Jump to content



Sign up for a free account to remove the pop-up ads

Signing up for an account is fast and free. As a member you can join in the conversation, enter contests and remove the pop-up ads that guests get. Click here to create your free account.

Photo
- - - - -

Loopin in my mind about AVR choice


  • You cannot start a new topic
  • Please log in to reply
39 replies to this topic

#21 of 40 OFFLINE   schan1269

schan1269

    HTF Expert



  • 14,450 posts
  • Join Date: Jul 04 2012
  • Real Name:Sam
  • LocationChicago-ish/NW Indiana

Posted September 04 2013 - 05:15 PM

About the only people who care about multiple crossovers are those of us into SACD/DVD-A and buy large speakers for all channels, yet still want the sub to play up to 80hz. 

 

With single point AVR(the bottom end Denon and Onkyo are also this way, predominantly the ones without Audyssey), if you want your speakers to play to 40...you have to have your sub set up to 40 as well.



#22 of 40 OFFLINE   Soundaholic

Soundaholic

    Extra



  • 16 posts
  • Join Date: Sep 04 2013
  • Real Name:Jasper

Posted September 04 2013 - 05:17 PM

Don't mean to be rude but can we focus on the original post? Can someone comment on the Class D amp sounding "different" or lacking in go when we get serious in our listening? And do any of the receivers mentioned or suggested have separate crossovers for front, rear, sub, etc?


Edited by Soundaholic, September 04 2013 - 05:18 PM.


#23 of 40 OFFLINE   schan1269

schan1269

    HTF Expert



  • 14,450 posts
  • Join Date: Jul 04 2012
  • Real Name:Sam
  • LocationChicago-ish/NW Indiana

Posted September 04 2013 - 05:27 PM

We weren't being "rude". We were clarifying that you could/should also consider the Yamaha A30X0. (as in 3000 to 3040)

 

Class D amps, to me, sound dead. But I'm used to class A and AB. I also have a tube on a pair of Heathkit.

 

I had a class D amp in my car for about a week, yanked it back out.

 

Any AVR with Audyssey(including NAD, which you could also consider) and Anthem, plus the A30X0 have multiple crossovers.

 

All Pioneer/Elite and anything Yamaha not an A30X0 is single point.

 

Have no clue about Sony.



#24 of 40 OFFLINE   Type A

Type A

    Supporting Actor



  • 799 posts
  • Join Date: Apr 07 2007
  • Real Name:Ty
  • LocationPortland Oregon

Posted September 04 2013 - 05:30 PM

My apoligies Jasper, here at HTF we take a lot of pride in giving the most accurate advice possible.
JVC DLA-RS60U3D & DaLite High Power 106"
Paradigm Studio V.5 20 (5) & ADP590 (2)  
Hsu VTF-2 MK3 (2) & MBM-12 MK2 (2)

Yamaha RX-A3010 & Emotiva XPA5
Oppo BDP93 & Darbee DVP 5000

*My Home Theater Photo Journal*

#25 of 40 OFFLINE   Soundaholic

Soundaholic

    Extra



  • 16 posts
  • Join Date: Sep 04 2013
  • Real Name:Jasper

Posted September 04 2013 - 05:39 PM

My apoligies Jasper, here at HTF we take a lot of pride in giving the most accurate advice possible.

This is appreciated.

 

I am trying to narrow down my choices - not expand them. Do any of the choices I mentioned not have separate crossovers? If not, that wasn't mentioned. Then maybe i should consider the Yamaha.



#26 of 40 OFFLINE   Soundaholic

Soundaholic

    Extra



  • 16 posts
  • Join Date: Sep 04 2013
  • Real Name:Jasper

Posted September 04 2013 - 05:42 PM

I didn't say you were being rude. I said "I don't mean to be rude". lol...

 

Thanks for answering the question about the Class D amps. I guess the same rule applies from car audio. I used AB amps as well.

 

We weren't being "rude". We were clarifying that you could/should also consider the Yamaha A30X0. (as in 3000 to 3040)

 

Class D amps, to me, sound dead. But I'm used to class A and AB. I also have a tube on a pair of Heathkit.

 

I had a class D amp in my car for about a week, yanked it back out.

 

Any AVR with Audyssey(including NAD, which you could also consider) and Anthem, plus the A30X0 have multiple crossovers.

 

All Pioneer/Elite and anything Yamaha not an A30X0 is single point.

 

Have no clue about Sony.

 

 



#27 of 40 OFFLINE   gene c

gene c

    Producer



  • 5,732 posts
  • Join Date: Aug 05 2003
  • Real Name:Gene
  • LocationBay area, Ca

Posted September 04 2013 - 05:56 PM

I also have a Pioneer Elite vsx-23 (about a 5 year old model with a class A amp) and a couple of years ago I bought an SC-35. All SC's, either Elite or standard Pioneer, are class D's. I didn't notice any difference in sound quality while mostly listenning in two channel Pure Analog. Others say they hear a difference, I didn't.

 

While there may be some difference in sound quality between different receivers, features, connections and "usability" are the real differences. A single crossover setting could be a real problem for some members so it was important to point it out. It was also important (and enjoyable I bet :lol: ) for Ty to correct my little boo-boo...again. 

 

Integras lack of a Pure Audio mode was also a disappointment.

 

Pioneers MCACC doesn't eq the sub.

 

Denons are a pain in the...

 

Marantz isn't what it used to be, but still pretty good.

 

In short, there is no perfect receiver.

 

In the $700-$1000 price range I think an Elite would be a good match for you. But Integra or yamaha would also be a good choice.

 

Still fancy a Mrantz (one bad apple don't spoil the whole bunch) or Yamaha, oe Denon, Or Onkyo? Then consider a factory refurbished unit from ac4l.com. 5 Year extended warranties are reasonable.


Edited by gene c, September 04 2013 - 06:38 PM.

"Everyday room": Panasonic 58" Plasma, Dish HD DVR, Pioneer Elite vsx-23, BDP-23 BR, dv58avi universal dvd player, Paradigm Studio 20 V1, CC-450, Dayton HSU-10 subwoofer.

"Movie/Music room": Toshiba 65" DLP, Dish HD receiver, Marantz 7005, CC-4003, BD-7006, Polk LSI25's-LSi7's-LSiC, 2 original Dayton 10" "Mighty-Mites" subwoofers. (subject to change without notice).
 
Also have  MB Quart Vera VS05 +.....too much to list. Help me.
 
 

 


#28 of 40 OFFLINE   Type A

Type A

    Supporting Actor



  • 799 posts
  • Join Date: Apr 07 2007
  • Real Name:Ty
  • LocationPortland Oregon

Posted September 04 2013 - 06:14 PM

Im partial to Marantz and Yamaha just based on usability quality and reliability. I would avoid any AVR that does not have sub management (like the Pioneer system Gene mentioned). If getting an Audyssey room correction equipped AVR I would get the highest version possible as better room correction and sub management does make a big difference. I wouldnt really worry about crossover options or amp types.
JVC DLA-RS60U3D & DaLite High Power 106"
Paradigm Studio V.5 20 (5) & ADP590 (2)  
Hsu VTF-2 MK3 (2) & MBM-12 MK2 (2)

Yamaha RX-A3010 & Emotiva XPA5
Oppo BDP93 & Darbee DVP 5000

*My Home Theater Photo Journal*

#29 of 40 OFFLINE   Soundaholic

Soundaholic

    Extra



  • 16 posts
  • Join Date: Sep 04 2013
  • Real Name:Jasper

Posted September 04 2013 - 06:14 PM

Yeah...I was looking for something like this. somebody to differentiate out the features and pains of each receiver. Anyone else, please feel free to add!

 

This will be a hard decision. I ran a active setup in my car audio, not passive. Allowed for more adjustability, which I want. So the separate adjustable crossovers are nice.

 

I like Pure Audio as the NR5007 had it. This is a huge plus when it comes to music listening.

 

The Denon sounded better to me than the Marantz at Best Buy, but they weren't to knowledgable on how they were set up so who knows. Marantz sounded laid back while the Denon was more in your face which I like.

 

I also have a Pioneer Elite vsx-23 (about a 5 year old model with a class A amp) and a couple of years ago I bought an SC-35. All SC's, either Elite or standard Pioneer, are class D's. I didn't notice any difference in sound quality while mostly listenning in two channel Pure Analog. Others say they hear a difference, I didn't.

 

While there may be some difference in sound quality between different receivers, features, connections and "usability" are the real differences. A single crossover setting could be a real problem for some members so it was important to point it out. It was also important (and enjoyable I bet :lol: ) for Al to correct my little boo-boo...again. 

 

Integras lack of a Pure Audio mode was also a disappointment.

 

Pioneers MCACC doesn't eq the sub.

 

Denons are a pain in the...

 

Marantz isn't what it used to be, but still pretty good.

 

In short, there is no perfect receiver.

 

In the $700-$1000 price range I think an Elite would be a good match for you. But Integra or yamaha would also be a good choice.

 

Still fancy a Mrantz (one bad apple don't spoil the whole bunch) or Yamaha, oe Denon, Or Onkyo? Then consider a factory refurbished unit from ac4l.com. 5 Year extended warranties are reasonable.

 

 

 


Edited by Soundaholic, September 04 2013 - 06:16 PM.


#30 of 40 OFFLINE   gene c

gene c

    Producer



  • 5,732 posts
  • Join Date: Aug 05 2003
  • Real Name:Gene
  • LocationBay area, Ca

Posted September 04 2013 - 07:10 PM

Marantz receivers were considered "warm' or "musical" in days past but since they were bought by Denon a few years ago they are starting to closely resemble each other. But Marantz engineers are said to have at least a little input on their internal design  but who knows.

 

Another issue I had with Pioneer is they didn't have on-screen display of volume and surround mode adjustents. I think the newer receivers have them but I'm not sure. In my livingroom the receiver is 18' from the seating area and I can barely see the small front display. Having minor adjustments displayed on the screen is a huge help. But the 6 MCACC presets (even though they're not PEQ :) ) also remember individual speaker volums which is a nice thing. Most other receivers only have one manual eq. The SR-120 had 3.

 

Denon remotes are better then they used to be but Marantz remotes are the best out there, imo of course. Or, get a Harmony...while you still can.

 

Ac4l.com has refurbished Denon 3313's for $629 + shipping. A 5 year warranty is another $70. The 3313 is very similar to the Marantz 7005/7007.


"Everyday room": Panasonic 58" Plasma, Dish HD DVR, Pioneer Elite vsx-23, BDP-23 BR, dv58avi universal dvd player, Paradigm Studio 20 V1, CC-450, Dayton HSU-10 subwoofer.

"Movie/Music room": Toshiba 65" DLP, Dish HD receiver, Marantz 7005, CC-4003, BD-7006, Polk LSI25's-LSi7's-LSiC, 2 original Dayton 10" "Mighty-Mites" subwoofers. (subject to change without notice).
 
Also have  MB Quart Vera VS05 +.....too much to list. Help me.
 
 

 


#31 of 40 OFFLINE   Soundaholic

Soundaholic

    Extra



  • 16 posts
  • Join Date: Sep 04 2013
  • Real Name:Jasper

Posted September 06 2013 - 03:12 PM

I think my decision may come down based off the answer to this question. 

 

What amps out there has PURE AUDIO and is THX PLUS 2 certified and is around $1000 or less (if any) but the next cheapest?


Edited by Soundaholic, September 06 2013 - 03:12 PM.


#32 of 40 OFFLINE   schan1269

schan1269

    HTF Expert



  • 14,450 posts
  • Join Date: Jul 04 2012
  • Real Name:Sam
  • LocationChicago-ish/NW Indiana

Posted September 06 2013 - 03:26 PM

Onkyo 727/828.

#33 of 40 OFFLINE   Soundaholic

Soundaholic

    Extra



  • 16 posts
  • Join Date: Sep 04 2013
  • Real Name:Jasper

Posted September 06 2013 - 04:05 PM

anything else besides ONKYO?



#34 of 40 OFFLINE   schan1269

schan1269

    HTF Expert



  • 14,450 posts
  • Join Date: Jul 04 2012
  • Real Name:Sam
  • LocationChicago-ish/NW Indiana

Posted September 06 2013 - 04:19 PM

You want THX. That is what is ruling out everything else.



#35 of 40 OFFLINE   schan1269

schan1269

    HTF Expert



  • 14,450 posts
  • Join Date: Jul 04 2012
  • Real Name:Sam
  • LocationChicago-ish/NW Indiana

Posted September 06 2013 - 04:50 PM

The lowest cost THX Elite is the SC75 at $1600.



#36 of 40 OFFLINE   Soundaholic

Soundaholic

    Extra



  • 16 posts
  • Join Date: Sep 04 2013
  • Real Name:Jasper

Posted September 06 2013 - 04:53 PM

Last question, which AVR will have Pure Audio around that price range? Lets forget about the THX.



#37 of 40 OFFLINE   schan1269

schan1269

    HTF Expert



  • 14,450 posts
  • Join Date: Jul 04 2012
  • Real Name:Sam
  • LocationChicago-ish/NW Indiana

Posted September 06 2013 - 05:30 PM

Denon X1000 (have no idea if any of the E series have it as I don't care to bother with those)

Yamaha 675

Onkyo 626(525 might as well)

Elite VSX 43



#38 of 40 OFFLINE   Soundaholic

Soundaholic

    Extra



  • 16 posts
  • Join Date: Sep 04 2013
  • Real Name:Jasper

Posted September 15 2013 - 08:44 AM

i thought the marantz sr5008 has pure audio. Or is it just direct audio? I think that will be good enough...It also has preouts. I think this is the AV that I will be going for.



#39 of 40 OFFLINE   gene c

gene c

    Producer



  • 5,732 posts
  • Join Date: Aug 05 2003
  • Real Name:Gene
  • LocationBay area, Ca

Posted September 15 2013 - 10:10 AM

The 5008 does have Pure Audio. It's the button on the bottom right of the remote. With an analog signal it also turns off the video output. With an HDMI signal the video is still transferred to the display. You can also use the L/R connection from the multi-ch analog inputs as they bypass all conversion and processing.

 

It's nice to see Marantz is still including pre-outs and 7.1 ch analog inputs. They're starting to disappear in entry and mid-level receivers. I really like Maantz receivers because they arfe much easer to setup and operate then most others (IMO of course), even if they are more exensive then their Denon cousins. But it looks like they've really watered down the remotes on the newer receivers (Onkyo/Integra also has). But I guess most people might lke the fewer buttons and less cluttered look. The remotes on my 5005/6005/7005 were/are about the best I've used from a receiver manufacture. Hated the ones from the older 7002/8002.


"Everyday room": Panasonic 58" Plasma, Dish HD DVR, Pioneer Elite vsx-23, BDP-23 BR, dv58avi universal dvd player, Paradigm Studio 20 V1, CC-450, Dayton HSU-10 subwoofer.

"Movie/Music room": Toshiba 65" DLP, Dish HD receiver, Marantz 7005, CC-4003, BD-7006, Polk LSI25's-LSi7's-LSiC, 2 original Dayton 10" "Mighty-Mites" subwoofers. (subject to change without notice).
 
Also have  MB Quart Vera VS05 +.....too much to list. Help me.
 
 

 


#40 of 40 OFFLINE   Soundaholic

Soundaholic

    Extra



  • 16 posts
  • Join Date: Sep 04 2013
  • Real Name:Jasper

Posted September 16 2013 - 06:42 AM

I ended up going with a Denon 3313 CI. I found a deal that I couldn't pass up at the local Best Buy. $700. Has preouts, direction audio, all the stuff I was looking for.

 

First impression:

 

WOW. I was not expecting that level of output from my speakers which are Klipsch RF 82s ii. Only running the 2 mains for now. Got good wires as well (not monster) which may be contributing. The characteristics and output of the klipsch speakers have totally exceeded my expectations from when I auditioned them in the store, which was through a separate ampflier. I think Klipsch and Denon match very well together. Can't wait to expand on this system!


Edited by Soundaholic, September 16 2013 - 06:45 AM.





0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users