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How much negotiating room?

Discussion in 'Beginners, General Questions' started by Sdurrett, Jul 1, 2013.

  1. Sdurrett

    Sdurrett New Member

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    I have a proposal from my local HT store and from checking around, they are quoting me MSRP on all components, even though cheaper deals are out there. Installation is extra, I know they need to make money to stay in business but I don't want to pay more than I should. How negotiable should they be?
     
  2. schan1269

    schan1269 HTF Expert
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    It would help to know the brands.

    Integra? Zero wiggle.
    Marantz? Some wiggle.
    Yamaha? Zero wiggle.
    Onkyo? Tons of wiggle.

    Speakers...
    Paradigm? Zero wiggle.
    Polk? Tons of wiggle.
     
  3. schan1269

    schan1269 HTF Expert
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    And what do you mean "cheaper deals" are out there?

    Elite, Yamaha and Integra are B&M sales only.

    Paradigm is B&M only as well.

    So "cheaper deal" means "what product, where"?
     
  4. schan1269

    schan1269 HTF Expert
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    Give you an example of..."good deal, but good luck"...

    http://www.amazon.com/Pioneer-SC-65-Channel-Select-Receiver/dp/B00852X534/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1372688835&sr=1-1&keywords=elite+sc65

    Elite is B&M only. In case you have no idea what B&M means, it means Brick and Mortar. IE, the store/installation people you are talking to.
    Sure, you can save money by buying that Elite from Amazon as long as...

    1. You realize it has zero warranty.
    2. It has zero support from Elite(Elite can, at their discretion, deny you future firmware updates. You can get firmware 3rd party...or pay to send the SC65 to a service center and pay to send it back...while paying a service center to do your firmware updates...if Elite so chose to deny your gray market AVR)
    3. Will not be counted for a "credit card warranty doubling" cause there is nothing to double(see point 1)
    4. You can't even buy a Square Trade. Well you can, but it won't be valid, cause the manufacturer's warranty has to be valid(see point 1)
     
  5. Sdurrett

    Sdurrett New Member

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    Epson 6020 projectorB&W speakersNAD amp100" black diamond screenBy better deals I mean online quotes
     
  6. schan1269

    schan1269 HTF Expert
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    The Epson(as far as the receipts I've seen) sells for the same price everywhere. If you want to pay less, buy the 5020*. Same projector. The 6020 is the B&M version of the "who cares where you got it" 5020.

    B&W, which series? If the same as BB(which I doubt), sure there is wiggle room. If BB does not carry the same ones...no wiggle.

    NAD, nope.

    Black Diamond has none either.

    Outside Epson, those three companies like to keep their value up. Look at used values(when, if, you see any for sale) and you'll see people will pay a premium for that NAD in 2-3 years. The B&W(which ones?) should still sell for 60% of what you paid from them 10 years from now.

    The screen is a crap shoot(which one?). If a really good one, I've seen 7 year old BD go for 75% of their original NIB.

    *and yeah I know. The 6020 has a better warranty, comes with "stuff" the 5020 does not. But as far as the projector itself, they are the same. Pay less and get emails back and forth with Epson should you have a problem and ship it somewhere...or buy the 6020 and you have a store that will come to your house to solve the problem.

    Edit:
    I see there is a 3rd party selling the Epson 6020 on Amazon. I am pretty sure(and it would be your call to do so to check) Epson will deny warranty on internet purchased 6020. As that projector is not to be sold online.
     
  7. Type A

    Type A HW Reviewer
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    Youre on a roll today Sam, outstanding info :)
     
  8. Sdurrett

    Sdurrett New Member

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    Thanks, all. Great information. I like these guys and I want to give them my business, but I also don't want to be the guy who pays sticker price at the car dealer.
     
  9. schan1269

    schan1269 HTF Expert
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    Screen Innovations is not a cheap screen. I have a Screen Research. If you are complaining over the cost they are quoting you for the BD(whichever version you are getting)...ask for a price quote on a Screen Research...and be sitting down.

    NAD is great stuff...30% overpriced. But...if you want NAD...pony it up.

    I have a JVC projector. I will never buy a LCD projector. Every home theatre I design comes with a DLP or D-ILA/LCos.

    Speakers...B&W are great. I'd fill a room with the seven 800 Diamonds...if I wouldn't go broke.
     
  10. Al.Anderson

    Al.Anderson Well-Known Member

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    Sam, at least for Yamaha you can get them from a number of authorized internet locations. including Amazon.
     
  11. schan1269

    schan1269 HTF Expert
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    I don't know why I included Yamaha...brain fart. The Aventage line, originally, was supposed to be B&M only. But Yamaha about-faced on that decision.

    I'm curious as to which NAD this guy is buying. If the 777, hope he doesn't have any non-HDMI sources. Well, none of the NAD scale 480i anyway...

    When it comes to theatre AVR in the class...the Denon 4520 and Integra DTR "out wow" NAD in features. But...if you don't need video processing...NAD wins.
     
  12. Sdurrett

    Sdurrett New Member

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    Thanks again for all the good information.

    OK, I pulled the trigger. Here's the complete setup:

    Epson 6020 Projector
    Black Diamond 100" Screen
    NAD T757 120W x 7, w/ built in 4k upscalling
    B&W 8" 2-way in-ceiling speakers
    B&W 10" 200W sub

    The salesman is telling me I don't really need 7.2 sound since my room is only 15' deep and seating is all the way back. I am inclined to believe him but I'd welcome other opinions. The amp is obviously 7.2 capable, so the only issue is the cost of the 2 extra speakers and the extra installation.
     
  13. schan1269

    schan1269 HTF Expert
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    If your seating is really "all the way back"...no, you don't have room for 7.

    In typical purpose built rooms, the "sweet seat"(I prefer to say sweet seat instead of sweet spot) is equal distance from all 5 or 7 speakers. Does that work in all rooms? No. But if you are going to be 13' from the front and 2' from the rear. Do not do 7 speakers.
     
  14. schan1269

    schan1269 HTF Expert
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    By the way, my main theater is 9.1(7.1 + height).

    The sweet seat is @9 feet(8-10 feet) from every speaker. What helps pull that off though is I have an Acoustically Transparent screen.
     

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