Donner Superman 2 SE (merged thread) (1 Viewer)

[Dharmesh C]

James, I don't think Donner reshot a new ending for 2 'cos Turning back the world was a late edition to the first film, by then, all shooting on TWO was halted We do know that everything in the following sets were completed:
FORTRESS OF SOLITUDE
DAILY PLANET
Both sets had to knocked down. Both rebuilt for Lester.
I wouldn't be surprised if 85% was completed, models were built and photographed for the battle.
I don't see a re-cut happening, having all the scenes in a supplementary section IS the only way in my view. A re-cut is inviting legal hell

 

[James Phillips]

It’s very difficult to know though, isn’t it Dharmesh. Going by what Donner said, Christopher Reeve and Margot Kidder weren’t required to return for additional shooting. Maybe Donner felt he already had enough footage to construct a new ending for Superman II from the footage he already had, or something?

But of course, you’re quite right about the legal problems involved. For those who don’t know, Warner Bros. is currently involved in a legal dispute with a company called Pueblo Film Licensing, who represent the Salkind family’s interest in the Superman films. They’re suing Warner Bros. for re-editing Superman The Movie, and for including supplementary materials on the DVD without their permission.

It’s only when this dispute is resolved that we’ll know if a re-cut of Superman II, or at the very least the inclusion of Donner’s footage in a DVD supplementary section, is even legally possible.

 

[Dan Hitchman]

Maybe they could do a hybrid of the usable footage shot by Donner making up the bulk of the DC and what scenes are absolutely impossible to finish be replaced with bits that Lester did.

That's the only possible scenario I see happening.

Dan

 

[Paul_Scott]

i don't necessarily see this appealing to a younger generation weaned from birth on things like the Matrix and CGI used for everything-

any kind of re-do for SII is going to appeal more significantly to 'older' fans .

so

has anyone he seen some of the reconstructions of 'lost' or incomplete films, like Queen Kelly, and London After Midnight?

-where they use stills and title cards to bridge lost sequences?

what about just being upfront about the film being a reconstruction w/ available elements and aiming the finished project squarely at film buffs and Superman fans?

to me, not having a 'complete' film (in the conventional sense), is still viable.

maybe even having someone with a great voice to narratively 'bridge' sequences that can't be fudged digitally (...doesn't Donner have a good speaking voice, himself?).

for all the harsh things i've said about SII, including what Donner shot, i would still buy an SE in a heartbeat.

and with the technology available today, they are ways of getting around a lot of barriers, if all the original footage actually still exists.

hell, i would much rather see this happen, than a Joel Silver 300 million dollar remake.

 

[Dharmesh C]

It’s very difficult to know though, isn’t it Dharmesh. Going by what Donner said, Christopher Reeve and Margot Kidder weren’t required to return for additional shooting. Maybe Donner felt he already had enough footage to construct a new ending for Superman II from the footage he already had, or something?

Chris and Kidder were scheduled to return for pick-ups, and I believe they had to redo the exterior Niagara Falls stuff.

I'm certain that Donner didn't shoot a new ending for 2. Remember, it was Lester who suggested that the end of Superman required an emotional element, he was spot on! Can't remember when they went to Mexico, was it in summer 78?

 

[James Phillips]

Yeah, I think they went to Mexico in June or July of 1978. I remember they originally tried filming the scene where Lois Lane’s car sinks into the ground at Pinewood Studios, but abandoned it when Charles Greenlaw said Warner Bros. would stump up the cash to film it on location. But considering that this scene was already being filmed at Pinewood, it’s possible that they made some adjustments to the Superman II script, and filmed a new ending for it.

But I don’t know either way. I’m just going by what Donner said in that interview. :b

 

[Dharmesh C]

Charles Greenlaw is the unsung hero! Wonder what he's upto now?

It's possible that the Pinewood ending was the one where Superman saves Lois just in time???

I can't remember when they stopped filming on Superman 2.

 

[Paul_Scott]

weren't the salkinds complaining of cost over-runs on Donners tenure?

i always found it odd that so much of SII looks cheap and tacky and yet they sprung some $$$ for th crew to have a 'vacation' in fiji to film a non-essential throwaway scene (where supes picks the flower for the dinner).

 

[Dharmesh C]

Yes, they were, which is why Warner Bros. essentially said "We'll help you but we want a slice of the pie"
WB joined the production, but Salkinds were aware that Warners wanted to take over the whole thing when the studio realised that SUPERMAN was going to be special - The Krypton scenes convinced them! Since Alex Salkind felt that he was robbed of millions, he decided to hold the final negative until the studio gave him 14 million! Alex's reason? He undersold the foreign rights.
Superman 2 looks cheap 'cos they RUSHED it for November 1980 release in Austrailia!!! Well before the U.S. release, which was in JUNE 1981!!! They took shortcuts, Salkinds loved Lester's work ethic - the guy knew what he wanted and wasted no time waiting for the correct conditions. Donner was trying to be a perfectionist, which frustrated the producers at the time.
Anything else?

 

[Dharmesh C]

Some news, folks:
Reply from the president of WHV:
Warner Home Video is supportive of an extended version of Superman II on DVD. However, there are complex legal and creative issues that need to be resolved before the film can be re-released. Warner Home Video is presently addressing these issues.

 

[MatthewLouwrens]

Interesting. Thanks Dharmesh. Good to learn that there is some interest in a new cut - hopefully these issues will be worked through in the near future.

 

[Britton]

I completely forgot about the letter writing campaign, but it's good to know it got the WB to take notice.

 

[Mike_Richardson]

Warner Home Video is supportive of an extended version of Superman II on DVD. However, there are complex legal and creative issues that need to be resolved before the film can be re-released. Warner Home Video is presently addressing these issues.

Notice they said "an extended version." Obviously, an "extended" version and "Donner's cut" are two totally, completely different animals. I've never been able to understand this campaign to "restore Donner's version" because it won't ever happen -- he didn't complete his work on the movie, and it never existed in the first place!

Now, restoring scenes he DID direct (like those in the TV cut) IS a possibility -- and I'd love to see that, in addition to the longer TV versions of "Superman I" (still over 30 mins. never seen on DVD) plus III and IV (heck, why not!). The Brando footage from II in particular would be great.

But saying we'll see a full "Donner's Director's Cut" is a pipe dream. Unless Superman can turn back the clock to 1978 and have him un-fired, you'll never see it.

 

[WillG]

Well, in the last Warner chat, they asked for a thread to be started in which we could name our most requested titles. An extended/Donner Cut was I'm sure in the top three. So now we may have something. I'm not sure if this is good news or not, but I read something in the paper yesterday that is reporting that Marlon Brando is virtually a full blown pauper at this point. Maybe at this point WB can get him to sign off on his footage at a disounted cost. (Although I'm not sure of the complete specifics of what went on at the time)

I would also like to see the all footage version of S.T.M. as well

 

[oscar_merkx]

sounds optimistic to me

 

[Larry Sutliff]

Warner Home Video is supportive of an extended version of Superman II on DVD. However, there are complex legal and creative issues that need to be resolved before the film can be re-released. Warner Home Video is presently addressing these issues.

Sounds good to me. Thanks, Dharmesh!

 

[Jason Adams]

but I read something in the paper yesterday that is reporting that Marlon Brando is virtually a full blown pauper at this point. Maybe at this point WB can get him to sign off on his footage at a disounted cost.

It's a bit too late for that now.

 

[Bill Williams]

Sadly so. May he rest in peace. :frowning:

 

[WillG]

Not to sound like a ghoul, but I do wonder what this means as far as using Brando's footage in a new SII release.

but I read something in the paper yesterday that is reporting that Marlon Brando is virtually a full blown pauper at this point. Maybe at this point WB can get him to sign off on his footage at a disounted cost

It freaks me out a little that I wrote that yesterday and the next day he is repoted to have passed on.

 

[Jools_S]

Yes..

He's all over BBC News 24 at the moment.

A brilliant actor.