'THE BEGINNING', now THAT'S what I call a behind the scenes documentary! (1 Viewer)

[Sean Moon]

Cant believe that no one is comparing this to the doc on Magnolia, which is very similar in style...but the Star Wars one is more compelling.
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[Artur Meinild]

I thought this doc was just ok, there was *waaaay* too much self-masturbation for my tastes...
I find "Under Pressure" (Abyss), "Terror Takes Shape" (The Thing) and "666: The Omen revealed" to be much better documentaries overall...
But that's just my opinion, and I'm ready to defend it!
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~ Stud. Polyt. ~ Artur Meinild ~

 

[Shane Dodson]

Now before we get some more posts making some smug comments about how TPM-bashers feel somehow "vindicated" by Lucas's comments after the rough cut screening, we should all bear in mind Lucas's opening comments in the DVD commentary.
Essentially, right off the bat Lucas defends TPM, calling it a small piece of larger puzzle (can't remember his exact words, maybe someone can help me out there). He's painfully aware of the fan backlash (which is small, but unfortunately--due to the Internet--VERY vocal), and he's quick to get his defense of the film out of the way before delving into the technical aspects of mounting the production.
It's not as simple a scenario as I see being painted here in this thread. Lucas DID react with some disappointment after viewing his rough cut. Y'know what? That happens ALL of the time. That's what the editorial process is for. Lucas understands that as well as any filmmaker. He's spending his OWN cash on this project...he's investing several YEARS on it's development and production...and people are surprised that he reacts critically to a rough cut?
I personally don't take any happiness from the fact that Lucas and Co. realized that they needed to do a LOT of work to finesse TPM before release date. Making a film is both a dream AND a nightmare. We saw both sides of that during this documentary. It's only because TPM has become an easy target for "bashers" that we get a reaction of surprise (in some strange cases, PLEASANT surprise, no less) when we learn that Lucas experienced some disappointment after seeing his rough cut.
Ask Spielberg...ask Scorsese...ask Coppola...ask ANY seasoned filmmaker how many times they've felt a sense of panic after viewing an early rough cut. Some folks are taking their hatred of TPM into levels I wouldn't think is appropriate.
My two cents.
-S.D.
[Edited last by Shane Dodson on October 15, 2001 at 05:20 PM]

 

[Norm]

I am not a Basher. I was in the "Lucas is God" camp for a long time (Since 77). I wasn't thrilled with Jedi, I was bummed about Solo/Greedo in the Special Editions, then BANG TPM. Now I am now willing to admit Lucas dropped the ball, I just hope he has too.
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Christopher Reeve Paralysis Foundation
http://apacure.org/

 

[Sam Davatchi]

Another ironic moment. During the re-shots, Lucas talking to Frank OZ, says that how he failed miserably with More American Graffiti. If you read a little about this movie you will see that Lucas tried to use his love of parallel editing on this one and it didn’t work. Jumping from one scene to another. If I remember correctly, you can read this in the official creative impulse book.
When you jump from one scene to another you break the tension and drama. Even action sequences look better if they are intact. If you look back, ANH and ESB are free of this. It was first widely used in Return of the Jedi and it actually worked well to a certain degree. They were coherent. Although I think that they should have kept all of the end dramatic sequences between Luke and Vader together.
It’s in TPM that this is used to an unacceptable degree. The only maybe good action sequence at the end is the Duel of the Fates and you cannot even enjoy it that much because it’s all chopped up in pieces. The only enjoyable action sequence in TPM is of course the pod race and that’s because it’s in one piece!

 

[Norm]

I would also like to add. The reason I'm hopping Lucas admits it, is so we all get a better Star Wars movie the next time.
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Christopher Reeve Paralysis Foundation
http://apacure.org/

 

[Sam Davatchi]

Ok, before anyone mentions ESB, I know that they used it in ESB but it was very little and it wasn’t a dramatic jump from a comedic scene to a grave scene!

 

[Norm]

Sam, I sure hope he lets the duels last longer this time.
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Christopher Reeve Paralysis Foundation
http://apacure.org/

 

[Alex-C]

The Magnolia documentary is the best Making of...I have ever seen...I havent watched the Beginning yet.
just wanted to submit my .02

 

[StephenC]

One of my favorite scenes is when Lucas gives Spielberg a tour of the set.It reminded me a little of when my friends come over and I "have" to show them all my new HT toys.

 

[Colin Jacobson]

I thought this doc was just ok, there was *waaaay* too much self-masturbation for my tastes...

I disagree. I thought the program was startlingly frank and candid, and it's an absolutely marvelous piece...
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Colin Jacobson
DVD Movie Guide
www.dvdmg.com

 

[Dwayne]

It's only because TPM has become an easy target for "bashers" that we get a reaction of surprise (in some strange cases, PLEASANT surprise, no less) when we learn that Lucas experienced some disappointment after seeing his rough cut.

Again, you like to go crazy with that word ("bashers"), don't you? It's easy for you to lump the people who criticize TPM into one group. What you forget is that most of us who were disappointed with TPM wanted anything but to be disappointed. I wanted Lucas to succeed.
I must admit that I am somewhat relieved to see that Lucas feels that he made some mistakes. Why? Because I think that Episode II will be a better film for that very reason.
This "basher" non-sense has got to stop.
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-Dwayne

 

[Jeffrey Forner]

Fan backlash for TPM is small? Yeah, maybe if you're from Dimension X.

Perhaps the backlash is small compared to the number of people who actually liked the film (myself included). Perhaps it just seems like a lot of people hated the movie because those who did are very, very, very vocal about it.
Then again, maybe the backlash wasn't small.
I have yet to get my hands on the DVD, but one thing is for certain: No matter how bad Lucas's, McCallum's, or Burtt's reactions to the first screening of the rough cut may be, I know that I will still enjoy the flick for what it is.
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-J.Fo
"Why do I always get a warped one?"

 

[Dwayne]

dupe.
[Edited last by Dwayne on October 15, 2001 at 11:42 PM]

 

[Dwayne]

Jeffrey,
I can only go on my own experience. I went to see TPM on that opening Wednesday night with about twenty people and all of us were disappointed on some level. And I have spoken to many others who have felt the same way. That's not to say that that there were no appealing aspects to the film at all. That's far from the truth. I enjoyed many sequences but I also felt that others moved too slowly. It just bothers me when I get grouped as a "basher" as opposed to someone who offers some constructive criticism.

I have yet to get my hands on the DVD, but one thing is for certain: No matter how bad Lucas's, McCallum's, or Burtt's reactions to the first screening of the rough cut may be, I know that I will still enjoy the flick for what it is.

I plan on doing the same thing.
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-Dwayne

 

[Kevin Leonard]

I too am in the "great documentary" camp.
Is it the best "making of" documentary made for DVD/laserdisc? Not by a long shot. But this is a very fascinating and revealing look at how one puts together a film. It's filled with tons of raw, behind-the-scenes footage, an aspect of DVD I love and wish was included on all discs. It's a vastly superior alternative to the "well, [insert name here] was great, a class act, the best"-type of documentary that fills up space on a DVD. I really don't know what type of audience those EPK-style documentaries are intended for.
Yes, there are a lot of aspects of filming that was left out of "The Beginning." But what I like about the disc is that there are another EIGHTEEN "making-of" featurettes that help to plug in the gaps. Yes, a lot of them lean a bit on the EPK-side, but at least there's quite a few interesting interviews and behind-the-scenes clips to balance out the more promotional aspects.
I have to say I am mightily impressed with the package overall. There's not a whole lot of fluff to be found, and "The Beginning" is certainly a documentary I'll watch multiple times. Plus, it has given me a new appreciation for the film, and this is coming from a guy who likes all four movies, but doesn't think deeply about them. If you're not going to buy this disc, at least give it a rental.
(Well, "The Beginning" and finally seeing TPM in all its widescreen glory is what made me like it a bit more. I was one of the five people who didn't see TPM in theaters and watched it for the first time on a P&S videotape. Yes, I know, I am a bad person and have sinned. )
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Have you ever noticed anyone driving slower than you is an idiot? And anyone driving faster than you is a maniac!! - George Carlin
ICQ: 55259446 (or just search for "John Shaft"...can you dig?)

 

[Tom Ryan]

I don't know if anyone else noticed this, but the lightsaber fight has its own chapters (#39 - Duel Of The Fates, #41 - Qui-gon vs. Darth Maul, #43 - Obi-Wan Vs. Darth Maul, #45 A Sith Vanquished), so if you want you can program your player to just play these sequences and get the lightsaber battle without most of the surrounding footage for demo purposes. Now if only I knew how to get my player to program chapters beyond 1-10, lol.......I haven't had a set-top too long, and the +10 key doesn't seem to do much.
-Tom

 

[Tom Ryan]

Ah, I am on such a Star Wars kick! I don't know if anyone ELSE really took this in, but there are a few shots from the original Star Wars in the deleted scenes documentary....so it's Episode IV.....ON DVD! Here is a screenshot, straight from disc two:

-Tom
[Edited last by Tom Ryan on October 16, 2001 at 01:48 AM]

 

[Richard Kim]

quote: When you jump from one scene to another you break the tension and drama. Even action sequences look better if they are intact. If you look back, ANH and ESB are free of this[/quote]
At the end of ESB, the action frequently cut between Leia, Chewie and Lando escaping, and Luke confronting Vader.
quote: Ok, before anyone mentions ESB, I know that they used it in ESB but it was very little and it wasn’t a dramatic jump from a comedic scene to a grave scene![/quote]
So you don't consider R2 and 3PO's antics(which include a dismantled 3PO getting repeatedly bashed on the head when Chewie tries to enter the Millenium Falcon) comedic?
[Edited last by Richard Kim on October 16, 2001 at 11:11 AM]

 

[Richard Kim]

duplicate
[Edited last by Richard Kim on October 16, 2001 at 11:09 AM]