Underworld (1 Viewer)

[Lou Sytsma]

Count me as interested as well. This looks like it is shaping up to be a lot of fun.

 

[Rex Bachmann]

Michael Martin wrote (post #50):

Well, you may get that, and, for me, if that's all you get, that's a problem. Your desciption sounds exactly like what the cynical, "no-risk" studio execs and their lazy marketeers are expecting in mass audiences: low expectations and a tireless demand for more of the "same old 'same-old'", which is, consequently, in my estimation, why almost no "serious" supernatural movies are being made there anymore. (And we could expand that well beyond "supernatural movies".)

I know I'm sounding like the sour grump, but does none of you want to see anything other than loud, flashy "kick-ass" movies (and television programs) all the time? (Of course, I may go to see this "loud 'kick-ass' movie" myself, if it gets good ratings.)

 

[Jason Seaver]

Sure, I/we want to see other stuff. And I do - in the last couple weeks I've been to Alan Rudolph's latest, some standard summer fare, classics at The Brattle, a Bollywood sci-fi musical romantic comedy (yeah, they actually made one)...

But, hey, Kate Beckinsale in something skintight gets my attention. And holds it, even if it is in the middle of freakin' vampires and werewolves in yet another tech-noir styled action movie. I'm sure, given enough Kate B in something skintight, I'd grow bored (that would be a lot), but, for now, this looks exciting.

 

[Ken Chan]

does none of you want to see anything other than loud, flashy "kick-ass" movies (and television programs) all the time?

There's also a difference between a movie/show that "blows things up" and one that "blow things up good". Some people (and reviewers) can't appreciate the difference -- "It's all just gunplay and explosions and violence" -- but I do. And you're right in that there's way too much by-the-numbers crap made by hacks. But since Kate is in it and the trailer has a few good bits like that landing, I'm going to see it and hope for the best.

//Ken

 

[Mikel_Cooperman]

I saw a great preview on TV last night. I just hope its not another Matrix Reloaded in terms of a Big letdown.

The marketing is awful. I never realized it was a vampire/werewolf flick until reading this thread. I thought it was about a goth gang war or something.

A gang war?
Huh?

 

[Chuck Mayer]

Every film doesn't have to be pushing for an Oscar.

Your desciption sounds exactly like what the cynical, "no-risk" studio execs and their lazy marketeers are expecting in mass audiences: low expectations and a tireless demand for more of the "same old 'same-old'", which is, consequently, in my estimation, why almost no "serious" supernatural movies are being made there anymore. (And we could expand that well beyond "supernatural movies".)

Did you not see The Others?

This isn't a supernatural move. Neither was Blade. They are action movies in a supernatural world.

And a good kick-ass movie is very hard for Hollywood to do these days. Now they have to kowtow to focus groups, and most films lose their edge or brains. If Underworld can entertain me, that's enough. I'll leave the heavy lifting for heavy films...which I enjoy just as much.

I just expect films to deliver what they promise.

Take care,
Chuck

 

[Ryan_C]

And a good kick-ass movie is very hard for Hollywood to do these days. Now they have to kowtow to focus groups, and most films lose their edge or brains. If Underworld can entertain me, that's enough. I'll leave the heavy lifting for heavy films...which I enjoy just as much.

Well said Chuck, and I wholeheartedly agree.

 

[Dome Vongvises]

I know I'm sounding like the sour grump, but does none of you want to see anything other than loud, flashy "kick-ass" movies (and television programs) all the time? (Of course, I may go to see this "loud 'kick-ass' movie" myself, if it gets good ratings.)

Rex, you wouldn't be so grumpy if you stuck with what you liked. The arthouse still exists, you know?

 

[Rex Bachmann]

Chuck Mayer wrote (post #66):

Not for "supernatural horror" it doesn't, and that's what I like (along with science fiction). They're too busy making genre mishmashes and formulaic tripe ("Scream if you know what these teens/young adults did last summer but you'd rather not see them being chased around endlessly by one silly bad guy or another.") these days to give me "what I like". Those kinds of films---well, actually they're the same film with different window-dressing---have coöpted the money and energy Hollywood might put into what I call "serious" (or dare I say "intelligent"?) "supernatural horror" films. There are plenty of good stories out there that could be adapted for large or small screen and have all (or most of) the "boo!"-elements the crowds love (e.g., "Idol of the Flies", "Second Night Out", some quality Lovecraft adaptations, and the like).

Make no mistake about it: I enjoy my share of "flash-and-boom", but even then I want it to have a brain behind it. I want it serve a purpose higher than just eliciting a momentary sensory spike. The latter is easy, in my opinion: turn up the volume and brighten the lights. Putting some "meat" into a story so that what you end up with is more than just a bunch of sensorially pleasing set pieces---that's the hard part.

Maybe Underworld will tell us:

---Why are the vampires

("Capulets") fighting the werewolves ("Montagues")? Surely, with 7 billion humans on the face of the Earth, there's prey enough for everyone.

---What started this "feud" and why does it continue? "Turf war"? Family "insult"? ("Your mother has bat wings!" "Your sister's got whiskers!") Dyspepsia? What?

---If this is such a "big deal", how could they have hidden it from mankind until now?

---And, lastly, I'll be interested to find out what part of this movie makes it necessary (rather than merely sufficient or---more likely---merely convenient) to involve "vampires" and "werewolves" in a basic "action plot", 'cause right now I don't see it.

 

[Ryan Wishton]

They're too busy making genre mishmashes and formulaic tripe ("Scream if you know what these teens/young adults did last summer but you'd rather not see them being chased around endlessly by one silly bad guy or another.") these days to give me "what I like". Those kinds of films---well, actually they're the same film with different window-dressing---have coöpted the money and energy Hollywood might put into what I call "serious" (or dare I say "intelligent"?) "supernatural horror" films.

Your blaming Hollywoods lack of good movies in general on the slasher genre??? Thats pretty far fetched... Your saying that if the slasher genre didnt exist that Hollywood would devote time to better films??? Come on!!! This is Hollywood... You would just have a bunch of crappy movies in a different sub-genre...

Hollywood is concerned about money... They dont care if you want a good movie... They will make whatever is selling... They dont care about making good movies... They care about budgets, and getting in and out of a project as fast as possible... Thats not going to change... It's like going to the race track... They say too bad, so sad... You want a good movie... Go fund it and make it yourself...

Explain the downfall of every other genre then as well??? Comedy, Action, etc... Every genre has basically tanked in past years with a few exceptions... The comedy genre especially just flat out sucks now... One dumb fart joke after the other...

Sure, multiple horror movies are the same... They use the same formula... But, action movies also use the same formula much of the time...

The James Bond series is a great example... It's the same movie every time with different window dressing, a bigger weapon, and a different chick to get in Mr. Bonds pants for that outing... But, not many people complain about the lack of original Action movies, etc...

You want Supernatural Horror that will truly put the scares in you... You should really meet my Grandmother... You want ghosts... It's as close as you will get without actually seeing the real thing...

Well, at the rate things are going, you always have the following movie to look forward to... It's supernatural...

 

[Chuck Mayer]

Uhh, I would say you're W-R-O-N-G. Your distinction is unclear and, as far as I'm concerned, meaningless. Care to elaborate?

Sure, I'll elaborate. I'll even skip the mocking tone you used. How about that?

The films I mentioned are action films. The supernatural element plays little part in how the film is structured or laid out. It merely exists to set up the action scenes, and further the basic plot. There is no distinct analysis or exploration of supernatural themes. They are window dressing to the action at hand.

For science fiction, do you consider Independence Day scifi? I certainly do not. There is no attempt to use science. It is merely a disaster/action film that using the alien hook to set up the bad guys.

Another big film...Ghostbusters. Is that a supernatural film? Not really. It's a comedy, that uses it's supernatural surroundings to further the jokes.

Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon had flying people. It was not a supernatural film at all, in the conventional sense.

And saying that you didn't see The Others while lamenting "simple" supernatural films? That gets the One of the best, and creepiest, films in recent years you just skip, but you are taking Underworld to task?

In looking at the genre, horror has done surprisingly well this year. Take May or Cabin Fever...both got raves from fans of the spectrum.

Hey, if Underworld wants to surprise me by actually being a great film, then that's wonderful. But I don't expect it to. I expect it'll be fairly straightforward with the supernatural element set up to push the action.

Just skip it, Rex. But please don't blame the sad state of Hollywood on a non-summer action film.

Take care,
Chuck

 

[Scott Weinberg]

Love this debate. Honest.

But I think there's plenty of room in any genre for the 'flash & boom' and the 'smarter stuff'. If you don't like Freddy vs. Jason, give Session 9 a shot.

I think Rex has high hopes for the backstory and/or subext to Underworld, and I'm right there with him. A movie that works within the horror realm with some tact and accuracy would surely be more welcome than 'an action movie with Halloween costumes'.

Conversely, it could turn out to be not much more than a gothic action flick - but still a damn good one.

Guess we'll know on the 19th.

 

[Craig Carrigan]

As far as the trailers go, this is what I get so far:

Something blows up
Big drop off large building, lands on feet
Hairy monsters that change to human
Walking on walls
Shooting
Lots of guns
Girl in tight pants
Fighting in sewers
Shooting again
Hot chick in tight clothes
And again, MORE ACTION

Plot? That's the plot. Am I missing something? Count me in!

 

[Steve_Tk]

Check on quicktime for the real trailer. It goes into the plot. The one you mentioned is just the teaser which isn't more than just eye candy.

 

[Rex Bachmann]

Ryan Wishton wrote (post #70):

Actually, ghosts and ghost movies (with the exception of The Haunting (1963)) have never done much for me.

See below.

 

[Rex Bachmann]

Chuck Mayer wrote (post #71):

????? Where is it that you think I do this? The very worst criticism of Underworld I would have, if it were a totally worthless film, would be that it is a totally worthless film. As stated in the previous reply to the other poster, some of the things I have been deploring are symptoms or associations, not causes.

Do you understand the difference? I do not "blame" the state of present-day movie production on a film or a genre of films, I merely state that the sometimes woeful and extremely exasperating state of mainstream commercial filmmaking in Hollywood is the result of laziness, cowardice, and greed in Hollywood---eh, so what else is new in corporate America?---AND, to put it as delicately as possible and still get the message across, the low standards and inexplicably low expectations of the mass moviegoing audiences. If you say that you never expect anything more than a fast and forgetable "good time" for 120 minutes or so (40 mins. for television) per session, and so vote with your consumer dollars over and over and over (and over) again, that is all you will ever get.

I was merely querying as to why some people commenting here were (seemingly) perpetually satisfied with that.

 

[TheLongshot]

(2) Will the story of the film actually plumb beneath the surface for any of the implications of the story's fantastic premise? That is, beyond the spectacle of the characters' strange appearance or overt action-oriented feats? (For example, if this does go the Romeo-&-Juliet route, what are the consequences of cross-mating? "But, what about the children?")

Sounds beyond the scope of this film, which is about the war between two peoples.

Jason

 

[Rex Bachmann]

Jason Birzer wrote (post #77):

Dealing realistically with the implications of the fantastic premise seems always to be beyond such films these days. Yes, the producers have better things to do with their time (and money). [Sigh]

You do understand that, although the point I'm making there is serious, the example is meant as a joke? ([Ha-ha!]: "But, what about the children?")

 

[Vlad D]

Why would superhuman (subhuman?) "monsters" need guns and kung fu?

While I understand where you are coming from, and I agree that supernatural beings such as Vampires and Werewolves wouldn't need guns and kung fu against weaker humans. But, when fighting each other its a different story. Both groups have superhuman strength, speed, and agility. I think its only natural that they would use weapons and martial arts to give them an advantage.

Anyone familiar with the Vampire: The Masquerade role playing game and novels by White Wolf?

They also involves vampires using weapons and martial arts in turf wars. To me, it makes perfect sense that a vampire, living in 2003, may very well use an automatic weapon (maybe with silver bullets) to kill a werewolf, or martial arts to fight another vampire. Just because they are supernatural, I don't see why they wouldn't use something that would give them more of an advantage.

 

[Dalton]

Straying from the path of this thread for a moment, I was wondering if anyone knows the song that plays at the end of the trailer and who sings it?

Thanks,
Dalton