What makes Fox beholden to Blu-Ray? (1 Viewer)

[FrancisP]

There are many sources that a pirated dvd can come from. A pirated version
of the last Star Wars movie came from a working copy that was stolen from George Lucas' workplace. In other countries, you can bribe people to get ahold of the prints long enough to create a master.

I don't believe copy protection has been about stopping piracy. What it is about is creating new revenue streams. Hollywood is pushing Congress to insert broadcast flags that can control digital recorders and making the hardware to read them mandatory in computers as well as digital recorders.
These and other bills are clearly aimed at extending their control over content
and curtailing the ability to time shift.

Disney has never ruled out releasing in HD-DVD. They have said they don't expect to but they have not ruled it out. I think blu-ray has 12-18 months after PS3 comes out. If it is a stalemate or worse then Disney will release in HD-DVD. Fox will be dragged kicking and screaming eventually. Fox is the same company that gave away 50 of their titles to Magnetic Video because they didn't think home video would be viable.

 

[Sanjay Gupta]

What Fox did 25 yrs ago has no bearing on how the company makes it's decisions today. I am sure not too many of the people who ran Fox back then, have any say at all in what Fox does now. In fact even the ownership of Fox has changed since then. Companies don't make decisions, rather it is the people that own and work for the comapny's that do. Thus when the people in a company change, so does the company's decision making.

While on the subject of Fox, any comparison of Fox picking Blu-Ray with that of Fox siding with Divx is irrelevent. DVD & Divx were not two seperate products, rather DIVX was just an offshoot of DVD. While one can argue about the technological benefits of Blu-ray over HD-DVD and vice versa, such was not the case with DVD & Divx. Divx was simply DVD with curtailed features and with technology that gave control of a consumers hardware to the software companies, not to mention the privacy issues with DIVX. In return for what the consumer had to give up, Divx did not offer even a single benefit over DVD. I personally was dead against Divx and was quite sure it did not stand a chance in the market place, but with Blu-Ray I still feel that Fox has bet correctly.

 

[FrancisP]

The bottom line is that fox's judgement in terms of home entertainment has been very poor. One can say they have been behind the curve since the dawn of the home video era. Plus it seems that their attitude has been very anti-consumer. Their decision to support blu-ray only is another finger in the face of the consumer. It seems poetic justice that the studio's most attractive titles, the Star Wars titles, are off the table.

 

[Bob Black]

The DIVX / Blu-Ray comparison is very relevant in regards to Fox and their home video decisions. They backed both formats due to their incessant paranoia of piracy.

While forward-thinking Warner Brothers were setting records with their DVD sales of "The Matrix" in 1999, Fox CEO Bill Mechanic was chastising Warner for their release of a big-budget hit on DVD at an inexpensive price.

If you recall, Fox was against the DVD format completely, favoring Digital Video Tape to the optical disc format. Then, with the advent of DVD inevitable, Fox continued to fight for adoption of a rental-pricing structure with DVD - wanting to release their new titles with $80 - $100 prices for the rental industry with a 6-month lag for sell-through prices. Even when they finally gave in after DIVX crashed and burned, their first releases were prices at ridiculous MSRP as high as $39.99! And if you've seen their prices for BD releases, it looks like history repeating itself once again!

Fox has ALWAYS chosen the least consumer-friendly approach in their HT history. Those of us who purchased LD's for years remember that Fox titles were consistently higher than other studios' releases. A single disc release was typically $50 or higher from Fox while others averaged around $35.

Fox has a great catalog of films in their archives but personally I am tired of their approach to home video. I find their paranoia of piracy ironic considering they historically try to bilk we consumers for every dime...apparently they haven't figured out the fact that price gouging leads to piracy!

 

[Robert Crawford]

I am not happy with Fox's initial pricing of their BRD and have stated so several times on this forum, but let's be a little fair with our criticism. Over the years, I've bought many Fox individual dvds that were priced very competitively and in some cases, moreso than Warner. However, Fox's recent pricing of their boxsets is much higher than what Warner is offering, thus I have criticized Fox for doing so because I think it has affected the number of boxset units sold. Now, as far as them trying to take advantage of the early adopters, that is something I can't and won't defend except to say that I won't be buying very many of their initial BRD. So far, I've ordered only one of their titles. Most of my business will be going to the other studios such as Warner, Paramount and Sony who have priced their BRD at a more reasonable price point.

Also, I'm talking about BRD prices of catalog titles, not films that have been released over the last year or so. All of the the studios appear to be consistent in pricing their newer titles at that higher price point.





Crawdaddy

 

[Bob Black]

Sure, Robert. Fox has budget-priced DVD's now, like all the other studios. They just price-gouge any chance they can get with every format that has come down the pipeline. They need to price DVD's competitively now or they wouldn't continue to move their catalog titles - the market has dictated such. Fox has to be literally forced, kicking & screaming, into lowering prices on their media.

And it's not just the pricing - it's the arrogant personalities behind the company's home video division. First Bill Mechanic and now Mike Dunn. Here are a couple of his pathetic quotes:

"Consumers will choose the winning format. For emotional and rational reasons, they will pick Blu-ray. I assure you HD DVD is not gaining ground"

"First of all, the format war is really only going on in the press. Come the late fourth quarter, starting in November, Blu-ray is going to be showing huge numbers. The early adopter is going Blu-ray, and I think it will be readily apparent to that crucial second tier of consumers that Blu-ray is the obvious choice."

Just a little too full of himself & his beliefs.

 

[TravisR]

What is he going to say? "Eh, I think we're making the right decision but I may be wrong." Of course, he's going to act like it's a brilliant move.

 

[Joseph DeMartino]

Meanwhile, Warner Home Video is cutting its projections for both HD-DVD and BD in half for the year because of an expected shortage of hi-def hardware.

A bit early to declare a winner in the format war, I'd say.

Regards,

Joe

 

[Bob Black]

With HD-DVD software outselling BD by a 11:1 ratio, you don't think it arrogant of him to claim "there is no format war"?

I expect biases but not sheer stupidity!

 

[PeterTHX]

Amazon is the only seller of discs on the planet?

Talk about skew bias.

 

[Cheech]

The most recent Videoscan shows 10:1. Close enough?

At any rate, it is meaningless until after the holidays. No studio is going to do anything yet. The investments have been made, discs scheduled. That's why these discussions are all hypotheticals and "blah blah blah", it's just a waiting game right now.

 

[Ed St. Clair]

Peter,
I believe the 11 to 1 margin is from Videoscan, not Amazon.
Amazon numbers I've seen, have been as high as 132 to 1.

 

[RobertDW]

My guess is the real reason Warner cut their projections is because of the anemic sales of BD software.

 

[PeterTHX]

Not BD software, lack of hardware. If you read the article, they cite the delay in Panasonic, Pioneer, and Sony players which should have been released by now.

OK, about the videoscan numbers...

Those titles will never be "sold" much again. Note that they are NEW titles, to a closed (Toshiba) market.

We have 3 new BD players coming on line. We have the PS3 coming out. Ever hear of a snowball effect?
Same thing with the number of titles available. As more & more studios flex their catalogs the studio advantage will grow greater.

We'll see after the holiday how this all pans out.

 

[Eric DiPiazza]

How about all those people waiting on the Xbox 360 HD DVD drive. They will only buy the newly released titles? I don't think so. Plus many people will be picking up HD DVD players for the holidays, so they too will buy the already released titles. BD is also not the only format coming out with new players. It's not like HD DVD will only have the ones out now and that's it. So that argument is kind of silly.

And like you said, there is now way to really know who may win until after the holidays. Anything up till then is just speculation. Like someone already mentioned, it's just a waiting game at this point. Why else would Lion's Gate and Disney not want to release on HD DVD at this point? As of right now, we clearly have the numbers...but that means nothing until after the holidays as far as they're concerned. Only time will tell.

 

[PeterTHX]

I think it's ironic that a lot of the folks that say "I'll never play my movies on a game machine!" or dismiss the PS3 capabilities are the same ones that see the XBOX 360 add-on as good news. (I'm not directing this at you Eric)

And it's likely the PS3 will put more BD players in homes this holiday than HD DVD has for all of 2006. After the holidays people will start buying discs for their new machines.

All this is speculation. But I ask, what is more likely? The PS3 or the XBOX 360 tilting things to their respective formats?

 

[Robert Crawford]

Let's not make out that Fox is suddenly dropped the pricing of their dvd catalog titles now. They lowered the pricing of their dvds several years ago. Furthermore, it was Paramount and Sony studios that were the last ones to price their catalog dvds more competitively after MGM, Warner and Fox were selling more units than those two studios.

As far as statements from Fox executives only time will tell if they come true or not, but they made a commitment to Blu-ray which is the bed they have to sleep in for a while. I can't fault them for doing so just like I can't fault Universal for doing the same with HD DVD. In the end, we'll see which of them made the correct choice.



Crawdaddy

 

[Eric DiPiazza]

Oh, I know you're not directing it at me because this is the first I've posted on the "video game" subject. No hard feelings here. You make a good point that I agree with. You can't overlook the "videogame" factor at all.

Obviously the PS3 is what the whole war is going to come down to and it will have more influence than the Xbox 360 HD drive. But will the PS3 and 360 owners buy as many HD films as those with actual players? That's the real question. Because like always, the joe-six-packs will play a HUGE role in deciding who wins as well. Now do the majority of those people watch movies on their video game systems, or on players? I don't really know, but I'm thinking players. I would assume that people who watch stuff only on their video game systems are a niche market like the early adopters who buy almost every release. That's why I think player price is still a big factor in this war. If/when joe-six-pack decides to go HD and both formats are still around, I'm sure that he will go for the cheaper one which is HD DVD at this point. So as long as HD DVD can survive the PS3, I think it has a good chance.

 

[Robert Crawford]

Like his comments are going to sway the outcome of this format war. He's beating the drums for his studio's preferred format which is part of his job.

 

[FrancisP]

I think that MS is playing it smart. They built a basic gaming unit that will be cheaper than PS3. If someone wants to play movies then they can add the add-on. With PS3, gamers are subsidizing blu-ray. I do believe that PS3 will lose some market share because of it.

Neither format is selling well enough to be declared a success. The survivor may well become a niche. For it to become mainstream then it has to appeal to the average person. I saw someone at BB say "why should I buy this again?" very sarcastically. That is one of the questions HD is going to have to answer. The average person may not want to see every blade of grass. They may have a HD ready tv and assume its HD. Then when they see the picture, there is no huge difference. They may not want to purchase these movies again. There are a host of obstacles to HD becoming mainstream.