Parenthood - Season 2 thread (1 Viewer)

[mattCR]

Originally Posted by Qui-Gon John

I'd like to see Jasmine forgive Crosby, but not because of the house. If she finally realizes that, yes, Crosby did have sex with Gabby and sure it was wrong, but she has done a lot wrong in their relationship as well. Hiding the fact that Crosby was a dad and keeping Jabar from him for 5 years, that's pretty big, but in spite of that, Crosby loves her and has looked past that. Also, she needs to realize that she was too controlling, treated Crosby too much like an insignificant child when it came to making any kind of decisions, and yet, Crosby still loves her and wants to get past that as well. I'd like to see Jasmine realize that she's nowhere near perfect either, but if you love someone, you have to be able to forgive them when they screw up.

No woman would see it this way at all. Here's the way she will see it: She chose to remove herself and Jabar from Crosby's life before because she had decided he was too irresponsible and he wouldn't be prepared to handle a child. She made the assessment she was going to keep the kid, but didn't want Crosby's influence.


When she came back, we all viewed her as having taken time from Crosby. Which is true. And even she said she felt that way. Crosby's betrayal of her with Gabby will basically completely affirm her original assessment of Crosby, that he was too irresponsible to handle the outcome of being a father, and when presented a reason to reform even years later, he couldn't do it. If she has any regrets, she may regret not coming back sooner, but dollars to donuts part of her regrets opening this can of worms to begin with.


It's easy for people to take an outside view of a relationship when they aren't in it. Jasmine can't do that. She can only see and judge by her emotional feelings about the situation. She left and cut Crosby out in the beginning because of a fear that she announced to him that she didn't think he was ready, and her father leaving her and her family early hurt her childhood. She thought she was saving Jabar from that; but in a prior episode she said she had realized she was wrong, and that she wanted Crosby involved and to have that experience. Now Crosby does this. All of her life experience tells her that her first thought was right - Crosby is an immature tool.

Why would she get back together with Crosby? Over a house? Is that any different then a wayward father bringing home a big birthday present as a way to buy love?


Yes, if she could wipe out the entire life script of her character, she could forgive Crosby, it might take a very long time, and they could move on. But if they have her forgive him now, after all those episodes of why she did it, what she feels, and her family.. yeah, that would be a real dagger to this series (IMHO)

 

[Mike Frezon]

Originally Posted by Mikah Cerucco

I'm having a hard time seeing anything about Haddie's decision to have sex as "casual sex". It feels completely organic to me.

I agree that my original post would be better by striking the word "casual." But it doesn't change how I feel about the subject.

Well...if you can believe the teaser for the upcoming episode....maybe not.
Another blown surprise by way of a spoiler teaser?


On the one hand, if they "go there"...it's another lame (soap opera) direction to take the show. OTOH, I'm of the opinion that the show is sending a wrong message to have a 16-year old girl engage in casual sex without consequences. I'm just not a fan of the storyline.

IMO, I think it would have been a much better idea to have Haddie say "no" to sex despite her attraction to Alex. I realize many teenagers have sex. I'm not stupid. But it might have been a nice message for have Haddie and Alex both say no. Just sayin'.

 

[Adam Lenhardt]

Originally Posted by Qui-Gon John

I agree that my original post would be better by striking the word "casual." But it doesn't change how I feel about the subject.

What we look for from a show is highly influenced by what we bring to it. A show like "The Good Wife" will involve me and even enthrall me, but it's a different viewing experience than a show like "Parenthood." A certain moral relativism is required, because virtually every character takes actions that are either outright immoral or morally gray. I can appreciate why a character makes those decisions, and weigh the circumstances that brought them about. But I can't relate to it.


"Parenthood", on the other hand, purposefully constructs situations that are relatable to most of us, and invites the viewer to engage with it emotionally. That brings subjective factors like life experience, family history, morals and values into play in a much bigger way.

 

[Adam Lenhardt]

I loved the beginning, I loved the junkyard scene and I really loved the ending. The opening scene captured where every storyline on the show was without feeling the slightest bit unnatural. Max's outburst made me squirm watching it, saying the most unimaginably horrible things for the most trivial of reasons. And the whole family, knowing the hows and whys, sits there and doesn't react. Even Sarah, who's so overcome by what condition her daughter could be in, she doesn't have any head space left over to be let the content of Max's tantrum in. Drew on the phone, trying to reach Dad -- who's as unpresent as ever when it was most important to be present. Crosby there for Sarah and worried about Amber, but not really focused on anything but Jasmine. Alex being present at an emotionally difficult time, and being so gracious and decent that he doesn't give Adam an opportunity to vent this anger and resentment built up toward him. Julia showing up at the hospital for one reason and being there for another reason entirely.


The junkyard scene was terrific. Amber was still refusing to deal with everything she'd wrought since the bad news about college, and Zeek forced her to confront it in the bluntest possible way. He was there to splash the cold water on her face, but he was also there to lean on in the aftermath. Amber losing it was another Mae Whitman Emmy Moment™, and one that felt more earned that her apology to Sarah toward the end. Staring at your death like that is one of those milestone moments growing up, realizing that not only are you mortal, but your mortality has consequences for many more people than yourself, people you love and care about and want to protect.


The ending, though, was the sort of tour de force moment this show pulls off like any other. Everything that Adam Braverman has been repressing for the better part of a season all comes to a head at once. His resentment at his hipster boss, who's running the company Adam spent his career building like a fun little hobby. His discomfort with Haddie dating, and his severe discomfort with her having sex. His frustration with Max's Asperger's. Adam could get away with rants like that with Gordon, because he'd earned it over and the years and Gordon depended on Adam for the day to day. He hadn't earned that with Cory, and the outburst was basically stating flat out what he'd been trying to choke down ever since Cory took over. In a better economy, Adam would have just left, but he has no place else to go. That's what makes the firing all the worse, because he's consigning Adam to the ranks of the over-45 senior management unemployed. If the show has any realism at all, Adam's job hunt will be lengthy, and the position he ends up with will be a notable downgrade from the position he's held thus far.


All of that, plus the retainer, has him absolutely ready to blow. And then he finds the pregnancy test, and just loses it. And even though he's firing off half-cocked in the entirely wrong direction, it's such a healthy, cathartic moment for his character. All of this stuff has been building up for so long, he finally gets it all out there. And then when one of the day's horrors turns out to be a false alarm, it's such a relief he can help laughing. Yes, his career outlook is terrifying. Yes, Adam and Kristina were not looking to become new parents again, especially in light of the sudden lack of a household income. So tomorrow's going to suck. But at least everything out there, and at least he got to get what he was feeling out of the pit of his stomach.


The Crosby storyline frustrated me. I thought the scene where he stopped by Jasmine's apartment was perfect. He said exactly what he should have said, and came to the conclusions he should have come to. It was an adult moment for Crosby, of the sort that have been few and far between lately with his character. That being said, I don't think it earned the show a reconciliation between him and Jasmine. The ending was a little ambiguous; she allowed him to show her the house, and share his vision for their life together. If I had to guess, I'd say the show was pointing toward them being back together in a season three. I'd be happier if it was the first step of them being alright with each other. He shares with her his dream, and then they have a drink over what could have been.

 

[Greg_S_H]

It pretty much redeemed itself after two episodes that had me almost not caring if it was even renewed. But, it might have been stronger if Adam and Crosby had made their steps towards reconciliation at the hospital instead of at the house a couple of episodes back.


What I'd like to see next season is a relationship between Amber and Kristina. I know K is going to be a little busy, but they are not usually seen having much to do with one another. Maybe Amber could still have some guilt over sleeping with Haddie's boyfriend way back, and she thinks Kristina still doesn't like her. And, Kristina could acknowledge that she didn't really even know Amber until Sarah moved her in with the grandparents, and that she knows if Amber had something she wanted to talk over, it would go something like mom-->Drew-->Julia-->Camille-->Haddie-->Jasmine----------->Kristina, and that she wants to change that. I don't know. Just something that might be interesting. Because she is fairly thin-skinned and closed off, Kristina does feel like the most outside of any of the Bravermans.


Maybe Julia and Joel will adopt Adam and Kristina's baby.

 

[Patrick Sun]

I was rooting for Max to get smacked by his grand dad Zeke. Sometimes the writers use the Max character as a crutch to ramp up "moments", and it's offputting to watch, and becomes rather tiresome.


At this point, I'm ambivalent for its return or its demise.

 

[mattCR]

Originally Posted by Patrick Sun

But younger kids, it goes a different way. Older kids have a chance to build their own self image up based on their parents, etc. Kids younger then an autistic child face a real hard road, and a lot of us work about that.


http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/419204/the_autistic_child_younger_sibling.html

To go one step further, some families and healthcare professionals have found that younger siblings, of a child with autism, commonly assume the behaviors of the older autistic child simply out of learned and environmental exposure. Out of concern, parents will often request that younger siblings be tested for autism as well. In most cases, the younger sibling of the autistic child will not suffer from autism but, instead, may carry traits of autistic-like behavior that can be simply resolved through therapy.

It's really not a joke. Our oldest has one sibling, a younger brother. He trails him by 18 months. And for a long time, we worried that he was autistic. In the end, he wasn't. But his template for how he acts and behaves was largely mimicked through is brother. He hadn't really experienced what "normal" was, and at the time, there wasn't enough research or studies to tell us what to expect or how to handle that.

Now, there is a long advisory project on getting those kids in with other kids who are not their siblings. Long times away from home, frequent sitters, recommendations of daycares. It's so those kids can have plenty of time with other children who are not autistic so that their pattern of behavior isn't artificially influenced by a a 24/7 sibling who's behaviors shouldn't be adopted.


It's one of those things a lot of us have fought and dealt with. A few years ago, when our oldest hit 10, his behavior hit a point where world view and how he viewed things became both morbid and fairly terrifying. "what does any of this matter" type of attitude. And because his ability to recognize those issues in others was.. well, still very much a work in progress, he didn't understand how the potential of hurting another would matter. I could not, in all honesty, imagine bringing an infant into that environment... I just couldn't. I have known people who have and did, but it is a very difficult decision. I think a weight of bricks is going to hit Adam as he realizes how potentially difficult this will be, whether their third child is autistic or not. Him looking for a job at the same time is going to be interesting. Though the show won't go there, if I were Adam I would IMMEDIATELY sue the company for every penny it was worth for slipping him illegal drugs in the form of an "edible" which will taint him for drug tests for the next six months, and I would demand some pretty high returns on that..


I found the play/tableread to be an effective way to wrap up a storyline. I am still bothered by Zeke suddenly becoming a theater person. But I did like that we finally see something come to fruition of her work.

 

[Derek Miner]

More of the same reactions here... the junkyard scene was great and the whole last sequence was spectacular in so many ways - the looks on Adam and Kristina's faces that spanned every emotion, the building tension, the mixed emotional release. With the pregnancy test tip off in the "next on..." from last week, I picked up on where it was going at the start of the scene. As soon as Kristina said she had news, I could tell the bit about Max's retainer was covering up that she was going to say she was pregnant until she heard one of the worst pieces of news she could hear from her husband right then. But her response of firm support was golden - you are a good, strong, reponsible person and we will get through this.


Not sure if Katims did this on purpose, but I thought the lost retainer was a tip of the hat to the original source material - the scene that most clearly comes to mind when I think of the movie Parenthood is the one where Steve Martin's kid realizes he can't find his retainer at a restaurant and goes into a huge panic. Of course, lost retainers are something many parents have to deal with, so it might just be coincidence.


I can't say I have strong feelings about where they should or shouldn't take the Crosby/Jasmine storyline in season 3, however I think the way they chose to wrap it up for the current season was smart. I mentioned previously that the writers had to find a way to give Crosby closure to make it work, and I'm not sure why it didn't occur to me that they do exactly what they did - have him let go. I guess I looked at it like Crosby was struggling in every way to build improvement upon improvement to impress Jasmine with his maturity, but the writers were doing this to show him getting further and further away from the mark - realizing the truth in the age-old saying, "If you love something, set it free..." And in one gesture, Crosby earned real maturity.

 

[Patrick Sun]

My main issue with Max is that he is used as a catalystic character, he's always going to do the type of things he's expected to do in his role of an austictic child when proper company would not in light of tense situations, so as a viewer, it becomes this eyerolling exercise for me when Max's outburst came through full bore, and it's like his parents are just so shocked, when I know they know better than to be shocked by Max's behavior. It sometimes feels like a cheap way to manufacture drama by the writers. Fool me once, shame on me, fool me twice, shame on Max's parents.

 

[Adam Lenhardt]

To be fair, I've always gotten the impression that Max has these outbursts all of the time; the show just only takes the time to showcase them when the outbursts have outside implications. I didn't really read Adam and Kristina's behavior as shocked so much as desperately trying to contain an uncontainable force.

 

[mattCR]

Originally Posted by Patrick Sun

My main issue with Max is that he is used as a catalystic character, he's always going to do the type of things he's expected to do in his role of an austictic child when proper company would not in light of tense situations, so as a viewer, it becomes this eyerolling exercise for me when Max's outburst came through full bore, and it's like his parents are just so shocked, when I know they know better than to be shocked by Max's behavior. It sometimes feels like a cheap way to manufacture drama by the writers. Fool me once, shame on me, fool me twice, shame on Max's parents.

I don't know if they were shocked. I think they may have been mostly embarrassed. I think those things happen. I don't know how you have a character like Max and not play it exactly as it is. There are going to be times when it's a success, and times when it is a monumental failure. Trust me, the way tehy show max is close to reality, but if anything, they have toned him down to be much more calm and high functioning (which is fine) then they could have.


Having Max not react in those ways would be a real betrayal of the character; it would be like having a Down Syndrome cast member sudden spark up a brilliant idea or be completely self sufficient. It just wouldn't ring true with those that know. The comment of "when proper company would not in light of tense situations.." Realize, for a person like Max, proper company means absolutely nothing. We've seen him have these kind of outbursts over nothing at his house "no, we're eating this" etc.. so having him not react here would be more manufactured for TV then having him react.


Now, I will admit, when my son got up at a funeral and yelled "what does it matter, she's wormf ood" and started laughing at a family member's funeral, what options really were available? Did I want the manufactured drama? Not really.. and as a parent, it is pretty freaking emberrassing. But they simply don't have the social recognition to make that call on their own. Here you have a scene late at night in a hospital. (supposedly 2 or 3 AM) Adam brought the whole family because Haddie wasn't home (it appears obvious she came with her boyfriend... so a different story I'd have about curfew) but he couldn't leave Max "Home alone". You're in a damned if you do, damned if you don't.


Realistically, Patrick, they haven't even touched the surface of how potentially dark and scary this storyline could go. Maybe they won't. Maybe Max will always be the cute kid who grows up somewhat normal. But there are a lot of autistic kids who have serious control issues with rage, violence, sexual problems, dark thoughts. So when I see "and he goes full bore" I kind of laugh. Full Bore would be Max start screaming profanities or kicking people or biting or throwing a chair. I often send people an article like this one:


http://www.salon.com/life/feature/2009/03/26/bauer_autism/index.html

I scan the story while standing, my coffee forgotten. Trudy Steuernagel, a faculty member in political science at Kent State, has been murdered and her 18-year-old son, Sky, has been arrested and charged with the crime, though he is profoundly disabled and can neither speak nor understand. Sky, who likes cartoons and chicken nuggets, apparently lost control and beat his mother into a coma. He was sitting in jail when she died.


This happens to be two days after my older son's 21st birthday, which we marked behind two sets of locked steel doors. I'm exhausted and hopeless and vaguely hung over because Andrew, who has autism, also has evolved from sweet, dreamy boy to something like a golem: bitter, rampaging, full of rage. It happened no matter how fiercely I loved him or how many therapies I employed.


Now, reading about this Ohio mother, there is a moment of slithering nausea and panic followed immediately by a sense of guilty relief.


I am not alone.

No parent of an autistic child wants to admit it, we all play it off like such sweet lovable kids... and I hope to god that this never happens to my son.. but there are times when, frankly you do worry about these things. I've worked with a lot of autistic children. We've been through the IEPs, forced mental hospitalization, institutionalization, paid care.. it is a struggle. Month to month, an absolute struggle. I think for the people on the outside of the situation, its' very easy to say "oh come on, they can straighten up for a while, get control of your kid". It is a lot harder then that. Far more difficult then people realize when the common rules that we all live by do not make sense to them. When they question isn't "Why" but "Isn't this a better way"?


A someone in the shoes of a parent of a kid like Max (maybe a bit moreso) it is sometimes easy to say "fool on them" but the question is, what better options are there for us?


Two years ago, at 10 years old, our son - a certified math genius with the highest test scores in his school district and top 1% in the state on the standardized tests struggled with a teacher. Infuriated that just writing the answer was "good enough" on the state tests, but frustrated that he had to show his work he had complained that showing his work was stupid and "The real test doesn't make me". When challenged by a teacher, who took 30% of his grade off (he didn't miss the answers, he had a 100% perfect on the answers, but a 70% or D+ for the paper as he didn't show his work) in front of a classroom of students and two care givers we provided, he proceeded to leap over a table, tackle a teacher and threaten to kill her. He was arrested that day.


As a parent, maybe it was "shame on me", but in the end, we had an IEP, we had provided extra caregivers. We had multiple therapists and an action plan. We had worked through all the medication. Him leaping out and attacking a teacher wasn't something we wanted, could have planned for. And for a while, it tore us up as we went through our first round of psychiatric hospitals, institutional care, etc.


Max's situation on Parenthood is different then ours.... kind of. Like our son, he's academically brilliant, a fast learner with a strong memory. He's normally calm. But the show hasn't shied away from showing his issues with anger, with function and with an OCD reliance on schedules.

Think schedules don't matter? This year as an assistant, another child we work with had a school bus arrive 5minutes late. He made it to school and cried for 4 hours straight because he needed to go back in time and find out what he had missed in those five minutes. Why did that have to happen to him? He couldn't understand. No teacher could console him, and finally he was dismissed early and we helped get him home.


I think this show is taking a real chance in how it portrays this. It gets very close to the line of how it really is. It's so hard for those of us who have children a bit like Max to relate to others because there are experiences and things we go through that other parents don't, or things that we see that don't. A friend in one of the support groups had a child try to cut his finger off with a knife and re-attach it because he was trying to figure out a magic trick. The pain of the knife as he sawed away at his own index finger mattered somewhat, but that little boy kept at it because he was confident it would re-attach just fine. Luckily, she caught him in time, but still.


I think if they wanted to manufacture drama, they could cover a lot of ground they aren't, things that could happen that I can guarantee you they will not go near but a lot of autistic parents would recognize and shake there head and say "been there done that".

It's been years since I've spent time with some ends of our family because it is hard for them to understand what it is like, and how it changes how you deal with people and your kids. It just never comes around to being "normal". God, I wish it did.


There are things they could tackle... tough, serious but common issues that may come up. Things ranging from picking (http://faqautism.com/2008/05/scratching-and-picking/) or have him be averse to school recess (http://faqautism.com/) etc.

I think for a lot of people it will seem like manufactured drama. To me, it seems close to the truth. Probably because I've lived through it, partly because I've seen it. When we first had kids, my wife & I came from families where everyone sat together at the dinner table ate and talked. By the time our oldest was five, he couldn't stand to be in the same room as us while eating (STOP SMACKING NEAR ME!) and so he eats in his own room. At school, after trying for a few years, he eats in an empty classroom so he doesn't have to be around other kids.


There are daily battles. Some battles you win big (I have no problem with our son needing two showers a day because he believes that is the only way to effectively battle germs) some you compromise (he will try new foods often) some you surrender (he can eat on his own).


Having Max apologize was a nice moment. But, Patrick.. if they hold this to form, and they really want Max to play an autistic kid who is about to go through puberty? This is going to get a lot more difficult.. I mean A LOT more difficult as they show where that goes, and Adam and Kristina have to evaluate long term care strategies for him that extend for the rest of his life... they at least mentioned this with "the bug man" who lives with his parents but has a job. But those are the tough drama issues that are ahead.


There are a lot of things I really don't care for about this show, but this is one of the very few shows on TV that has taken a more honest look at what those issues are rather then pay lip service and have it just be a "quirky unknowable thing". Max's bursts of rage at losing his schedule and the lack of how to deal with it? It's as close to the real world as I have ever seen on a TV show.


Edit:


I want to add this. If you google or youtube "autism tantrum" or "autism problems" you will find tons of videos and responses. What stands out to me isn't the videos but the responses. The social condition is that a lot of the responders will say things like "beat your kid" or "I'd smack that kid" or "I don't believe in Autism".. the unfortunate fact is, a lot of us run into this often. There is a lot of widespread disbelief about the entire condition. There is also a lot of misinformation and people who prey on it or turn it into something else. The thing I most appreciate about this show is that Adam and Kristina are good, loving parents in a difficult situation. The disbelievers will tell you things like "it's bad parenting, just spank the kid". It's so hard for people to understand that isn't what it is about. Would spanking a kid really influence Danny who tried to cut his finger off to try a magic trick? Or would it help a kid who cried for almost 4 hours in a row because he "missed" five minutes? No. There are things in our life that have changed drastically since the birth of our son and as he has grown up. And it has been an adventure (some day I should write a book) but I do love my son. He has a brilliant, unbelievable mind for numbers and science that scares me at times how truly smart he is - watching a 12 year old walk up to the board and just throw down answers for High School algebra without showing his work and sit down clapping his hands furiously is both a moment of joy and some sadness. But if anything, even if this show ends tomorrow, I am truly grateful that someone decided to put this kind of real world face on at least part of what having an autistic person in your family is like.

 

[ScottH]

While I admit the episode was emmy-worthy all-around (particularly Mae Whitman and Craig T), I still don't like the direction it's taken with a lot of the characters. And now the couple with two older kids is having an unplanned child...gee, we've never seen that before on a network drama. I'm starting to think Jason Katims has an obsession with unplanned pregnancies after 'Friday Night Lights' and now 'Parenthood'. 9 times out of 10, pregnancies in a show like this is just a device to give the writers something to write about and it almost always holds back the show.

 

[Citizen87645]

Echoing sentiments.


Loved the junkyard scene. It was totally a Zeke thing to do and it was totally what Amber needed to hear and the person she needed to hear it from. But this also makes two years in a row where there's a big crisis in the finale involving Amber. They need to get off that track.


Didn't really care for the set up for Julia realizing she wasn't done. Just too coincidental.


Not happy about the Crosby-Jasmine direction, though I hold out hope they are not together but merely OK with each other. Doesn't look likely though.


Sarah's play was not the Mr. Holland's Opus let down I was dreading, fortunately.


No strong feelings about Adam and Kristina's situation, but I am interested to see where it goes.

 

[Derek Miner]

Matt, thanks for taking so much time to share your experiences and knowledge.


When you praise this show for the honest look at autism, it reminds me of my first exposure to Aspergers via the show Boston Legal. Coming all this way with the character of Max, it makes David E. Kelley's version of it so offensive to be almost unwatchable.

 

[mattCR]

Originally Posted by Derek Miner

Matt, thanks for taking so much time to share your experiences and knowledge.


When you praise this show for the honest look at autism, it reminds me of my first exposure to Aspergers via the show Boston Legal. Coming all this way with the character of Max, it makes David E. Kelley's version of it so offensive to be almost unwatchable.

I enjoyed Boston Legal. And there were things I really liked about Jerry's character. The autism spectrum is very broad, and there are lots of things they covered that I liked. But they tended to lump Jerry in with "Crazy people" (ie, have him date an objectiphile, etc).


The autism spectrum is broad. It encompasses a lot of sub-issues, from OCD, BiPolar, ADHD, etc.. there are kids who have difficulty speaking at all (low functioning autistic) who are introspective and quiet. There are virtual savants within a skill set, from music to math. There are all the areas in between. There are things I found positive about that portrayal, that many autistic people live a full and happy life and they overcome their disability with training, education, some medication and they get through it. But the spectrum is HUGE, and so the problem is you'll find even a lot of disagreement within the autistic community about the issues. But the Boston Legal method of portraying it as craziness in some episodes really did bother me.


I will say this, the one thing Boston Legal did get right was the hand gesture thing. Keeping your hands flat to your side used to be a method to deal with autistic kids decades ago, because autistic children have a tendency to "flap" they call it stimming. In order to balance out their thoughts and response, one of the first ways people identify autistic children is that they "hand flap". This is when either excitedly or not, they begin to flap their arms/hands excitedly and have difficulty stopping.. unfortunately, if you scan youtube or elsewhere you will find lots of videos of "is my kid autistic" with videos of what they believe is stimming.. you're best to have it evaluated.. or it is REALLY obvious.. Anyway, years ago, to counter that problem they used to pin kids hands to their side and tell them they could NOT put their hands up or there would be punishment.


So, Jerry walking quickly with his hands on his side - that's a coached mechanism, and it's one that nobody uses anymore. I thought that was a nice touch. But some of the other elements they added to his character I didn't care for.

 

[Adam Lenhardt]

From TV File:


Did Jasmine and Crosby reconcile in the episode’s final moments? [COLOR= #808080]|[/COLOR] “I wouldn’t assume that,” Katims cautions. “Although they were finally talking — and I think we definitely earned that after Crosby spent so many episodes just trying to have a conversation with the woman — I don’t think that conversation necessarily leads to fixing all the problems that they have. The verdict is out in terms of where they are when we pick up with them next.”

 

[DaveF]

I caught up on a 5 Ep backlog of Parenthood this week (business travel kills my tv routine). now to catch up on the pages of discussion I've avoided. It's a bit of Summer of George: Sarah's life is on the upswing and Adam is down in trajectory.

 

[DaveF]

It also could have led to further debate between the two parents about if they can have any further role in discouraging the relationship between the two. Obviously, they would realize that the relationship would have to run its course...but the parents of any 16-year old are going to have those thoughts/discussions and 20/20 hindsight.



There's no way the two of them aren't blaming themselves bigtime for their daughter now being in a sexual relationship with a worldly 19-year old--a situation they were so desperate to prevent.



If that point doesn't get addressed, they are doing a disservice to the character development of the parents.

I've still got two pages of comments to read, but this point keeps grabbing me: In "real" time, in the week or so this 43 min of tv represents, Adam probably beat himself up over it. But for us, the audience, there was nothing more to be done or said about it. They tried to break up Haddie and Alex. It monumentally backfired. Nearly tore their family apart. No point retreading that.

 

[DaveF]

Wow. Reading the prior five pages of discussion is really something! I wish I could have kept up in real time, but it's very satisfying reading this marvelous conversation in a compressed manner. I've thoroughly enjoyed this season and am excited for its conclusion and for next season. Some aspects are a but cloying, but those are the minority. And Amber's emotional collapse I found more believable than perhaps others here did. She's been screwup Amber for a decade. She been mature Amber for a year. And even then she's been on the edge. But now after a year of success...it was all for nothing. Not getting into college is not a minor set back to a teen. It would feel like the end if the world; a direct repudiation of yourself as a person; a mockery of every pro-college choice you've made. And newfound maturity to collapse, with reversion to bad habits, further fueled by rage and self-loathing, into self destruction...I believe it. I've been through a period of depression, over tragic loss of a sibling, with some self destructive behaviors in my 20's. It wasn't drug and sex filled like Amber. But I was never a screwup like that and I had a very solid family, church, academic community. But if I could experience what I did, then I can imagine Amber having her breakdown given her worse upbringing and role models. As my dad has said regarding his experiences in prison outreach, There but for the grace of god go I.

 

[Walter C]

I just caught up on the show, and enjoyed the season and reading this thread. Interesting analysis by Adam and others in this thread on the show, and each individual storyline. I concur with others that the show seems to flow multiple storylines smoothly, and does not try to stuff all of them into each episode. And this is one of the few shows where I find the "previously on" segments are very useful, not only to recap what happened before, but also to tell you which storylines will be featured in the upcoming episode.


Having watched this show online, I did not see any previews, but for some reason, I saw the car crash coming, even though a part of me was thinking... Parenthood was not that type of show.


Like DaveF said, I wished that I kept up with the show in real time. Maybe next season!