For Those Who Want A Richard Donner Re-Cut of Superman II (1 Viewer)

[Dharmesh C]

Tom, you know I'm with ya on this

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Why? Verisimilitude!
Superman CINEMA
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[Charles Bober]

Count me in 1000%
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DTS Laser Disc. Size Does Matter

 

[Ken_McAlinden]

quote: ...not really, since most people prefer Richard Donner over Richard lester.. [/quote]I don't like Superman 3 much, but I like A Hard Day's Night , The Three Musketeers, and The Four Musketeers better than anything Richard Donner has ever directed. The only people I hold directly responsible for the badness of the Superman sequels are the Salkinds. They created the environment that led to these disasters. As much as Lester is somewhat culpable for not lying down on the tracks out of principle, the Salkinds were the train.
Regards,
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Ken McAlinden
Livonia, MI USA
[Edited last by Ken_McAlinden on October 19, 2001 at 10:11 AM]

 

[bill lopez]

Sounds like that we may have to wait for Rich Lester's death like we did with Stanley Krubrick to before we mess with the dvd.

 

[Tom Brennan]

Ken,
I'll take Superman, The Omen, The Goonies, Lethal Weapon, Lethal Weapon 2, Scrooged and Radio Flyer over anything Richard Lester ever did.
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Please vote for a Richard Donner Re-Cut of Superman II
http://www.hometheaterforum.com/uub/...ML/003753.html

 

[TheBat]

or even ladyhawke or that mel gibson/julia roberts movie for that matter.
JACOB
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[Ryan_M_M]

A Donner Superman II is ESSENTIAL!!!!!!!

 

[Ken_McAlinden]

I'll take Superman, The Omen, The Goonies, Lethal Weapon, Lethal Weapon 2, Scrooged and Radio Flyer over anything Richard Lester ever did.

Enjoy. I'll still trade them all for Hard Day's Night. My main point was that Richard Lester as a filmmaker was not the main problem. I was ilustrating that not everyone prefers Richard Donner over Richard Lester outside the context of "Superman".
People get so worked up about the Superman 2 & 3 fiasco that they tend to belittle Lester. That is akin to dismissing the works of Robert Wise because of his complicity in the studio edit of "Magnificent Ambersons". Of course, neither Lester nor Donner are on the level of Wise or Welles.
Regards,
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Ken McAlinden
Livonia, MI USA

 

[Ryan_M_M]

Ken
Lester is a good director, but in terms of Superman, he didn't have a clue about the character! This Superman II fiasco will go on throughout the ages.

 

[Dave H]

On the Digital Bits site, I see Superman II is on the Warner slate for "late 2002 and beyond."
[Edited last by Dave H on October 21, 2001 at 12:13 PM]

 

[Tom Brennan]

Ken,
No one is placing direct blame on Lester. Donner was fired by the producers of the film and Lester stepped in because he was owed money. Its clear to see the passion that Donner had for Superman when you watch the first film and select scenes from II that he directed. Lester did not care about Superman and it shows. Not to mention the ridiculous slapstick he seemed to add for no reason.
The thing with Lester is, he has never directed something out of his own vision. Anything he ever worked on was an already established entity : The Beatles, Three Musketeers, Butch Casidy and the Sundance Kid and Superman. I think most people like "Hard Days Night" for the Beatles, not for Lester's film making.
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Please vote for a Richard Donner Re-Cut of Superman II
http://www.hometheaterforum.com/uub/...ML/003753.html
[Edited last by Tom B on October 22, 2001 at 01:22 PM]

 

[Agee Bassett]

Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid?
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"Cinema is simply letting the audience fill in the blanks." - David Lean.

 

[TheBat]

I think he directed the prequel to butch cassidy and the sundance kid with tom berenger and william katt.
come out 10 years after the original movie.
JACOB
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[Anthony Hom]

The movie was Butch and Sundance: The Early Years.
As for Lester, have you heard of any film that was taken over by another director and the movie ended up better? I'm sure there are some, but rare and would appreciate it if anyone know of similar situations.
This thread is a Richard Lester bashing forum, like it or not. If they did recut the film, they would have to edit the credits to include Brando's name. He will also want 10 million up front to appear in the DVD. If you should complain to anyone, its the Salkinds. But that's politics for you, even in the film industry.

 

[Ken_McAlinden]

Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid?

He meant "Butch and Sundance, the Early Days".
Regards,
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Ken McAlinden
Livonia, MI USA

 

[Tom Brennan]

Ken,
My post was not to compare Lester to Donner, it was just to point out a fact. You like Lester and his films, thats fine.
Donner is a superior director for Superman. I think anyone would agree. The proof is there. Look what happened when Lester got full control over a Superman film....we got "Superman III".
Most fans of the Superman films actually despise the slapstick opening for III. That opening defines everything that is wrong with Lester's take on Superman. Even the slapstick bits in the Metropolis battle sequence in II were way over the top for the film. I would hope those elements would be cut out in any re-cut of II.
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Please vote for a Richard Donner Re-Cut of Superman II
http://www.hometheaterforum.com/uub/...ML/003753.html

 

[todd s]

Here is a way for Warner to release Superman 2 and get more people to buy or rebuy it. Once they redo the film with the Donner footage. They can release it as Superman 2 "The Version You've Never Seen". Don't laugh. How many people bought this version because it was different from what they own or what they've seen. If their is so much footage and story plots that were different. It would almost be a completely different movie.

 

[Peter Avellino]

Here's the thing: this has become a Richard Lester-bashing thread and there's no reason for it. Comments belittling his contribution to the Beatles and Musketeer films, saying you'll take any Donner film over one of his (Radio Flyer?), that he has never made something that he is truly responsible for. Really? Have you seen Petulia? Have you seen The Knack, which took the Grand Prize at Cannes in 1965? Juggernaut? Robin and Marian? (Okay, not an original character, but neither is Brett Maverick.) I highly recommend these films and I also recommend checking out the Steven Soderbergh-authored book Getting Away With It which contains extensive interviews with Lester about his career.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/AS...337485-5508947
I go with the Maltin guide on the opening of Superman III - "Clever setpiece, just doesn't belong in this film." That's right. It's not a piece of hackwork, like so much of what we get these days, it's just wrongheaded.
Hey, I like Richard Donner films a lot(except for Radio Flyer. And The Toy). I love Superman, Lethal Weapon and a few of the sequels. I genuinely enjoy The Omen, Maverick, Conspiracy Theory, Scrooged. I'm certainly not going to bash one director in favor of another(unless we're talking about Radio Flyer. But hey, if you like it, enjoy.). I do believe that since Warner didn't reply with a No during the chat, that something will be released in some form some day. But will it truly satisfy everybody? What do you do about the Brando scenes? What about music? Effects? Can they afford to get Gene Hackman in there to reloop the dialogue done by a bad impersonator of him? These are all realistic questions.
In the meantime, I think The Knack is coming on DVD from MGM next year. Everyone should see The Knack.

 

[Ken_McAlinden]

I honestly believe that the best we can hope for is a remastered film with extensive deleted scenes presented in some creative way.
Warner has done this with a Star is Born using stills to accompany scenes for which no footage existed. This would probably be the only way to give some semblance of Donner's vision of Superman II since he never got the whole thing "in the can" and it is way too late for re-shoots.
Of course, considering the reported legal actions accompanying the most recent DVD releases, I am tempted to paraphrase a line from the Rutles: All You Need is Cash. Warner Brothers have announced that the Superman II Richard Donner "Fired Director's Cut" will be released simultaneously as a video, a DVD, and a lawsuit.
Regards,
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Ken McAlinden
Livonia, MI USA

 

[Dave H]

I agree, Ken. Superman II looks "pretty good" and sounds "fair" but I would think it could potentially look and sound as good as the first movie on DVD.
Showing Brando footage - I would imagine - would create legal problems because brando would need to get paid for that and I don't know if Warner is willing to pay him whatever the price may be. I would love to see the scene where Brando reaches out to Superman in order to restore his powers and give up his "soul".