SXRD beats DLP (2 Viewers)

[Nick:G]

But you're still not bypassing the TV's built-in deinterlacer by sending an upconverted 720p signal from a DVD player to it. No matter what you do, it will still do processing of its own to the signal it receives from the source. You can buy DVD players for $60 that have HD video upconversion over HDMI. But not all of them are created equal. In fact, I've seen numerous cases where upconverted video did more harm than good on certain sets.

As stated here before, Sony SXRD has a very good video scalar that is far superior to the one Samsung uses. Samsung is a good bang-for-buck DLP set, but you can't expect much more than that. Sony sets cost more for a reason.

 

[SeanA]

I am no expert on video hardware, but I thought a "de-interlacer" simply converted an "interlaced" signal to "progressive". If true, I would still argue that the Samsung's de-interlacer is not put into play when feeding the TV a 720P signal. If the de-interlacer performs other processing functions, I would be interesting in knowing what are some of these other functions.

As for the up-scaling part of the equation, I am using a Sony up-scaling DVD player, so I would guess the quality of the scaling is at least as good as you will find in most Sony televisions. This fact again suggests that something other than the scaler is creating the macro-blocking. I do agree that an up-scaling DVD player does not necessarily produce a better picture. It depends on which piece of equipment (TV or DVD player) has a better scaler and de-interlacer. I have read several articles suggesting that most DVD players will have better processing hardware than the television because it is more of a primary or dedicated function for the DVD player.

 

[Jim Douglas]

Nice thread to read up on. I too have been going back and forth on what to get. I currently have a Pioneer Elite 630HD that Pioneer is going to refund my money on because of my ongoing problems. I wasn't planning on buying anything till they picked up my set and I had my check in hand. A couple of weeks ago CC was having a one day sale and I got the 60" XBR2 for under $2800.00. They didn't have any locally so I had to wait for it to get in. It's in now and I have till Wed. of next week to setup a delivery.

Since ordering the XBR2 I've been reading everything I can find and I think I'm more confused than ever. I tend to shy away from the DLP sets because of the possible rainbows and looking in stores I never was able to get them looking just right. The SXRD's tend to scare me with all the reports on other boards of "green blobs or green haze". After ordering the XBR2 and then looking for stands and measuring the XBR2 "dumbo ear" speakers are really an issue also. I like the case and size (width) on the 60A2000 much better and it would fit the room better but I don't want to give up anything in picture quality either.

I'm going to wait through the weekend and see what sales are out there and make a decision then. That XBR2 price I got is hard to walk away from

Any suggestions or thoughts would be appreciated.

Jim

 

[PeterTHX]

Don't worry Jim. The SXRD XBR2 is pretty much the best rear projection you can get. "Green Blobs"? Actually it's yellowish ones, an iris issue with some of them (and it's known and repairable). You don't return a Porsche because of a flat tire

 

[CoolCatbro]

not to edit your post...but daaannngg...I can 2nd that thought!

my brain is like a fried bannana.

Being a Rip Van Winkle of TV technology, and tight on the dough$$ and going into HDTV, its like being bombarded with too many types of bannanas

Mentally, I do feel the 16:9 is confirmed.
Not wanting a "bulb" to change out is confirmed.

Not sure on the 1080 leading edge or the 720P offering excellent bang for the buck?
Not sure on the technology as they all have pro reviews and negatives.
DLP, LCOS, LCD, Plasma and the other 10?

(Whats with the LCD? with or without bulb? that confuses me too!)

led lighting, cheap bulbs or expensive bulbs? laser lighting is coming?
all the connections and changing terms... then the current standard TV shows look like crap on HDTV's? Blue Ray, Green blobs, Rainbows and Black levels, macro blocking, pixelating, plasma burn out... i'm starting to lose my bannanas...

best Buy has a Hitachi 1080 CRT? still ok if you don't need a flat panel and they're gonna quite making CRT's in the same article!!
Do I get stuck with another prehistoric looking huge black box? That needs calibrated frequently?

I need a bannana beer and will calmly and intelligently make a home theater executive decision soon. (in other words... flip a coin).

 

[Gregg Loewen]

hi guys
there is a lot of mis information in this thread.

To start:
This is pure bull s***

the Sony green blob has nothing to do with the iris. It is only fixable by replacement of the light engine. And this not a real fix, as it has come back on some of them. the other fix Sony is doing is making the displays even BLUER than before, and this is on the Warm 2 Color Temp setting. The blue hue to the image will help to hide the greenishness of the image but will make the colors even more inaccurate.

The Samsung has DEAD ON accurate colors (after professional calibration by an experienced calibrator WITH the correct equipment. Its weakness is in processing and has NOTHING TO DO with 1 DLP panel vs 3 on an LCOS / LCD display.

The Toshiba DLP has excellent processing but does not have the ability to truly conform to SMPTE C specs. It is very nice once calibrated for maximal contrast ratio and D65 gray scale.

A very real weakness of all 3 panel designs is convergence error, and this is usually unfixable.

Gregg

 

[JayDerek]

Gregg ^ thank you for that explanation. I think that seals the deal about what brand TV i'll be getting in the next 2 weeks.

~Jason

 

[SeanA]

Gregg, I don't doubt any of your points and I particularly agree with the above comments. I like the color on my Samsung better than the Sony SXRDs I have seen, but I am sure part of it is the fact that my Samsung was professionally calibrated and the Sonys I have viewed were not.

The bottom line for me is that the "processing" is so poor on my Samsung that I have a hard time enjoying most DVDs that I watch. And since I don't plan to convert to HD DVD or BlueRay any time soon (until the prices come down and there is a clear winner), I am sorely tempted to ditch my Samsung for a Sony SXRD. It is night and day difference in terms of DVD playback and standard def programming. I am really pissed at Samsung for not offering a fix or replacement for this processing problem.

The other day, I did take my Harry Potter "Goblets of Fire" DVD out to Sears and viewed it on several different DLP sets, a Samsung, Mitsubishi, and Toshiba. I did not see the exact problem I am having with my 46" Samsung, but I can say all the DLP sets did a fairly poor job of showing any shadow detail in the beginning scenes. We played with contrast and brightness settings too, but it didn't make much difference. The SXRD sets did a much better job bringing out the shadow detail on this particular DVD.

I would caution anyone who plans to rely on standard DVDs for the next year or two to seriously consider technologies other than DLP, particularly if it is a Samsung set. Take a DVD like "Goblets of Fire" with lots of dark scenes and try it out on a number of different TVs before you make that purchase decision.

 

[Scott_L]

Additional info regarding the "green blob"--

http://ultimateavmag.com/rearproject...r2/index5.html

 

[PeterTHX]

If you like the sunburned look perhaps (pre calibration).
OK, you've professionally calibrated it. Can calibration make up for the fact that it seems to have an overall lower resolution? Try a text background, say a on screen display from a cable or satellite box. Calibration also doesn't get rid of HDMI handshake issues or on the fly input mode adjustments: try running an SXRD and a DLP with a Media Center PC and you'll see the DLP is crippled.

Sean's point about shadow detail can't be stressed enough as well. Which set has a better "black"?

There's a reason pro DLP systems use 3 panels. SXRD uses 3 panels, and DLP is trying to get rid of the color wheel (1950'S CBS color TV tech!) by introducing LED sets.

 

[CoolCatbro]

does the SONY SXRD 3-chip technology require 3 bulbs?

 

[Scott_L]

Just 1.

 

[Phil Iturralde]

Anyway, still enjoying my Video Calibrated (w/DVE) Toshiba 62HM196 1080p DLP!!!

Toshiba 62HM196 (Nov. 9, 2006)
Status as of Jan. 26, 2007
Power On Time:.........577
Lamp On Time:..........559
Lamp On/Off Count:...133

Phil

 

[Thomas W]

Would there be a significant picture quality difference between the 60" and the 70" versions of the Sony SXRD XBR2?

I'm also thinking about getting the Samsung HL-S7178W. I saw one in a store and I was impressed with the picture quality. Would this 71" set be substantially different than the 61" Samsung HL-S6188W model?

I'd like to maximize the screen size but I don't want to lose too much in picture quality for the extra size. Any thoughts about this?

 

[ChrisClearman]

depends on your seating distance and the source.

 

[Thomas W]

My seating is about 10 to 12 feet away. I assume that regular cable tv will look worse on the larger screen size, but standard DVD (upconverted) and HD-DVD should look about the same regardless of screen size?

 

[Gary Seven]

I considered a Samsung but I came across an issue from one of the forums dedicated to Samsung stating that when the unit loses power, the calibrated settings done via the service menu were reset to their defaults. This was not good for me as I live in an area where power outages happen. Therefore, any ISF calibrations done would be lost upon the first power outage and 400 dollars down the drain. Unfortunately, I cannot recall the link as I came across this while researching TV sets to buy. I don't know if this was something particular to this user's set or something that plagued Samsung in general but I didn't want to take the chance. Otherwise, I would have given serious consideration to purchasing a Samsung.

 

[ChrisClearman]

That's a pretty big flaw. At the least it seems you could write down all the settings. Still a PITA.

Thomas,
That's about right. SD on a 71" screen from 10' is going to look pretty rough. The Sony does a better job than the Samsung with SD though. If you will watch a lot of regular satellite/cable you might want to go Sony.