War of the Worlds damaged my SVS! (1 Viewer)

[John Garcia]

-20 usually refers to the level on the receiver not the sub, but it doesn't really tell you the whole story because it doesn't necessarily tell you relative to what calibrated level. Where ref cal is on one receiver depends on the room and equipment used in a given setup, so it varies from system to system.

The bass on the DTS track is quite heavy duty. Fun stuff with a good sub, which is why I have it, but not exactly a great movie.

 

[Guy Usher]

As relates to the initial post where the Pioneer receiver set the levels. On my receiver most positions are at "0" with one surround at -3 and the sub at +2 in order to have a 4dB increase in loudness over the regular speakers. In my room -20 is the level we watch most movies. It is loud when needed and low passages can be heard.

 

[Larry Sutliff]

Thanks for the info, guys. My Denon 3805 sets my sub at -1.5, so I thought there might be a problem if -20 was closer to the correct setting.:b

 

[Reginald Trent]

Does anybody have time marks for the bass/LFE in War Of The Worlds?

 

[Robert Cowan]

this thread has kinda become more of comments about the movie soundtrack than it is about subwoofers...

 

[Scott Simonian]

For WotW bass....

Waterfall charts

 

[Mike Keith]

Somewhat apples and oranges concerning the ability to play this soundtrack. No single sub will play this soundtrack at ref properly if it’s run without some limiting/filtering on the low end. Well except for a few esoteric multi driver commercial ones.

 

[Bill_D]

Wasn't really interested in WOTW this until I spied this thread. Some good bottom in this flick but I still believe The Haunting will remain my personal favorite source material to show off demonstrate the abilities of the Ultras.

The Ultras, meaning the original SVS Dual Ultra combo w/ Samson amp - serials less than 20, handled the material without any hiccups. I did find the bass in the Dolby track to be a tad more robust than in DTS. The DTS track was crisper and I had to bump the LFE a bit to equal the Dolby track. I do believe the LFE in DTS and Dolby tracks are recorded at different levels but I would be happy to be wrong and corrected concerning the differences in DTS and Dolby recording standards.

 

[Sonnie Parker]

Dan_J_H.... you might consider checking your sub response and making sure you don't have a large peak or two that taxing your sub in some way. If you do then the BFD can level this out for ya. It won't cost you a dime to check the response. Download the free RoomEQ Wizard and you'll probably never be the same. It's a lotta fun too!

 

[Steve_AS]

- The Elite 74txvi has a BASS PEAK LIMIT option to protect a subwoofer from exactly the damage reported.

- it also has a standing wave compensator as part of MCACC, that should knock down the worst one or two modal peaks at the
listening position. Make sure it's on.

- it also has a 'night listening' mode , i.e., a loudness button ;>

- is not the 0 dB level of the MCACC equivalent to 85 dB at the mic position? Or does it use some other standard value?

 

[LanceJ]

That mode (also called a dynamic range control* on other brands of receivers) seems like a loudness system, but what the night mode is actually doing is making all the lower level signals - whether they are bass, midbass, midrange, upper mids or treble - almost as loud as the highest level signals. This way, you don't have to keep turning the volume down when an explosion occurs after a scene which only involved people whispering.

Loudness systems OTOH, boost only a particular region of bass and treble frequencies to make them more audible at lower volume levels due to the way human ears operate, but does not actually change the dynamic range of the overall signal.**

Techno-nerd factoid: if you are trying to better understand something in a badly-recorded scene, using a receiver's highest signal compression setting can allow you to more clearly hear small details in such a soundtrack. Same with densely-mixed music soundtracks (musicals & dvd-audio discs with Dolby Digital tracks) though the music can end up sounding a little weird: for example, soft background vocals can get pushed very "up front", disturbing the original intent of the song.

* IIRC Yamaha receivers indicate their widest dynamic range setting by calling it the "MAX" setting (i.e. maximum amount of dynamic range), whereas most other receivers indicate this mode on their displays with "NONE" (i.e. no compression [my Technics SA-DA8 is one of these]) or something like "Minimum Compression". But make sure to read the manual to make sure of that!

** In the music business, the use of overcompression of the signal (an "extreme" nightmode if you will)is what is causing so many new CDs to sound like crap i.e. they sound in-your-face no matter what the volume level is set at, causing an effect almost like white noise (this is basically the fuzzy noise you hear in between radio stations). One of the biggest reasons for this unfortunate trend is trying to make the music sound good when its converted to MP3 form, since lossy compression software tosses anything below a certain volume level to shrink the file's size. If you've ever wondered why many of us music fans get irritated with the iPod/MP3s/etc, this music recording trend is one BIG reason.

 

[DavidSGT]

Hiya Dan,

Nice to know that SVS has passed the Customer service audit again( they are really great, aren't they) and you are getting your sub back in order again.

Have noticed that you plug one port but still have your ss filter at 20hz, pardon my ignorance but I thought you need to set at 16hz if you plug one port and for 20hz all ports must be open...

Just an observation thou', you might love it like that...

Cheers.
DavidSGT

 

[Paul Mor]

I thought it was no plugs for 26hz, one plug for 20hz, and two plugs for 16hz. I just got mine so I'd like to know for sure if I'm wrong.

To respond to original thread...I watched some of WOTW last night adn all I can say is WOW. My room is about 20x16 opening into a kitchen/breakfast area and the couch was rumbling and my PB12 Plus/2 live to see another day. This with minimal calibration and possibly ported incorrectly.

 

[Vader]

OK, I watched WotW last night, and am confused (this is unusual because…?). Many here have commented that this movie really taxed their SVS (if not blew it completely), and gave an incredible presentation. My question is, how loud are you guys going to?

Don’t get me wrong, my SVS 16-46 PCi was definitely getting a workout (a book even vibrated off the shelf during the “emergence” scene). It’s just that it didn’t “crack the foundation”, as it were.

I know it is a question of calibration, so here is mine: All speakers (sans sub) calibrated to 70dB via DVE at 00dB on the amp. The sub is calibrated to 80dB at 00dB (As I understand it, DVE’s sub calibration tone is 10dB too hot). Of course, there is room gain to consider, and the fact that Rat Shack’s SPL meter is less sensitive at low frequencies. The room is about 15 ½ x 26 x 7, with the actual theater being 15 ½ x 16 x 7 (the back 10’ being open with book cases). The amp was set to -13dB (can I say that is -18dB below reference, since my calibration was -5dB low?). I measured the peak SPL during the plane crash at my listening position to 96dB (overall, not just LFE), which is pretty typical for me. Is there something I missed when calibrating?

 

[timNGY]

Hello...I just joined the SVS club and received my PB12+ yesterday. When calibrating with the RS SPL meter, the needle bounces quite a bit on C Slow settings. Is this expected?

I also have the Pioneer 74TXVi receiver as the original poster, and noticed Auto MCACC calibrated a little low when I validated its setting with the SPL meter. It was reading around 70-71dB for the fronts and center, and about 72dB for the surrounds.

For the people that have used AVIA to calibrate the audio, which of the tones should I be using for setting the speaker channel levels, the tones listed under Main Speaker Setup->eg Left Front Level OR the tones listed under Reference Tones->xx Wideband Pink Noise?

 

[Vader]

Welcome aboard, Tim...

My Denon auto setup sets everything around 70dB as well, which is why I calibrated around it instead of the 75dB that is reference for DVE (85dB for you since you are using AVIA). With the rest of my speakers balanced at 70dB, the sub jumps between 79dB and 82dB.

 

[timNGY]

I thought receivers send out 75dB test tones at reference level. Should you adjust your channel levels to read 75dB on an SPL meter?

 

[Vader]

Actually, the Denon's test tones, by themselves did come out close to 75dB. However, when I measured the DVE test tones (which give the more accurate calibration to reference), they were only at 70dB, using the SPL levels the Denon set. I could have raised the bar across the board to 75dB (and 85dB for the sub), but since I never listen anywhere close to reference, I saw little point. 6 of one, half-dozen of the other, I guess...

 

[Lee-c]

Well, let's keep our terms straight. When we say Reference Level bass, we are talking about
bass peaks on the Low Frequency Effects channel, or LFE (subwoofer) channel, in a Dolby Digital
movie soundtrack that hit 115dB max. The LFE channel is not supposed to go above 115dB if you
have your master volume control on your receiver set to the point you calibrated your system
to with Avia for reference level (or whatever other source you used for calibration signals). And
this is *very* loud bass, more than many people would even want to listen to on a regular basis.

The problem is that some movies have their bass set up absurdly beyond what the Dolby Digital
spec calls for. And I've heard that DTS soundtracks (which I think on paper are supposed to
follow the same max volume rules) are even more random and unpredictable. So don't be
disappointed if your sub can't handle being turned up to reference level on your master volume
control with some movies. If you're sub is hitting 115dB on bass peaks, then it's at reference
level bass already, even if your master volume control is only at -10. Some movies have their bass
so completely out of spec that unless you have a super powerful subwoofer it would be
impossible to turn your master volume up to full 00 RL and have the sub be able to keep up.

But who cares? Bass that loud would be just about unbearable to listen to, even if you could
reproduce it. Some of these dumb sound engineers think that vastly overpowered bass is somehow
good, but all it does is imbalance the movie so much that you can't even listen to it at the
master volume level you want to (for voices, music, etc.), because the bass is just way
too much to comfortably listen to. Not to mention it might damage your sub if you're not
expecting the movie's bass to be so tremendously hotter than it's supposed to be and
you turn the volume up high.

So when talking about Reference Level, just always remember that means 115dB on the sub channel.
Anything over that is out of spec anyhow, so don't sweat it. It all becomes meaningless and
useless beyond a certain point.

 

[DavidSGT]

I thought it was no plugs for 26hz, one plug for 20hz, and two plugs for 16hz. I just got mine so I'd like to know for sure if I'm wrong.

quoted by Paul

Hiya,

I am sure that it is one port plug - 16hz and two port plugs goes down to 12hz, I have to go back and check, thou' and there was a warning too about the driver going kaput if you don't follow... yada yada

Regards.
David