though.
     
  15. peter m. wilson

    peter m. wilson Well-Known Member

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    Hi,
    If you have spl'd them to the sweet spot, then my guess would be that there is something either absorbing or reflecting the sound of one of them.

    If that difference is not obvious when listen ing to a movie or music, my suggestion would be to just use and enjoy.

    peter m.
     
  16. Neil Joseph

    Neil Joseph Well-Known Member

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  17. Cagri

    Cagri Well-Known Member

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    That was a criticism rather than a question and I believe it was posted in the correct place.
     
  18. Lew Crippen

    Lew Crippen Well-Known Member

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  19. Cagri

    Cagri Well-Known Member

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  20. Kevin C Brown

    Kevin C Brown Well-Known Member

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    Dang, I'm still curious as to how others listen for timbre matching! [​IMG]
     

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