Other Shoe Drops: Will Blu-Ray be HDMI Only Too? (1 Viewer)

[ChristopherDAC]

Erm, it's not clear to me how AACS imposes a component lockout. HDCP does that, and while a device with HDMI inputs is required to be HDCP compliant I don't see where Blu-Ray have yet announced that their HDMI-outputs will be HDCP-encoded, which is what would forbid component HD. AACS and HDCP, while usually mentioned in the same breath, are different things.

 

[Steve Kuester]

Well, we pretty much knew this was coming. It's too bad, but it's looking like HD on disc will stumble severely out of the box. Let's break it down - 2 competing formats, certain resolutions only work with certian connections, and a picture that what, 90 percent? of the population will not see any differently than old fashioned DVD's. Doesn't sound like a winner to me.

I don't think it will be as bad as the DVD-A/SACD disaster though, the powers that be will market the hell out of HD-DVD and and Blu-Ray.

It's a bummer really, six months ago I was really excited for HD on disc. Looks like I'll be saving a good chunk o' change now.

At least DVD's won't be going anywhere for quite a while.

 

[Pete Lee]

Chris,

You're right, I jumped the gun. AACS is different from HDCP and does not mandate down-rezing over component (although I think Blu-Ray's adoption of HDCP is inevitable). I wish I could change the title of the post because I do think AACS is worth discussing in its own right. It will require your Blu-Ray player to be hooked up to a telephone jack or ethernet, just like your satellite boxes or Tivos. The renewability scheme is already used by satellite providers like DirecTV and Echostar to scramble their signals. Check out AACS's own paper discussing its technology:

http://www.aacsla.com/specifications...Video_0.90.pdf

 

[Jeff Ulmer]

"Yes honey, but that's what all the folks who spent $8-10,000 on their component only HD ready television sets thought too, only to find out that they were getting screwed by the industry. If we buy a $20 DVD player now, we can wait until the price drops (like it will) and buy a $20 BlueRay player when we are ready for HD, that is if Blue Ray is even still around then..."

 

[RobertR]

Actually, it would be much better to buy another player ten years from now, because everyone knows they'd be MUCH cheaper then. Let's see...buy a player that shows ZERO difference from DVDs now at $1000 or so, or buy it 10 years from now for 100 bucks.....honey, let's wait.

Multiply that by millions, and these short sighted bastards are going to have a real problem.

 

[Rolando]

I can't believe that people are actually going to accept this...

Worst part is if they do go the phone line or ethernet connection required route people will still take it.

I have to be such a skeptic but we live in a world of sheep where wal mart tells client what they want and blockbuster tells them what content is indecent.

 

[Aaron_Brez]

Let's not fear-monger without reading the specs closely. Maybe there's something in another paper, but according to the one you've provided, AACS does not require a phone jack or ethernet unless the content provider locks "premium" content on the disk and you want to access it. As with satellite dishes, if you never watch pay-per-view, you never have to have the phone line hooked up.

A new revocation list is sent to authorized replicators periodically, who have to include it with every disk they produce thereafter, and licensed players will then store the latest-dated list they have seen (from reading a disk) and keep it in flash memory. I can think of some ways to defeat this, but they involve fairly complex rigamarole which would probably violate the DMCA to merely discuss.

 

[Glenn Overholt]

Aaron, can you see a movie being released in a few years with 2 disks? You'll have to put the first disk in (that will be full of codes) before you can play the actual movie!

My greatest fear is that when HD does come out, every new release will be in HD only. Are we prepared for that?

Glenn

 

[Aaron_Brez]

Nope. AACS provides for separate authentication for each disk, and even optionally for each layer. Funny thought, though.

I don't see HD-only releases for a long time. There's too much of an installed SD-DVD base for that, and I think with the format war and the component-only abandonment adoption will be slower than the manufacturers (and the studios) would like.

I'm a "second wave" adopter-- I bought a Panasonic A110 as my first player-- and I'm staying out until the format war is gone. Even among those who don't mind HDCP and AACS, I'm sure I will not be alone in waiting until the manufacturers stop being morons about competitive formats.

 

[alan halvorson]

I presume that the key revocation scheme will work the same everywhere, but I could be wrong.

 

[TheLongshot]

Personally, I don't really care right now, since I'm not going to buy it anyways. While I have a HD Display, I'm happy enough with DVDs that I'm not in a big hurry to upgrade my collection.

Not to mention that it is going to take a long time to sort out this mess.

Jason

 

[Aaron_Brez]

They don't. HDCP keys aren't given out without the licensing agreement, and all signatories to the licensing agreement are disallowed from putting out high-def analog signals. They may indeed be pulling one over on the licensing body and violating their contract, but if that's the case their keys won't last long, as you pointed out, above.

 

[PeterTHX]

Excuse me:

But the word "HDMI", nor the prospect of downrez or ANYTHING wasn't mentioned in that article.

Sheesh. Some people are eager to boycott anything.

 

[Jerome Grate]

My guess, it's going to follow the same suit HD-DVD is going which is to downrez via component. This is disturbing (too me) because those people that have very expensive sets that only does HD via component are screwed in the worst way. I'm pretty sure Blu-Ray's intention is to downrez via component because Blu-Ray's answer to HD-DVD could have been to allow HD resolutions via component and we could have seen the end to this format war. Unfortunately we can only assume that Blu-Ray is going in the same direction. It's the studios that want to protect the product.

 

[Scott Merryfield]

While that article mentions nothing about HDCP, it's only a matter of time before the real announcement does come. There is no way the studios will support Blu-Ray with the so-called "analog hole".

That will just give me another reason to ignore this format war. I plan on keeping my component input only HD display for another 3-4 years until the newer digital display technologies become more mature, so there is no reason for me to get into these new formats.


Considering that the vast majority of household currently have DVD players, and just a small fraction of those households will have a HD-DVD or Blu-Ray player and HDMI/HDCP compliant display, I seriously doubt that the studios will stop releasing their content on the DVD format for many years. They are making too much money on the format, and the newer formats will not have the installed base for many years to replace the revenue.

 

[alan halvorson]

There are ways and then there are ways. HDCP de-encrypting chips are available to non-contract-signing manufacturers (I don't know how) and it's unknown exactly how these manufacturers obtain their keys, although some have suspicions; certainly, it's not from the licensing body. Anyway, the devices do work on HDCP encrypted sources. Now, it is a big concern that the keys have been discovered and might be revoked; perhaps they already have been. No one knows and no one will know until HD players and discs are availble, so investment in one of these devices may be money thrown away. You have been warned!

 

[RobertR]

Warning taken. I'll do a lot of investigating, seeing what happens to others if they take the risk, and wait for the dust to settle on ALL fronts before moving.

 

[Jon Martin]

I don't think many kids who are going to be able to afford a PS3 won't already have a major TV to go with it.

They are saying at the very least $500 a system? Probably more? Not going to be a lot of kids getting it right away.

 

[Aaron_Brez]

Yes, but licensees who resell are liable, per their own license agreement. It's all in the license agreements, and if you think those chips aren't traceable via internal serial numbers, you know little about modern IC manufacturing. Someone's gonna lose their keys over this, unless Hollywood is feeling exceptionally generous. Which I suppose is possible, but I wouldn't hold my breath.

 

[Glenn Overholt]

Ok, then releases scheduled for next year will either be

A - hybrids (HD on one side, SD on the other)
B - released in both HD and SD

A will force us to buy into the HD format anyway. This could force us into a double-dip if the HD format should lose the war later.

B would make it necessary for store shelves to expand on a level that makes my brain crash. Considering the multiple releases now, it would be a nightmare.

The stores don't want to carry multiple editions of one movie. Can managers of chain stores refuse to put any HD disks on their shelves? Without any repercussions from the main office, of course.

I think a good way to boycott HD (and BR later on) would be to get the support from the stores. What if your local Best Buy just sent all of the HD disks back, with a copy of a boycott notice?

Better still would be to get the entire chain to toss the boycott notice back to the studios. The stores won't stock them if nobody is going to buy.

Glenn