1st speaker project - was: New Idea For a Small Business, at age 15! (Moved) (1 Viewer)

[Keith Mickunas]

Bobby, you're in the after hours forum, you're not in the DIY forum. Even so, people aren't going to just tell you everything you need to do if you haven't done any research yourself.

I'm feeling like a broken record. We've given you plenty of advice and places to look. Not everyone on this forum reads the after hours posts. So by continually posting in the wrong place you're not likely to get much help. And when you don't do much research yourself and then insist people tell you how to build your speakers, you're not likely to get any help.

 

[bobbyg2]

Thanks. I did A little bit of homework, I think. Do I really need to do this much cross bracing?

That's a lot of cross bracing. Is that just for the woofer or do I do that for the Mid-Range as well?

Wood. My uncle said to use HDF, but a website says to use MDF. Could I use HDF? Or will that not be as good as MDF?

Drivers. I still havn't had an answer on if those above drivers are compatible. I don't want to get it home and have the tweeter be 10x as loud as the woofer.

I found this cool help site: http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/speaker.htm
It mentions "passive" speakers. Should I make one speaker passive, the other powered? Maybe I should have two powered and 1 passive?

Thanks guys for helping me out. You guys are the best!

*EDIT*
Keith-
So, your saying make a thread in the DIY forum?

 

[Alon Goldberg]

Best of luck with your new speakers, you may want to try the DIY section of this forum.

I'm unsubscribing from this thread, this is going in circles..

 

[Garrett Lundy]

Build one pair of loudspeakers. Then take them to a dealer and compare them to Paradigm Studio 100s.

If you still think you have a shot, consider everything you just worked at and figure how much you'll need to charge to make a profit.

 

[Holadem]

I will amend my post with the following... Step 0: Learn to listen.

--
H

 

[bobbyg2]

I think I'll just lay this thread to rest until I learn a bit more and get the money to make the speakers.

 

[Robert_J]

I know you said you would let this thread rest until you started building but I just read it and thought I'd reply. I've been building speakers since I was your age so I'm pretty handy at it.

That's where a custom cross-over comes into play. You attenuate the level of the tweeter to match the mid-bass. You choose cross-over points based on the measured frequency response of each driver while mounted in the box.

It was only mentioned briefly, but you need to start reading. Here's a good selection of book from PE - link.

In a couple of postings, linked to pre-made cross-overs. Those are not adequate if you want to reproduce quality sound. This explains why - link. Browse around that site and read a few of Wayne's articles.

If you want to do this correctly, you will also need the proper testing tools like L.E.A.P. and LMS. The software and hardware will cost about $500 and there's a pretty steep learning curve. It may be best to start out just building subs. There are free tools available for design and you don't have to worry about a passive crossover.

How are you going to finish your speakers? If you build them from MDF, you can paint them, cover them in a vinyl covering that simulates wood (available from PE) or cover them in real wood veneer.

You might want to talk to guys that have done this successfully:
Jim at Salk Sound
Danny at GR Research
Mark at Seaton Sound

-Robert

 

[PhillJones]

He could learn to make speakers the way my mate did. Build one out of spare parts and then try and work out why it sounds so bloody awful. He's really into the hobbyist speaker building game and his speakers sound pretty good for the amount he pays to build them. He doesn't sell them though. It's a complex business, he has a PhD in physics which may account for him being successful at the build it and see approach to DIY audio.

I suppose, on the face of it, it might seem quite simple. All you've got to do is match drivers and tweeters so that they're the same loudness and tune the cross-over so that when one rolls off the other picks up. Combine that with minimum vibration and you've got a perfect speaker. Sounds easy right? I bet it's not.

 

[bobbyg2]

I'm sure it aint too easy as well.

Thanks guys for your help. You guys are actually trying to give me some advice on web site to look, how to start out, etc. Instead of saying "You need to go to college and master in science. You're never going to get any good speakers done without a PhD!"
I'm sure with enough hard work, determination, and help I can build speakers better than some people with PhD's can imagine. College isn't the answer to everything.

 

[Patrick Sun]

You really should go over to the DIY area and read through different project threads on speaker building. Set the display options for "last year" or "from beginning" and peruse the different threads. Until you grasp the vocabulary/concepts for speaking design and cabinet making, you'll be guessing and tweaking for a very long time. Also, if this thread continues on speaker building, it's going to be either moved to the DIY area (the proper area for it to be posted) or closed.

 

[MarkHastings]

Bobby, I know when I was a teen, I hated hearing the phrase "You're too young to understand", but as I got older, I understood what they were talking about.

Again, no offense, but no one is really trying to crush your dream, but a lot of your posts sound very naive toward speaker technology. On a forum filled with enthusiasts (who have spent DECADES learning about the technology), it's almost insulting to make it sound like anyone can build an expensive speaker out of their garage with some wood and pre-purchased cones. And by the comments on how simplistic you thought speakers were, are only going to bring out more harsh criticism.

But again, don't take it as trying to crush your dream. Part of being young is learning how to take constructive criticism. You have answered a lot of constructive criticism with childish responses. The "Nah nah nah nah!" Kind of response is not helping your case, which is going to bring out the "Ah, to be young and naive" comments even more so.

Keep up with your dream, but also don't ignore the great advice given out here. I (along with others) know what it's like to think you know what you're doing when you're a teen, but you do have a lot to learn. Don't take the discouragement negatively, take it as a challenge.

Imagine if Bill Gates quit because people gave him crap about starting up his on OS? But on the other hand, imagine if Bill Gates took a more lackadaisical approach about it and didn't think he needed to learn any more than he thought he already knew. Don't think that the most successful business men took the easy road. Most successful people had a LONG road ahead of them, filled with TONS of learning. Don't think that you know enough or can learn it all on the internet. How is one expected to compete with name brand when they have a team of audio engineers that have decades of experience and learning? That's not something you're going to get by reading web sites.

Part of being young is realizing that there's a LOT to learn out there.


OK, sorry for the life lesson...

 

[Robert_J]

It was either college or drive a tractor. I worked on a farm during summers driving tractors, back hoes, etc from age 14 to 22. As soon as I got my first job out of college, I made as much as the entire crew of guys I worked with. That made it worth it.

-Robert

 

[Scott Simonian]

Bobby....I had the same dream when I was your age...took me many, many years to learn about speakers, what makes them work, what to look for in terms of "performance" and sound characteristics....

Anywho....Im not gonna lecture about how you cant just pick random drivers and x-over and slap it together and say you have a working loudspeaker. Yes, it will produce sound....erm, noise.

Blah....anyway....

Go to HTGuide.com/forum. The DIY section has much more traffic than the DIY section here (eh, nowadays) and they have a dedicated "finished projects" sub-forum. Every kit could best a multi-thousand dollar boutique loudspeaker and the individual parts are less than the ones you've posted. And much, much lower distortion.

 

[bobbyg2]

Alright, I'll give it a look over a little later. My brothers are trying to get me off of the computer.

Thanks guys for your replies. I'm learning something new every day.

 

[Robert_J]

Build the Dayton 8 exactly like the plans as shown. You will have more than enough "thump". You will also learn that bass reflex enclosures (ported boxes) are more efficient down low.

-Robert

 

[Greg_R]

You can make a 2-way floorstander. Read up on infinite baffle or large sealed enclosure designs.

Your best bet is to start with a kit where the drivers and crossover are already picked out. You'll learn how to build a good cabinet, how to solder the crossover together, and how to wire everything up. Once you have these construction skills down, you can start working on _design_. Get some simulation software and determine what makes your kit speaker good or bad (why is the bass not very loud, why are the voices so "clear", etc.). How does everything interact? Once you've figured this out you will be ready to start playing around with your own designs. Vance Dickason's Loudspeaker Cookbook is a good primer and will touch on many of the issues you'll encounter. The DIY forum is a good area to ask questions as you go along...

 

[bobbyg2]

Alright. Now what measurements should I use for the Dayton 8's? It doesn't show and construction plans or anything (it says the internal dimensions and the cross bracing, but no specific dimensions for spacing). Where can I find a good solder, Parts Express? Now, I have finally found my first project! I'm soo excited to get started! Now, to get the wood... Would the wood be available at my local Home Depot? Or is MDF only available online?

*EDIT*
I found a problem though, my receiver is gona be 100-watts x 7 channels. That woofer is rated for 60 watts RMS/85 watts max and the tweeter is rated for 50 watts RMS/75 watts max. Wouldn't that blow my speakers?

 

[Robert_J]

Based on the internal dimensions and using 3/4" thick MDF, you can easily determine the panel sizes and come up with construction plans. It takes a little time with a pencil and paper. If you don't want to do that, follow the first link on the D8 page to Ted Robinson's page. There's construction photos and a very detailed diagram with measurements.

Solder is available at PE, Radio Shack and the electrical department of Home Depot and Lowes.

3/4" MDF is available at 90% of Home Depots and costs about $24/sheet. Don't make a mistake and get particle board.

-Robert

 

[bobbyg2]

Alright thanks!

Now, the only problem is the wattage of the receiver vs the wattage of the drivers. Would there be problems putting 100 watts through this? Or are the drivers strong enough to handle it?

 

[Jimi C]

Your receiver is not going to blow those speakers.