SVS PB2-Ultra Test & Review (1 Viewer)

[Matthew Todd]

Thank you for all the comments and help. I think that this is probably the right thing to do. I'll just start with 1 PB2Ultra, and if I want to add another later, I can.

Matt

 

[Edward J M]

Good move, Matt.

I'm with Robb; the on-board amplifier really has become an integral part of the overall performance package on powered SV subwoofers. The custom EQ at each tune point optimizes the FR, and the HPF and sophisticated amp limiter protects the woofers from being overdriven, allowing you to extract that last dB of deep impact without worry.

And the CV phase control, the PEQ, and the CV low pass filter make a pretty potent tuning/set-up combination, and can tame most FR anomalies at the speaker/sub transition.

I honestly don't think you will find output lacking in a 2500 ft3 room with a single PB2-Ultra. If anything, you won't be able to find its clean limits under any reasonable playback conditions. Look no further than the SPL timestamps in the DVD section as proof; SVS designs its subwoofers to be worked hard and deliver the goods.

As long as you stick to the standard tunes (I prefer the 25 Hz for music and the 20 Hz tune for DVDs), the PB2-Ultra will be damn near bulletproof, and will deliver all the refined, clean, deep bass you imagine in that size room.

 

[Edward J M]

Good move, Matt.

I'm with Robb; the on-board amplifier really has become an integral part of the overall performance package on powered SV subwoofers. The custom EQ at each tune point optimizes the FR, and the HPF and sophisticated amp limiter protects the woofers from being overdriven, allowing you to extract that last dB of deep impact without worry.

And the CV phase control, the PEQ, and the CV low pass filter make a pretty potent tuning/set-up combination, and can tame most FR anomalies at the speaker/sub transition.

I honestly don't think you will find output lacking in a 2500 ft3 room with a single PB2-Ultra. If anything, you won't be able to find its clean limits under any reasonable playback conditions. Look no further than the SPL timestamps in the DVD section as proof; SVS designs its subwoofers to be worked hard and deliver the goods.

As long as you stick to the standard tunes (I prefer the 25 Hz for music and the 20 Hz tune for DVDs), the PB2-Ultra will be damn near bulletproof, and will deliver all the refined, clean, deep bass you imagine in that size room.

 

[Mark Seaton]

I'm not sure I understand exactly what you want to measure? You can most certainly measure the impulse response, yet the more difficult part is in understanding what it means. The same is true when we start looking at phase. Response shape is pretty simple... Peaks in the response and sharper roll-offs generally have worse transient repsonses. At the same time, everyone likes to forget that your room mutilates the frequency and transient response orders of magnitudes more significantly.

While I do think there is merit to looking at phase response and waveshape preservation, this falls waaaay behind response, dynamic compression, and distortion problems. Until you get past these first three problems, the others are of much less concern.

 

[Mark Seaton]

I'm not sure I understand exactly what you want to measure? You can most certainly measure the impulse response, yet the more difficult part is in understanding what it means. The same is true when we start looking at phase. Response shape is pretty simple... Peaks in the response and sharper roll-offs generally have worse transient repsonses. At the same time, everyone likes to forget that your room mutilates the frequency and transient response orders of magnitudes more significantly.

While I do think there is merit to looking at phase response and waveshape preservation, this falls waaaay behind response, dynamic compression, and distortion problems. Until you get past these first three problems, the others are of much less concern.

 

[Craig Chase]

PB2-Ultra Vs. The B4+... It will be about the First of september before a review of the B4+ will be done... I will be mirroring a lot of methodology that Ed has used in his reviews, to try to keep things constant...

Of course, I am probably going to post a link of the review on a certain other forum... just because I cannot help myself...

As far as which to purchase? The B4+ does "sound" different than the PB2+ ... but until I get a full run of measurements done, and really get a chance to work it out well... I won't be posting a lot about it... just to avoid confusion

 

[Craig Chase]

PB2-Ultra Vs. The B4+... It will be about the First of september before a review of the B4+ will be done... I will be mirroring a lot of methodology that Ed has used in his reviews, to try to keep things constant...

Of course, I am probably going to post a link of the review on a certain other forum... just because I cannot help myself...

As far as which to purchase? The B4+ does "sound" different than the PB2+ ... but until I get a full run of measurements done, and really get a chance to work it out well... I won't be posting a lot about it... just to avoid confusion

 

[frank manrique]

quotes:

"Everytime I consider Frank (8 16-46s and 2 B4+s) I have to believe there must be some advantage to going with more than enough."

Not just "some" advantage, my friend...make that a HUGE advantage!

Look, I may not be as savvy as Ed or Craig, nor clever like Mark Seaton or Keith Yates, but I do understand a lot of things related to sound reproduction. Thus if it is good enough for people like Tom Nausine, Stan "The Man," et al --the sort of folks who have bothered to construct truly magnificent, one-of-a-kind subbass monster systems from conceptual ideas to actual physical entities--than it is good enough for me too (although I chose to go the commercial route rather than DIY)! :wink:

Plans for the future include EQ'ing and adding more watts to the bass system (s), so using that many subwoofer units will make things even easier, me thinks.

However, right now I must honestly confess to be a bit perturbed just having learned the B4+ does not utilize the TV-12 (Tom Vodhanel? ) driver. :frowning:
But I'll wait to see/read Craig's review of the B4+ before I begin sobbing, weeping...crying my eyes out.
Nope...better yet...I should first audition my pair of B4+s, which should arrive here in short order...

"Well, Frank is a special case..."

Indeed I am, my dear Sir!

"If that still isn't enough for you (that is, [if] you have Frank ['s] disease) then get another."

A wonderful disease I caught directly from the master designer himself...Tom Vodhanel!

I think you are just jealous 'cus am able to knock your wife's China goods from their shelves all the way from California...and you can't do it to me!...

"Of course, I am probably going to post a link of the review on a certain other forum... just because I cannot help myself... "

You better, or I'll be there to remind you!...

-THTS

"...hi, my name is Frank...and am an SVS bassaholic..."

 

[frank manrique]

quotes:

"Everytime I consider Frank (8 16-46s and 2 B4+s) I have to believe there must be some advantage to going with more than enough."

Not just "some" advantage, my friend...make that a HUGE advantage!

Look, I may not be as savvy as Ed or Craig, nor clever like Mark Seaton or Keith Yates, but I do understand a lot of things related to sound reproduction. Thus if it is good enough for people like Tom Nausine, Stan "The Man," et al --the sort of folks who have bothered to construct truly magnificent, one-of-a-kind subbass monster systems from conceptual ideas to actual physical entities--than it is good enough for me too (although I chose to go the commercial route rather than DIY)! :wink:

Plans for the future include EQ'ing and adding more watts to the bass system (s), so using that many subwoofer units will make things even easier, me thinks.

However, right now I must honestly confess to be a bit perturbed just having learned the B4+ does not utilize the TV-12 (Tom Vodhanel? ) driver. :frowning:
But I'll wait to see/read Craig's review of the B4+ before I begin sobbing, weeping...crying my eyes out.
Nope...better yet...I should first audition my pair of B4+s, which should arrive here in short order...

"Well, Frank is a special case..."

Indeed I am, my dear Sir!

"If that still isn't enough for you (that is, [if] you have Frank ['s] disease) then get another."

A wonderful disease I caught directly from the master designer himself...Tom Vodhanel!

I think you are just jealous 'cus am able to knock your wife's China goods from their shelves all the way from California...and you can't do it to me!...

"Of course, I am probably going to post a link of the review on a certain other forum... just because I cannot help myself... "

You better, or I'll be there to remind you!...

-THTS

"...hi, my name is Frank...and am an SVS bassaholic..."

 

[Craig Chase]

Frank... two things.

1. I think you will love the sound of your B4+, like the PB2-Ultra, it takes the sonics up a notch, but does so through different engineering. When you are hitting 115 dB peaks, and the cabinet is not vibrating...

2. Whenever my wife thinks I have lost it, I tell her about you...

 

[Craig Chase]

Frank... two things.

1. I think you will love the sound of your B4+, like the PB2-Ultra, it takes the sonics up a notch, but does so through different engineering. When you are hitting 115 dB peaks, and the cabinet is not vibrating...

2. Whenever my wife thinks I have lost it, I tell her about you...

 

[Richard_M]

Frank...

I am like you but on a smaller scale, having additional subs with the additional head room and bigger sweet spot for listening makes for a great experience.

You will find if you do EQ, it should improve your listening experience, but unless you have done some in room sweeps you will not know what problems you may have.

I know you will enjoy the B4+'s they are a great sub.

Dick

 

[Richard_M]

Frank...

I am like you but on a smaller scale, having additional subs with the additional head room and bigger sweet spot for listening makes for a great experience.

You will find if you do EQ, it should improve your listening experience, but unless you have done some in room sweeps you will not know what problems you may have.

I know you will enjoy the B4+'s they are a great sub.

Dick

 

[Mark Seaton]

I only hear the statement "I couldn't use any more" or "I can't imagine more sounding any better" from those who haven't experienced more. Sunday night I had some wacky fun with a ContraBass, a B-DEAP-32, a K2, a QSC DSP-4, and our TEF 20. This was no simple implementation, but we could sail along with just about any soundtrack at reference level before. Now the system can startle and make even me jump; and I'm somewhat desensitized.

One hugely important factor here is the availability of EQ and the tools to set it properly. Once you have a good means of measurement at hand, you can much more easily justify and use more headroom or more subs. In difficult rooms this is an even bigger factor. The room I mentioned above is a tough one for bass. The proper locations for subwoofers are not yet possible, so only side wall locations are an option. Combine that with a small office off the back side acting like a variable bass trap with the door open vs. closed, and if I had my way, there would be and additional ContraBass in the system!

On the other end of the spectrum, similar benefits come about from major headroom in your main speakers as well. I'm rather curious to experience and LCR of speakers with 100dB@ 1w/1m sensitivity and capabilities in the earbleed range.

 

[Mark Seaton]

I only hear the statement "I couldn't use any more" or "I can't imagine more sounding any better" from those who haven't experienced more. Sunday night I had some wacky fun with a ContraBass, a B-DEAP-32, a K2, a QSC DSP-4, and our TEF 20. This was no simple implementation, but we could sail along with just about any soundtrack at reference level before. Now the system can startle and make even me jump; and I'm somewhat desensitized.

One hugely important factor here is the availability of EQ and the tools to set it properly. Once you have a good means of measurement at hand, you can much more easily justify and use more headroom or more subs. In difficult rooms this is an even bigger factor. The room I mentioned above is a tough one for bass. The proper locations for subwoofers are not yet possible, so only side wall locations are an option. Combine that with a small office off the back side acting like a variable bass trap with the door open vs. closed, and if I had my way, there would be and additional ContraBass in the system!

On the other end of the spectrum, similar benefits come about from major headroom in your main speakers as well. I'm rather curious to experience and LCR of speakers with 100dB@ 1w/1m sensitivity and capabilities in the earbleed range.

 

[Robb Roy]

Well, get to it! I'll pay you.

-Robb

 

[Robb Roy]

Well, get to it! I'll pay you.

-Robb

 

[MikeKaz]

I was extremely impressed by the quality of your review and by the amount of objective performance data you obtained. Excellent job. It was most refreshing because of its "fair and balanced" nature (kind of like Fox news is supposed to be). It wasn't just the name SVS followed by a dozen "awesome"s as so many of the reviews are. Good work. I own an Ultra and can only imagine what two of them in one box sounds like.

 

[frank manrique]

quote:

"This was no simple implementation, but we could sail along with just about any soundtrack at reference level before. Now the system can startle and make even me jump; and I'm somewhat desensitized."

I rest my case...

"On the other end of the spectrum, similar benefits come about from major headroom in your main speakers as well. I'm rather curious to experience and LCR of speakers with 100dB@ 1w/1m sensitivity and capabilities in the earbleed range."

You know, that may be my system's weakness to a certain degree; the main and center channel speakers (prototype dynamic drivers, 4-way, with two 10" bass drivers per side, in separate enclosures; the upper bass/mid/HF section have separate boxes as well, while the center channel are two--yes, I know!--home-built original Speaker Builder D'Appolito designed "monitors"), that is.

However, I've been considering going the THX theatrical LCR transducing systems route (large JBL horn-loaded mid/HF sections, with dual-15" JBL drivers per bass section) after auditioning such a system at a friend's home.

The mid/HF horns sound surprisingly smooth (when properly EQ'd, of course), much better than I expected, being very dynamic, and capable of reproducing an excellent depth of field...while the vented bass sections capable of really belting out high sound pressure levels (though not really low in frequency--mid 30s maybe)...in an efficient, seemingly effortless manner; not many watts are required to drive these transducers into insane loud levels!
There is one big potential problem, though: these are HUGE speaker systems (thus require a lot of breathing room)!

-THTS

"...hi, my name is Frank...and am an SVS bassaholic..."

 

[frank manrique]

quotes:

"2. Whenever my wife thinks I have lost it, I tell her about you..."

Why, thank you, my friend! That makes me feel so much better...

"You will find if you do EQ, it should improve your listening experience, but unless you have done some in room sweeps you will not know what problems you may have."

You're right, of course. That is exactly what Tom "V" has intimated to me as well. I just need to find a way to do the room sweeps in a meaningful way...

"Well, get to it! I'll pay you."

Is the China really that bad?...

-THTS

"...my name is Frank...and am an SVS bassaholic..."