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Rawhide - Stalled/Abandoned?

Discussion in 'TV on DVD and Blu-ray' started by Gary OS, Feb 21, 2009.

  1. Gary OS

    Gary OS Producer

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    This has been discussed in a couple of other threads, but those threads are actually devoted to other series so I thought I'd start one that actually has the show in question in the title because there might be people who haven't heard this bit of news. According to jdee28, CBS/Paramount has no plans up through November of this year to release another volume of RAWHIDE. You can read about this in post #7 of the "Bonanza" thread here!

    CBS/Paramount had been on a schedule with this show that indicated we could expect another volume in May, but that is apparently not going to be the case now. This will be a huge, huge blow to me. RAWHIDE had become one of my all-time favorite releases.

    Gary "what a major bummer" O.
     
  2. Corey3rd

    Corey3rd Screenwriter

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    CBS has slowed down it's aggressive release schedule from a few months back when they seemed to have about 3-4 titles a week. kinda bites that Rawhide is getting backburnered since I've been enjoying it. Maybe it'll pick up as we get closer to Christmas.
     
  3. Jeff Willis

    Jeff Willis Producer

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    Count me in on hoping that they pick up the releases for this one. I remember some S3 episodes while Dad watched this show when they originally aired back in the early 60's. Watching the S1/2 DVD's is like a 1st-time view since I was too small back then to remember those (busy playing outside and waiting for the ice cream man's truck coming down the street [​IMG] )

    Jeff "Watched 'Incident at the Tinker's Dam' S2V2 at lunch today with charcoal-cooked sirloin, baked potato, green peas...doesn't get better than that" W.
     
  4. Flashgear

    Flashgear Second Unit

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    I live in a smaller city (60K) and really in the DVD retail backwater, but I noticed that RAWHIDE was always available on the shelf, in multiple copies, at my local brick and mortar stores on the street dates...I've purchased every volume of all 3 seasons this way, and been told by local retailers that it's sold well...a small sample, I know, but how well have these sets sold in the USA/CANADA? A lot of the other series I collect I've had to order online...so my perception was that RAWHIDE deserved the shelfspace to sell at retail brick and mortar stores.
    I'm going to be upset if this series doesn't continue, some of the best episodes to come are in seasons 4 and 5..."...Rio Salado","...Blacksheep", "...Boss's Daughters", "Deserter's Patrol", "Reunion" and many more just in season 4 alone. We learn more about Gil, Rowdy,and Pete. Richard Baseheart, Burgess Meredith, Barbara Stanwyck and others guest star. I know that the major draw here for casual collectors at first was Clint Eastwood alone, and CBS/P put him front and center on all boxart...that's probably all we can hang our hopes on for a resumption in releases...that and the recession easing...and yes, I saw "Gran Torino" and enjoyed that too, maybe his last on screen acting...a feel good movie for me!
     
  5. silverking

    silverking Guest

    More glum news !

    The loss of 'Rawhide' 'The Untouchables' & probably 'Gunsmoke' after S3 V2
    looks like CBS are ditching all their old classic line-up. I wonder about 'Perry Mason' also. Interesting they all seem to be half-season sets ! There is clearly an inbuilt resistance to them with consumers feeling 'ripped off'. Just troll through the reviews on Amazon for confirmation.

    I doubt they will ever be revived as time moves ever further away & the age profile of the audience most likely to purchase them declines year by year.

    For the first time in a number of years I don't have any items on my buying horizon.Classic TV on DVD is dying a rather quick death I fear.
     
  6. Bob Hug

    Bob Hug Screenwriter

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    Chris, in some respects I agree with you . . . . time is working against vintage television series, especially those which may have only been aired for a season or two, as well as those that were filmed/broadcast in black & white. But I think the future of vintage TV-on-DVD for the independent studios is different from the major studios. While certain series may get abandoned by a major studio, there's always the chance that the series may get picked up by an independent. Such is the case with "Adam-12," which Universal had released but abandoned after season 1. Shout! Factory came to the rescue and released season 2 and is working on a season 3 release. And I'd be greatly surprised if we didn't see anything in the way of vintage TV releases from Timeless Media beyond "Laramie" this year. And of course, there are other independents like VCI, MPI, Infinity Entertainment and S'more Entertainment that are likely to have at least some classic releases this year. But I do believe that vintage output from the majors, including CBS Paramount, is down to a trickle, especially where black & white shows are concerned. It's highly unlikely that we'll see much more (if any) in the way of older black & white shows from the likes of Sony, Fox, Universal or Warner (unless, like Uni, there are licensing arrangements), and I think that further b&w releases from CBS Paramount will be much more limited. MGM remains a question mark for me as they have done b&w shows (Addams Family, The Outer Limits, Mr. Ed), but their overall output of TV-on-DVD has been less than the other majors.
     
  7. Gary OS

    Gary OS Producer

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    My feelings are extremely well known here concerning this issue so I'll simply say I completely agree with Chris and Bob. The output for b&w releases in particular is seriously down and I don't see a turnabout anywhere on the horizon. And as you've both astutely pointed out, every day that passes simply diminishes the potential buying audience for these series as people grow old and die. Except in very, very rare instances most younger people haven't been exposed to these b&w classics and frankly couldn't care less about them. The iron has been hot (up until the recent economic downturn) and that was the time to make hay, so to speak, in releasing vintage material. Much was released and I'm very glad for that. But it looks like those golden days are over and I'm very pessimistic about the future of vintage, b&w TV on DVD. Very pessimistic.

    Gary "someone convince me otherwise - please!" O.
     
  8. smithb

    smithb Screenwriter

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    I was born in 1961 and so for a time early on when I was growing up we still had a 19" b/w TV. But besides that many of the reruns I saw growing up were still b/w even when we had a color set. As a result, I'm not adverse to watching b/w.

    Personally, I've been enjoying many early shows I had never even seen before in my youth, so it isn't all about nostalgia. But I do have to wonder about those growing up that haven't watched b/w. My wife was born in 1969 and hates anything in b/w.

    Back in the day we only had a few stations to choose from. Now there is so much available a person can avoid all reruns from the past and stick with just current material. The impact of that could be extremely bad. I have movies dating back to the 20's and 30's that have been restored and are in great shape. But the treatments of some TV show from the 50's and 60's is deplorable. It would sad if they were lost forever.

    I've picked up quite a few old shows in the last year but I have a feeling I'm going to be picking up quite a few more before they possible go OOP. I've been eyeing:
    - Big Valley season 2, volume 1
    - Untouchables, all seasons available
    - Cheyenne season 1
    - Combat! (all b/w seasons)
    - Andy Griffith (all b/w seasons)

    I agree that independents will probably pickup some of the shows but it still not like when a major studio releases them off the best available sources.
     
  9. Dave B Ferris

    Dave B Ferris Supporting Actor

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    From reading Gary's other posts, I know he is looking forward to the rumored/impending 'The Rifleman' set. I am too; and I am also wondering whether the set may provide a new 'model' for the release of vintage shows, wherein a given show, instead of being released by a studio or even by a licensed independent, may be released by a 'foundation' or consortium of avid fans in conjunction with people formerly involved with the production of the show.
     
  10. michael_ks

    michael_ks Screenwriter

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    Wish that I could convince you otherwise, Gary. Vintage releases are much like the stock market of late: a couple of minor "bull runs" (re: 4th qtr. '08) but the long term trend overall is a downward "bear market". Regarding "Rawhide", like you it instantly became a firm favorite and I've become increasingly concerned over the release of S4. I understand that in scouring fan sites that the series hit its peak in S3 and from S4 onward there is more than a share of 2 star episodes, but as this site indicates, there is much in the next season to enjoy:

    Rawhide--viewer reviews, season 4
     
  11. Bob Hug

    Bob Hug Screenwriter

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    A similar scenario is in the works for the early 1960s comedy, "I'm Dickens, He's Fenster," though whether it will come to fruition is anybody's guess.

    I'm Dickens, He's Fenster - Film Preservation / DVD Release Effort

    And, of course, "Steve Canyon" is being released independently.

    Steve Canyon On DVD

    As well as "Sky King."

    http://www.skyking.com/ordering.html

    And actor Stuart Whitman, owner of the series "Cimarron Strip," has also released that series independently.

    http://www.cimarronstrip.com/Cimarro...rip%20DVD.html

    The later two series will set you back a pretty penny, however. Prior to their wide distribution arrangement with Infinity Entertainment, Roxbury Entertainment sold a "best of" collection of "Route 66" episodes through Amazon (Roxbury is the owner of the series). Infinity recently re-released that set with different artwork.
     
  12. jdee28

    jdee28 Screenwriter

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    Well, the stalling of Rawhide sort of became official today. There's an announcement on tvshowsondvd.com for Gunsmoke Season 3, Volume 2 on May 26th. Instead of another announcement for Rawhide, we have The Mod Squad Season 2, Volume 2 taking its place.

    I wonder if we'd even see these announcements for Gunsmoke and Mod Squad if the first volume of the split seasons for each of these shows hadn't been released last year. It's pretty clear with the (temporary?) dropping of Cannon, Streets of San Francisco, The Untouchables and Rawhide, that CBS/Paramount is in full retrenchment mode. Who knows if we'll see further releases of any of these series.

    I do have hope for Perry Mason Season 4 this year though, as the CBS Syndication Library does say that Season 4 is in the process of being transferred to HD.
     
  13. Gary OS

    Gary OS Producer

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    John, I'm brokenhearted to have to agree with you. Here's betting that not only is RAWHIDE stalled out, but GUNSMOKE is probably hot on its trail. And yes, I do think since CBS/Paramount has transferred at least a portion of PERRY MASON to HD we probably have a shot at seeing that one continue for at least one more season. But right now the b&w catalog is shrinking big time.

    Gary "I really do see a discernible line between b&w versus color releases with almost every studio at this point" O.
     
  14. silverking

    silverking Guest

    I know I am clutching at very thin straws here but I recall Warners in their chat last year mentioning last year they were looking at ways of releasing their old detective/western series.

    Well, I notice they have taken action to clear out all the unofficial sets prevalent on IOffer. Maybe they are just being spiteful as, if they have no intention they don't gain much, or maybe they are considering some sort of classic line themselves ?

    I would have thought that the could test the waters by releasing a 'best of'
    in each genre with a couple of episodes on maybe a 2 or 3 disc set.
     
  15. Bob Hug

    Bob Hug Screenwriter

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    Chris, Warner did release single disc samplers of "Cheyenne" and "Maverick" a few years ago as part of the "Television Favorites" line and that resulted only in the season 1 release of "Cheyenne." I have to believe that Warner did not get the sales numbers it was looking for on these releases and, consequently, that probably makes it next to impossible for them to consider their other westerns like "Sugarfoot," "Colt 45," and "Bronco" . . . . . unless they can license it to an independent releasing company that doesn't have to sell a huge number of DVDs to make a profit. The release of "The Man from U.N.C.L.E." through Time-Life suggests that Warner might be open to further licensing/distribution deals. I'd sure like to see the Warner westerns and the detective series, but I believe that licensing is probably the only way that we'll see them; I seriously doubt that Warner will release them on their own. I do like your idea of a multi-disc sampler with different shows on them.
     
  16. DeWilson

    DeWilson Screenwriter

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    Well,Warners owns Time-Life which made it easier - they have been reluctant to licence out anything! I think it might be a mix of cost and quality control.
     
  17. Gary OS

    Gary OS Producer

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    That's a great point! I too find Warner Bros. to be reluctant about renting stuff out. Not sure we'll see much of that. What a shame, because they do have a great B/W catalog of detective and western shows.

    Gary "there are many WB classics I'd love to see released" O.
     
  18. ToddR2

    ToddR2 Stunt Coordinator

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    I too am sad about the lack of 2009 releases for The Untouchables, Rawhide, and Streets of San Francisco. Hopefully, this will be suspension of release programs for these shows, as opposed to a cessation. Warner Bros. should care one-one hundredth as much about their TV catalog as the do their film catalog.
     
  19. Garysb

    Garysb Screenwriter

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    FYI Time Warner does not own Time Life Video. They sold it years ago.
    From the Time Life website:
    TIME LIFE and the TIME LIFE logo are registered trademarks of Time Warner Inc.
    and affiliated companies. Used under license by Direct Holdings Americas Inc.,
    which is not affiliated with Time Warner Inc. or Time Inc.
     
  20. Gary OS

    Gary OS Producer

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    Ok. But maybe a previous relationship made it easier to get a deal done. Isn't that possible? The fact remains that Warner doesn't license much out, that's for sure.

    Gary "just thinking out loud" O.
     

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