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FINALLY.....RHODA!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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178 replies to this topic

#21 of 179 OFFLINE   vnisanian2001

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Posted March 19 2009 - 12:22 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by MatthewA
I'm pissed off, too, but not at Shout! They just don't have the resources to create new transfers. Fox could have restored and remastered from the negatives at any time. They didn't.

Anytime the issue of syndicated episodes on DVD occurs, you usually mention the unedited network versions being on 3/4" inch U-matic tapes in the Library of Congress. You think Shout! Factory could have just acquired those tapes from there?

I also find it odd that Shout! can release Mr. Belvedere and Room 222 (both of which they also acquired from Fox) uncut, but not this show, which, in this case, is a mix of syndicated and network episodes.
 To all fans of Mr. Belvedere who haven't purchased season 4 yet, please watch this video.

#22 of 179 OFFLINE   Aryn Leroux

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Posted March 19 2009 - 02:16 AM

Unfortunately I had to cancel my pre-order here. I just can't justify buying this even though I really want to own it. I do not blame shout, unless we find out they could have acquired the uncut episodes from Fox. But, I have to think Shout did the best they could here. It's to bad Posted Image

#23 of 179 OFFLINE   Simon Caleb

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Posted March 19 2009 - 02:23 AM

I for one could have lived with variable sound, or picture quality, however 15 cut episodes on top, I think not.

I'm letting Shout! know I'm not buying and for which reasons, perhaps others who feel the same could drop them a line...
It's a 'need to know' situation, Paramount need to know we want F13th 2-8's restored and uncensored. No amount of talking head extras will do.

#24 of 179 OFFLINE   Aryn Leroux

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Posted March 19 2009 - 02:25 AM

I would have dealt with the syndicated cuts, if they were not piss poor video to boot. But, the combination of the two is too much.

#25 of 179 OFFLINE   ChrisCook

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Posted March 19 2009 - 02:30 AM

This will be the second time I have to pass on "Rhoda", I'm sorry to say. Posted Image

Thanks for posting this in advance, Matthew.

#26 of 179 OFFLINE   Simon Caleb

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Posted March 19 2009 - 02:33 AM

Here's the place to let Shout! Factory know how you feel.

Contact Shout! Factory
It's a 'need to know' situation, Paramount need to know we want F13th 2-8's restored and uncensored. No amount of talking head extras will do.

#27 of 179 ONLINE   Powell&Pressburger

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Posted March 19 2009 - 02:36 AM

I've waited on this set ever since the first season of MTM was released. I would have thought Shout Factory would have noted the issues on the press release and apoligize and make their case based on facts that maybe these were the only source materials they could find for season one... maybe the rest of the seasons would be fine.

If they don't try to clear up the issue sales could be so bad for Season one of RHODA that we may never see anothe season released. It may have been a lost cuase.

I have no idea if I am going to buy it now at all... which raises more questions for other tv show releases they are about to put out... but then again we should have known something was up when it didn't get the title COMPLETE Season one unlike other show releases from SHout.


I also sent SHOUT and e-mail reagarding the release to come forward and explain the release and is this only for Season 1? Or are we in for never having a complete RHONDA.

Stop the Replacing of original Studio Opening / Closing logos! They are part of film history.

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#28 of 179 OFFLINE   vnisanian2001

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Posted March 19 2009 - 03:21 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Powell&Pressburger
but then again we should have known something was up when it didn't get the title COMPLETE Season one unlike other show releases from SHout.

The word "Complete" has been contradictory with some sets.

For example, WKRP Season 1 had that word, and all the episodes were badly butchered.

Also, there have been some sets that didn't use the word "Complete", but were presented unedited anyways. Ever thought of that?
 To all fans of Mr. Belvedere who haven't purchased season 4 yet, please watch this video.

#29 of 179 OFFLINE   Corey3rd

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Posted March 19 2009 - 03:50 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Powell&Pressburger
I also sent SHOUT and e-mail reagarding the release to come forward and explain the release and is this only for Season 1? Or are we in for never having a complete RHONDA.

I doubt the guys at Shout! didn't do their best to find the complete tapes. It's just the sad nature of corporations which over the decades considered their vaults valuable, but considered paying for restoration and upkeep a luxury. Two generations of heartless beancounters will do that to a company. To them videotape is videotape, but a dollar is a percentage of their job performance bonus.

Maybe Shout! could have waited, but the timing on this has to line up with the Mary Tyler Moore Show release. They need to piggyback on that attention.
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#30 of 179 ONLINE   Powell&Pressburger

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Posted March 19 2009 - 04:09 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by vnisanian2001
The word "Complete" has been contradictory with some sets.

For example, WKRP Season 1 had that word, and all the episodes were badly butchered.

Also, there have been some sets that didn't use the word "Complete", but were presented unedited anyways. Ever thought of that?

Yep I am aware other seasons sets mislabel with COMPLETE, but I think Shout Factory has used it factually on their releases. So they were very aware of not listing it as such.

still 35th Ann. kinda sounds not so fresh now. oh well.

Stop the Replacing of original Studio Opening / Closing logos! They are part of film history.

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#31 of 179 OFFLINE   rcbrad

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Posted March 19 2009 - 05:32 AM

I am so disappointed. This is really bad news. I guess it is what it is. I guess there is nothing that can fix this now, it's a done deal. I am having second thoughts about buying this. Maybe they can do a better job with the other seasons (if they are indeed released) I probably will buy it though. It is better than nothing at all.

#32 of 179 OFFLINE   Theodore J. Mooney

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Posted March 19 2009 - 05:38 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Theodore J. Mooney
This is another set I plan to buy. I haven't seen this series in ages. The last time I seen it was when Nick-at-Nite aired it back in the 90's. So it is going to be a treat to watch this set. I can't wait to watch the Rhoda's Wedding episode ... that one was so hilarious.

Scratch that. I won't be buying this mess of a set. I'm better off getting a bootleg set than this.
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#33 of 179 OFFLINE   Mike*SC

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Posted March 19 2009 - 09:22 AM

I'm certainly disappointed, but I can't say I'm surprised. I don't say that cynically. I just don't know how anybody could expect high sales for the less popular sibling of a series that famously never sold very well. Which means things that cost real money -- searching for pristine elements, tracking down original length masters, etc. -- had to be sacrificed if there was any hope to make this a profitable endeavor. I was hoping, of course, that this wouldn't be the case. But it's easy to see how, and why, it happens.

#34 of 179 OFFLINE   Jack P

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Posted March 19 2009 - 10:34 AM

The way the review describes these edits reminds me of how awkwardly bad the edits are of MTM S7 that I have seen on TV Land Canada in the past where it was the biggest hack job on a program I'd ever seen. It sounds like they just used a similar set of syndication masters prepared the same way.

I was only going to get this set if MTM complete series remains on-track but now I don't think I'm even going to get it even if MTM is released.

#35 of 179 OFFLINE   Brian Himes

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Posted March 20 2009 - 04:08 AM

Wow! What a major bummer. This is really a sad, sad day. While I'm still going to buy the set, I was looking forward to seeing the show complete and uncut. I only saw the show when Nik-at-Nite showed it and that is what I have on tape. I guess, like Bob Newhart Show (which I didn't find the video quality all that great either), the masters have just not been taken care of. I don't blame Shout, nor do I really blame Fox. Fox inherited the show and if this is all that there is left, then this is all that there is left. I'm not happy about this, but I'm still going to buy it becasue I'm such a huge fan of this show. But what a real bummer.

#36 of 179 OFFLINE   Simon Caleb

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Posted March 20 2009 - 04:29 AM

Until we are in possession of the facts, It'd be foolish to judge (positively or negatively) either party involved (Fox or Shout!).

Unless someone knows otherwise...
It's a 'need to know' situation, Paramount need to know we want F13th 2-8's restored and uncensored. No amount of talking head extras will do.

#37 of 179 OFFLINE   MatthewA

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Posted March 20 2009 - 06:27 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by vnisanian2001
Anytime the issue of syndicated episodes on DVD occurs, you usually mention the unedited network versions being on 3/4" inch U-matic tapes in the Library of Congress. You think Shout! Factory could have just acquired those tapes from there?

I also find it odd that Shout! can release Mr. Belvedere and Room 222 (both of which they also acquired from Fox) uncut, but not this show, which, in this case, is a mix of syndicated and network episodes.

Rhoda was shot on film, and for filmed shows up until the 1980s the production companies tended to send film prints. MTM Productions sent film prints of filmed shows (which was everything they made except WKRP) to the LoC up until 1982. Those prints will have faded by now.

The state of the negatives may have been such that putting them through a telecine without serious work may have damaged them further. That is, if there was ever any talk about remastering. Keep in mind that Fox didn't produce this show, as they did Room 222 and Mr. Belvedere. The materials for the MTM library may have been in transit at least once in their lives. The company was sold by Mary Tyler Moore to TVS of the UK, then to International Family Entertainment, which in turn was bought out by News Corporation. Anything could have happened between 1974 and today.

Shout! tends not to get the best masters, nor access to the vaults to find them, and I doubt they can afford to fund remasters. The picture quality on the first season of Punky Brewster reveals that they received not anywhere near first generation copies. They were international masters with dropouts (albeit uncut ones), and with that show's joint ownership I wouldn't know where the original 1" tapes are held. The same goes with Father Knows Best S1. They went with what was already easily accessible. For FKB it was only the outcry over cutting that led Sony to do any better on S2.

Enough is enough, Disney. No more evasions or excuses. We DEMAND the release Song of the South on Blu-ray along with the uncut version of Bedknobs and Broomsticks on Blu-ray. I am going to boycott The Walt Disney Company until then.


#38 of 179 OFFLINE   Brian Himes

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Posted March 20 2009 - 08:36 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by MatthewA
Rhoda was shot on film, and for filmed shows up until the 1980s the production companies tended to send film prints. MTM Productions sent film prints of filmed shows (which was everything they made except WKRP) to the LoC up until 1982. Those prints will have faded by now.

The state of the negatives may have been such that putting them through a telecine without serious work may have damaged them further. That is, if there was ever any talk about remastering. Keep in mind that Fox didn't produce this show, as they did Room 222 and Mr. Belvedere. The materials for the MTM library may have been in transit at least once in their lives. The company was sold by Mary Tyler Moore to TVS of the UK, then to International Family Entertainment, which in turn was bought out by News Corporation. Anything could have happened between 1974 and today.

Shout! tends not to get the best masters, nor access to the vaults to find them, and I doubt they can afford to fund remasters. The picture quality on the first season of Punky Brewster reveals that they received not anywhere near first generation copies. They were international masters with dropouts (albeit uncut ones), and with that show's joint ownership I wouldn't know where the original 1" tapes are held. The same goes with Father Knows Best S1. They went with what was already easily accessible. For FKB it was only the outcry over cutting that led Sony to do any better on S2.

Well, this does explain alot. Is is possible that the original masters/negatives are missing for some episodes? I know from watching Nik-at-Nite that Bob Newhart, Rhoda, Phyliss and Mary all looked rather grainy and faded. Some episodes looked worse than others, but over all none of those shows looked pristine. I was very surprised with Mary Tyler Moore when it hit DVD. The picture looked amazing. However, the Bob Newhart sets tended to have the same faded, bland look that they did on Nik-at-Nite. True, there was a marked improvement in the cleanup that Bob Newhart went through, but they weren't the quality that Mary Tyler Moore got. I don't want to lay the blame on Shout. If this is all that there is left, so be it. Shout has done a great job with That Girl and I'm very excited about Room 222 so I'd hate to ponit a finger at Shout. They may have done all that they could to get the best elements available. I'll just have to wait and see what the set actually looks like when I get it.

#39 of 179 OFFLINE   Dan*T

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Posted March 20 2009 - 11:55 AM

I Understand that everyone is dissapointed. But isn't "some" Rhoda better than "none" Rhoda?
I've waited for this for years, and I will still pick it up. I look at it this way, in 35 years, anything could have, and probably DID happen to the masters.
Aren't some of you guys being a bit harsh?
I mean, it's not like watching "Friends" or "Seinfeld" which is on ten times a day on thirty diiferent channels.
Rhoda is definetly hard to come by.
I have some butchered/edited episodes which I recorded from TVLAND Canada, and the show is still very enjoyable to watch.
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#40 of 179 OFFLINE   The Obsolete Man

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Posted March 20 2009 - 01:22 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan*T
I Understand that everyone is dissapointed. But isn't "some" Rhoda better than "none" Rhoda?
I've waited for this for years, and I will still pick it up. I look at it this way, in 35 years, anything could have, and probably DID happen to the masters.
Aren't some of you guys being a bit harsh?
Every time a box set is released with syndicated episodes, we have this debate.

I guess it all depends on how much you enjoy the show, if you're willing to lose roughly a few episodes worth of material, and if you're just determined not to support edited shows being released on DVD.

Everyone's tolerances are different.

Sometimes, supporting a flawed first season helps (Father Knows Best). Sometimes, it's garbage in, garbage out (ALF).

I guess it all depends on how much you want this show, and if you can stomach the edits.


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