Yamaha going very low end?

Discussion in 'AV Receivers' started by Mike Up, Mar 16, 2003.

  1. Mike Up

    Mike Up Second Unit

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    Matthew D,

     
  2. Mike Up

    Mike Up Second Unit

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    Matthew D,

     
  3. StephenL

    StephenL Second Unit

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    Mike Up said:
     
  4. Phil*K

    Phil*K Stunt Coordinator

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    Steve,

    No offense, but I doubt that the THX logo had anything to do with it, considering the receivers and other equipment that have that logo. More likely is the cost of your Onkyo, for which you could have bought three 5250s. Just food for thought.

    Phil
     
  5. StephenL

    StephenL Second Unit

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    THX has a lot to do with it. THX has strict standards for bass management and other performance. It is certainly possible to find receivers (even low priced receivers) without THX certification that have proper bass management, but I think that independent testing is worthwhile. The bass management problems of the RX-V596/HTR-5250 would have been found and corrected if Yamaha had sought THX certification.

    Sound & Vision magazine: THX Certified
    http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/art...&page_number=1

    Sound & Vision magazine: Behind The Numbers: Digital Sound Receivers
    (see "Bass Management" beginning on page 3)
    http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/art...&page_number=1

    AVS Forum thread: Manufactures,Tell us about your THX Certification process
    http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...hreadid=122172
     
  6. Phil*K

    Phil*K Stunt Coordinator

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    Other than start a THX war that has been discussed on many occations. I suggest that you go over to the speaker forum and read the thread "the value of the THX rating". You should be able to find it over the last couple of days. I would also ingnor any magazine's opinion concidering the amount of money THX has poored into advertising.

    Phil
     
  7. Mike Up

    Mike Up Second Unit

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  8. StephenL

    StephenL Second Unit

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    Mike, thanks for the information on the Yamaha RX-V596. Unfortunately I discovered the problem after it was too late to return the receiver. I'd like to know how to repair it.

    When I said that THX certified receivers are more likely to have bass management that works properly I wasn't talking about adjustable crossovers, but your point is important and it's addressed in the Sound & Vision article and several of my posts:
    http://www.hometheaterforum.com/htfo...81#post1169381

    Regardless of the crossover frequency, bass management should work consistently with all sources including Dolby Digital, DTS, PCM and analog. Some receivers have problems with this. "If a bass-management system has to be used at all — and it must be with most subwoofer/satellite setups — then it should operate the same way with all inputs, analog or digital, stereo or multichannel, in order to avoid changes in bass balance when you change the program source."
    http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/art...&page_number=1

    Also note the potential problems of a crossover that's too low, even if the speakers have adequate low frequency response:
    http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volum...rs-9-2002.html
     
  9. Mike Up

    Mike Up Second Unit

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    StephenL,

     
  10. Robert McClanahan

    Robert McClanahan Stunt Coordinator

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    FYI, Yamaha is dumping receivers on the market.They just want their name in your living room.Costs are coming down but so is quality.Even Sony ES is getting cheap.I love Yamaha gear,its just that I wonder who is making these stupid decisions at Yamaha.[​IMG]
     
  11. Mark All

    Mark All Second Unit

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  12. MatthewJ S

    MatthewJ S Supporting Actor

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    FYI, Yamaha is dumping receivers on the market.They just want their name in your living room.Costs are coming down but so is quality.Even Sony ES is getting cheap.I love Yamaha gear,its just that I wonder who is making these stupid decisions at Yamaha.
    ////////////////////////////end quote////////////
    WOW!...that is what I've been saying abiut DENON for the last couple of model years!...everyone is entitled to their own opinion...
    I sell Yamahas and use them on MANY of my custom install jobs because I ALMOST NEVER have any kind of problems with them...keep in mind that these are all RXV ,not HTR SERIES(which get much less QC), AND most are 1300 and aboves (a few 630/730's)....
     
  13. JeremyFr

    JeremyFr Supporting Actor

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    Ok I've got the 730 and am very happy with it and can guarantee it will pass by most recievers in its price range. I really have no respect for S&V testing especially since they dont publish what methods they use or anything on the testing circumstances. Also the 730 is no where listed on that site published. I've been to that page before and if you'll notice almost everything on it is quite old in review dates. 5 years in some cases. At anyrate like I said I'm very happy with my 730 and would put it up against just about nething in the same price range.
     
  14. StephenL

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    Mike, the Yamaha HTR-5250 is the only receiver with bass management problems that I've had personal experience with. Here are a few from Sound & Vision magazine test reports:

    July/August 2002. Panasonic SA-HE100: Crossover inoperative in stereo; bass level reduction in DPL II and Neo:6.

    May 2002. Sherwood Newcastle R-963: Manufacturer claims bass management for multichannel analog input, but Sound & Vision found that bass below 80 Hz is not redirected to subwoofer.

    November 2000. Philips FR975: Loss of bass management with stereo analog input. JVC RX-8000V: Loss of bass management with stereo digital and analog input. Of the three receivers tested in this issue, only the Onkyo TX-DS575X had correct bass management.

    October 2000. Outlaw Audio Model 1050. No bass management on back surround channel. As a result of the review Outlaw corrected the problem on later units.

    MatthewJ S said:

    Sound & Vision does publish their testing methods:
    http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/art...&page_number=1
     
  15. MatthewJ S

    MatthewJ S Supporting Actor

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    Yamaha pulls three times the # of rxv units off the line for full QC check than it does on the "concert" series...other than that ,this year, they are identical...
     
  16. Robert McClanahan

    Robert McClanahan Stunt Coordinator

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    Matt,I too do custom installations and my company sells Yamaha gear.Customers like Yamaha because they are very user friendly.They like the sound but the customers really seem more concerned about ease of use.I am concerned about the current trend by manufacturers to put out these hometheater in a box systems.I have seen alot of these come through our repair shop.
     

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