Mad Men Season 3 (1 Viewer)

[mattCR]

Question: You keep referring to Betty's "affairs of sorts". What exactly are you talking about? What are you trying to equate with Don's multiple prowlings? I think it would be interesting to flesh out the double standard here.

Look, I admit, I have zero problem with either of them "prowling". I think there is hypocrisy in believing that doesn't happen, but que sera. But as far as why I find Betsy's more problematic, it's because Betsy goes for the complete contradition.
Don has his affairs, keeps them quiet, whatever. It happens. It doesn't make him a great person, but it is what it is. Betsy spends the entire first season courting a horse owner who's engaged because he's from "old tradition" and makes out with him in the barn and yes, realizes she can't take the next step. Then she bangs a guy in a bar.

Honestly, no real problem with either situation. But to immediately follow it up with the duplicitous lie of "I'd never do that to you.." hah. Don didn't ever chose to take the moral high ground on the sex issue "If it happened to me, I'd tell.." This season has been full of Betsy looking for ways out, which is fine. In "Souvenir" (8th episode) she basically regales Sally as to how she longs for that "first kiss" experience. She then tells Don she wants to live in a better town, have better friends, move up the social ladder. In previous episodes, we saw Betsy go to a parent teacher conference and basically walk out, refusing to deal with her daughter's new troubled behaviour despite the fact that Carla, the maid, has warned her for two seasons now.

As far as absentee father.. I think we're judging from snippets. Don was the only one who realized that his daughter was struggling and in trouble, not Betsy. Betsy's general answer has been to yell and scream back or just walk out of the conversation.. or do something truly creepy (dolls from your infant who's named after a grandfather you're already terrified of?)

Her storyline is about to get interesting. But just like season 1, where she used Sally as a prop to get her close to a horserider, she's using the kids only as an afterthought to move on to what she sees as a Bigger, Better Deal.. her judgement is clearly laid out; she knows absolutely nothing about Mr. Francis. But she knows enough that he's a BBD, at least in her mind. And kids are just collateral damage.

 

[Sam Favate]

Here is how I see the Don-Betty relationship: Don's behavior is inexcusable, and, sadly, fit in with many of his contemporaries. As we see throughout the show, nearly all of the married men think it is their right to be involved with as many women as they please. Betty, like many of the women on the show, is realizing that this isn't how life should be (cue up Trudy; she's next), and recognizing the vacant marriage that results from it, and she is reacting to it. All of her decisions aren't correct (the affair in the bar, for example, and, I'm afraid, Mr. Francis) but she is struggling and she is trying. Don either doesn't understand why his extramarital affairs hurt their marriage, or he doesn't care.

Much of the show is about women discovering ways to empower themselves - look at Peggy and Joan, or Midge (Don's mistress from season 1). The heart of the show, it seems to me, is about gender roles and how they changed in the time period depicted. It's not a coincidence that the lengthy bonus feature on the BD is called Birth of an Independent Woman.

 

[mattCR]

Originally Posted by Sam Favate

Much of the show is about women discovering ways to empower themselves - look at Peggy and Joan, or Midge (Don's mistress from season 1). The heart of the show, it seems to me, is about gender roles and how they changed in the time period depicted. It's not a coincidence that the lengthy bonus feature on the BD is called Birth of an Independent Woman.

Wow. I guess I am taking a totally different message from this. Look at Peggy & Joan, who have become the ones with the most forward reaching lives. Peggy originally went through a period of being chastised for her past "transgression" and has been newly empowered to basically feel OK with her own sexuality and makes no real excuses for it. She's one of the most "on track" characters in the show in her home and professional life.
Joan ran the office at Sterling Cooper in Season 1, and was very comfortable with her own sexuality. By the end of Season 2, spurned, she decided maybe she was wrong and should go after "the american dream" with a doctor. Her settling for this ended up getting her raped and with a guy who's a complete loser. Now, she's regaining her swagger, so to speak, by taking advantage of what she is.
Trudy & Mona (Rogers first wife) are basically in control of their ship, they negotiate with their partners on even footing, even after divorce. Mona talks frankly and direct with Roger, and he admires her for it. Trudy snaps Pete back on message in his meeting with Don, and when he shows up at the new offices, he's holding a new account.. Clearisil. Someone went to their father for him, because she views this as a Co-Op.
Betsy is the old guard, she likes feeling romanced, needs the power element, but she doesn't negotiate with anyone on even ground. It's always a scheme to line up situations the way she wants, or to manipulate people into feeling sorry for her.

Both Don and Betty are, in the end, not "good people". I guess I just find more redeeming about Don's character. Primarily because I can't find anything really redeeming about Betty. Her management of her own family ("let's make sure my brother never gets the house or anything good out of my father's passing" "Oh, who took those heirlooms that should go to me, not you.." before his death.. is sure a scumbag move).
I'm trying to think of any moment where Betsy made any effort to parent her kids that didn't have incredible ulterior motives, or when she treated any situation as a way to not either get sympathy or manipulate the deck to make herself look better.

 

[Tim Gerdes]

And as for treating his kids like crap, again we're watching different shows. I'd rather have Betty as a mother than Don as a father. He's hardly there, and when he is, he barely pays attention to his kids. That was not uncommon for the era, but that doesn't make it admirable

In general, there seems to be a lot of hostility toward Betty, and while I don't have any issues with her desire to leave Don, I think he is an exponentially better parent than she is.
Sure she spends more time with them, but except for baby Gene, has she even once shown her children even a sliver of affection? At least when Don is with the kids you get the idea that he has some affection for them. I suppose this could be a product of the situation. Betty's acting out, it's resentment against Don and his absenteeism. But even in her escape to Reno, baby Gene is the only child who can't do without mommy for the extended trip. Carla is more of a mother to Sally and Bobby than either Draper parent.
As a random aside, did anyone else notice that to meet his quota for partnership Pete brought Clearasil. He and Trudy have definitely seemed aligned this season. I supposed she helped to convince her father. Wonder if Pete's resistance to a baby will again rear it's head in season 4?

 

[JonZ]

Personally, I think Don (who has LOTS of issues) is the better parent.

 

[Michael Reuben]

Originally Posted by mattCR



Betsy spends the entire first season courting a horse owner who's engaged because he's from "old tradition" and makes out with him in the barn and yes, realizes she can't take the next step. Then she bangs a guy in a bar.

That's the second season, not the first. And it's a direct result of her discovery of Don's betrayal of her by getting her phony "therapy". (Note that, when Don made a last-ditch plea in the final episode of season 3, he suggested a shrink, "a good one this time" -- probably not the best-chosen pitch from someone who's supposed to be an expert at sizing up what the audience wants to hear.)

I really have no idea where you get this "BBD" stuff from. There's nothing about Henry Francis to suggest that he's a "Bigger Better Deal". His chief appeal (and this is what's so dangerous) is that he looks at Betty with loving eyes.

 

[Mikah Cerucco]

Originally Posted by JonZ


Petes wife is simply beautiful. What kind of whack job would cheat on her?

I'd understand the question better if cheating had anything to do with the attractiveness of one's partner.

 

[Michael Reuben]

Originally Posted by mattCR


As far as absentee father.. I think we're judging from snippets.

I was going to say the same thing about you and Betty's parenting skills. And, BTW, I think the conversation between her and Sally about "first kiss" revealed genuine affection (in addition to other layers that wouldn't have been apparent to Sally).

I'm genuinely astonished that anyone would think Don Draper, who would rather spend his nights at work or in some other woman's bed than at home with his family, is the better parent. Even assuming that, when he actually is home, he shows the kids real affection (and I don't agree with that characterization), what good is it when he's so seldom there? Absentee affection is no substitute for being present.

Originally Posted by Tim Gerdes

But even in her escape to Reno, baby Gene is the only child who can't do without mommy for the extended trip.

Don't overlook the obvious explanation: Baby Gene is the only child who wouldn't have to be taken out of school for the six weeks that Betty has to stay in Reno to establish residency.

 

[Garrett Adams]

Originally Posted by Michael Reuben

Every professional organization needs a guy like Price Pryce. Otherwise you think you're doing great, but one day you turn around and find you're broke, because expenses have eaten up your profits. But I agree that it's rare for someone in that capacity to get his name on the door. Price Pryce recognized his moment, and he took it.

Since he is now more of a pivotal character it's probably best to use the correct name. Lane's last name is Pryce, not Price.

 

[Sam Favate]

Looks like Sal (Bryan Batt) won't be back for season 4:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/01/28/sal-leaving-mad-men-bryan_n_441112.html

Really too bad; he was a great character.

 

[TravisR]

I liked the Sal character but given what happened this season, I can't see a believable way that they'd bring the character back full time. I certainly hope that he makes a guest appearance at some point in the future though (working at another agency, someone runs into him on the street or at a bar, etc.).

 

[mattCR]

I agree, I can't see how he can come back in anything but a guest shot. Part of what's lovable about this show is that it creates very realistic characters for the timeframe. Yes, he was fired for a BS reason. But the right people knew the -real- reason why he was fired.

And while some fans may want him to come back, there isn't a realistic way, in that time and place where Don would ever hire him back, in any role.

 

[Raasean Asaad]

The new firm has Lee Garner Jr. and Lucky Strike as a major client. That alone should mean no Sal.

 

[JediFonger]

just finished teh blu-ray (awesome PQ/Audio too BTW) 'early' this morning so to speak .

what an incredible series! shocker after shocker towards the end of the season! =). the simmering issues finally boils to the surface! &the way they handled the children (the sit down scene) was so realistic ahaha. i never had any divorced parents... but man i've heard so many stories already... it was so heartbreaking especially for the daughter! so many issues, man just a trail of problems afterwards hahaha. this will make her life worse!

 

[Terencey]

'Mad Men' entertaining smugfest.

 

[Nelson Au]

Hey guys,


Thought I'd jump in here!


I've been watching Mad Men on blu-ray for the past 6 months. I've not seen it before, so blu-ray is my way of watching as I don't have cable. What a great show so far!

I just started watch watching Season 3 a few weeks ago and am slowly watching a show a week.

Can't figure Don out yet as he's so messed up! I'm afraid to see what happens to he and Betty in the coming season 3 episodes. I was surprised and not surprised he was going to sleep with the flight attendant and right after he got back together with Betty. Was surprised to and not surprised to see Sal and the bell boy too.


Loved the line that Don says to his British colleague, "Why did you buy us?"


So now I am torn, whether to buy Season 4 via iTunes with a season pass or wait for the blu ray.

 

[JediFonger]

nelson, i personally would wait for the Blu-Ray. the production of the sets/costumes are awesome... BD reveals it better than iTunes' 720p imho.


like you, i also have seen mad men 1-3 on BD. i'll wait for s4 on BD. i've given up on live HDTV broadcasts. 2much macroblocking, synching issues. plus i hate commercials and the weekly wait between the episodes.

 

[Nelson Au]

Yi,


Thanks for the feedback! That's what I was leaning towards. Besides, it seems crazy too to pay for Mad Men twice! Once on iTunes, and then the BD!

The blu-rays do look fantastic! What is fun to see is the real furniture and props that don't look new because they are 40 or 50 year old objects!


I checked the release dates on the past sets. Season One and Two were released July. Season 3 was released in March. I guess we have a long wait!

 

[JediFonger]

meh... when i say i stopped i meant i stopped watching ALL live HDTVs. that means that the shows i missed sept. 09 through may '10 are now starting to arrive. so i have many, many series to catchup, which i'm perfectly fine with =D


i'm assuming mad men isn't the only TV you watch. when you get used to it, it stops being an issue =P. the only issue i had was everyone was talking about Lost's final season. so i basically watched that live this year... but after that i find that not many people watch all the TV series i follow (like mad men).... so it didn't matter to me when i watched them.

 

[Nelson Au]

Yeah, I watch TV broadcast over the air. Works fine for me. And I have other DVD's to watch.

I've just been spoiled by Mad Men because I bought Season One and watched an episode a week, liked it and before the last episode of S1, I bought S2 and was able to watch uninterrupted! Same with S3. So once S3 is over, I have to wait!


I can watch S1, 2 and 3 over.