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Question for Dolby Labs

Discussion in 'Archived Threads 2001-2004' started by Gerard Martin, Dec 21, 2001.

  1. Gerard Martin

    Gerard Martin Well-Known Member

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    Roger
    What did you find out regarding
    Dolby Digital audio dropouts on
    Pearl Harbor and Jurassic Park 3.
    I understand this problem effects
    more than one brand audio receiver.
    Has it been corrected, are any other
    titles involved. An early reply
    sincerely appreciated. Best regards.
     
  2. Dalton

    Dalton Well-Known Member

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    I am also interested in any info on this problem as it affects my Onkyo TXDS797. Thanks in advance.
     
  3. Bryan Acevedo

    Bryan Acevedo Well-Known Member

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    What exactly is the problem? I just watched Pearl Harbor on my Denon 3802 and Denon DVM 1800 DVD player. In DD 5.1 I didn't experience any dropouts. Where exactly were they?

    Bryan
     
  4. SamRoza

    SamRoza Well-Known Member

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    No trouble with Pearl Harbor on a Panny RV-26/Pioneer Elite VSX-26TX combination.

    Sam
     
  5. Gerard Martin

    Gerard Martin Well-Known Member

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    This reportly has shown up in Denon's
    1602, 1802, Onkyo's european model as
    well as the 797, 898 and 989.
     
  6. Gerard Martin

    Gerard Martin Well-Known Member

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    Anyone at Dolby Labs familiar with
    this decoding problem effecting the
    above mentioned receivers
    please feel free to reply. Also
    when is it safe to purchase Dolby
    digital again?. Best regards
     
  7. Marty Neudel

    Marty Neudel Well-Known Member

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    Jerry,

    I don't work for Dolby Labs, but would like to offer this view. Since most DD decoders aren't experiencing this problem, it's obvious that the defect is not in the Dolby codec, but rather in the implementation designed by some manufacturers.

    Although Dolby Labs certifies all models using their logo, no licensor is able to check for every possible flaw in every unit submitted for testing. DTS has had similar problems in the past.

    I think you might want to ask Onkyo and Denon what they intend to do about the problem.

    Marty
     
  8. Gerard Martin

    Gerard Martin Well-Known Member

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    Marty
    If this is the case why are the
    above mentioned models able to decode
    every title except Pearl Harbor and
    Jurassic Park 3. It seems if the decoders were flawed they would be
    flawed to all titles not just two.
     
  9. David Head

    David Head Well-Known Member

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    The Onkyo website has this press release regarding the problem. The press release reads:
    "Questions or concerns about new DVDs including Jurassic Park 3 and Pearl Harbor? - 12/21/01
    Valued ONKYO Customers,
    During a recent software testing session in our labs we have encountered a problem with several newly released DVDs that we want to make you aware of. Specifically we have experienced problems with Jurassic Park 3 and Pearl Harbor. The problem in question is related to audio dropouts at various points throughout both movies when playing the Dolby Digital soundtrack. After conducting a thorough investigation into this issue we have identified what we believe to be the cause of the problem and would like to make you aware of our findings and a recommended solution.
    · Our testing shows the audio dropout problem to be isolated to the Dolby Digital 5.1 soundtrack. The DTS 5.1 soundtrack plays back without exhibiting any problems. Therefore we strongly recommend that you switch to the DTS soundtrack when available to realize the full potential of your equipment and the home theater experience. Likewise you can also play back the disc using Dolby ProLogic or ProLogic II without any problems. You can select these alternative audio options from the DVD’s software menu, which frequently load automatically after playback begins. Typically the additional audio tracks can be found in the opening menu under “Audio” or “Languages”, but may vary slightly from disc to disc. If you have questions regarding your specific equipment please contact our Customer Support Department.
    · Although we have only been able to verify the problem with Jurassic Park 3 and Pearl Harbor, we have been informed by Dolby Laboratories that other soon to be released DVDs may exhibit a similar problem. Unfortunately we do not know of any specific titles at this time. However we will update our web site as more information becomes available.
    · We have been able to verify that the problem exists on the majority of our new receiver line. We are currently testing other models and will post the results in the near future. We understand that other equipment manufacturers are experiencing similar problems.
    · Based on our exhaustive testing and after consulting with Dolby Laboratories it is our opinion that the problem is related to the audio encoding software that was used to master the DVDs in question and that the problem is ultimately a software problem. Dolby Laboratories, the movie studios in question, Onkyo, and other manufacturers are working together to prevent a similar problem from recurring.
    Thank you for your understanding and patience regarding this matter. We will keep you updated as we gain further information.
    Regards,
    The Onkyo Product Development Team"
     
  10. Gerard Martin

    Gerard Martin Well-Known Member

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    Thanks David
    That information sincerely
    appreciated.
     
  11. SamRoza

    SamRoza Well-Known Member

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    So it's specific to a certtain make/model, not a problem with Dolby then.

    I'd guess it was a microprocessor issue specific to those makes.

    Sam
     
  12. Seth T

    Seth T Well-Known Member

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    Good information, but still doesn't make me feel good at all.
     
  13. Robert Kersberg

    Robert Kersberg New Member

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    I'm glad Onkyo released the information but they forget that the Dutch version of Pearl Harbour (and perhaps other European releases) do not contain a DTS version, just DD. So then you're stuck with a crippled DVD. I certainly hope they (Onkyo, Dolby, movie studios) can work out a solution. I suppose that until then I will have to go for the DTS versions of discs (which is a Good Thing (tm) anyway).
    It would be nice if it's comfirmed though by people with DVD players or receivers from "other manufacturers" that they have the same problem. It would make me feel a bit better because then the problem is a lot bigger then if it was just with Onkyo stuff. [​IMG]
    I will probably still get the 797 as it's an awesome beast. [​IMG]
     
  14. jacek p

    jacek p Active Member

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    FYI,

    Toshiba SD3750/Kenwood VR509 no problems with DD on PH.
     
  15. Roger Dressler

    Roger Dressler Well-Known Member

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    Dolby has just posted the following statement at its website.

    >>It has come to our attention that a limited number of consumer electronics products equipped with Dolby Digital decoders—primarily A/V receivers—experience audio muting or dropout problems with some new DVD and/or digital television content. Dolby is actively investigating this problem and is working to identify a solution for consumers as quickly as possible.

    Thus far, Dolby, in cooperation with its customers and partners, has traced the issue to consumer equipment that misinterprets information found on some recently produced DVDs and digital broadcasts.

    Dolby and its partners are currently working with the content industry to disable the new features in these movies and broadcasts that trigger these problems. In conjunction with this effort, we are working with the manufacturers of the affected products to identify potential consumer solutions.

    Dolby will update this information as soon as a solution is identified.
     
  16. Troy LaMont

    Troy LaMont Well-Known Member

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    I have the Onkyo 777 and a Toshiba 6200 and I've not had any problems with JP III or Pearl Harbor.

    Troy
     
  17. Ken Seeber

    Ken Seeber Well-Known Member

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    I have the Onkyo TX-DS595 and a Sony DVP-S300 DVD player. I have not tried "Pearl Harbor" or "Jurassic Park III," but I do get the drop-outs on the Dolby Digital track on Anchor Bay's "The Stunt Man."
     
  18. Kelana

    Kelana Member

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    I have Denon AVR1602 and Aiwa XD-DV480, no problem with JP III but only a slightly pause while watching Pearl Harbour movies with DTS.[​IMG]
     
  19. John Morris

    John Morris Guest

    Guys: This is an old problem which has already been solved in two different ways. Here is my understanding of the issue and the solutions.

    First, the problem was due to some special anti-piracy, encoder unit ID number, which the studios placed in the data areas where the unit processors looked to identify the type of encoding used on the movie (such as DD-EX or DTS). This anti-piracy crap was placed there to make it easier to identify real from pirated DVDs. Units which support auto detecting if a movie is DD or DTS must be able to quickly read this data area so that the movie can be played back in the proper playback mode. While a pre/pro's or receiver's processors are trying to read and then "lock-on" to this encoding, they are made so that they self mute. Otherwise, very nasty, screeching and scratching sounds would come from your speakers during this mode identification period. Unfortunately, this anti-piracy crap was extraneous data which the processors were not programmed for and were not expecting to see. It was not apparently part of the Dolby spec, so, the processors continued to mute during this time... sorta like a processor brain freeze. This period of locking on and de-muting can be measured in milliseconds and if the chip programming is not dead on, a unit can miss the first half second of audio on a DVD, and/or the first half second of audio after layer change.

    As a result of the problems, the manufacturers, studios and Dolby all pointed fingers at each other as to whose fault it was. Eventually, the studios agreed to no longer use this anti-piracy ID labeling in future DVDs, and Dolby worked with the processor manufacturer's and programmers to overcome the problems with those DVDs already using this code.

    I don't believe that any of the newer manufactured units from any company still exhibits the problems.

    BTW, if this story is wrong, please someone jump in here with the truth. Roger D?
     
  20. Danie_P

    Danie_P Member

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    Ok...
    But what will happend with us who got the products that has this problem?
    Ive just bought a brand new Onkyo 898 and have this problem and that really feels like shit to buy a new reciver that has this kind problem.
    Ive gone around it by connecting the 5.1 from the DVD and get the signal from the dekoder in the DVD and it works fine but I sure as h-ll dont want to make this to a "must do in case of DD audiotrack thing"!
    What have all of you that has this problem done?
    I guess Im not alone... But has anyone had their reciver replaced or repaired so this problem disapers?
    And who will replace the disks otherwise so we can see the DVD we have bought?
    Daniel
    [​IMG]
     

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