The King and I (Blu-ray) Single Available for Preorder (1 Viewer)

[OliverK]

But it is very clear that you think previous transfers were right - and they weren't.

Indeed what has formerly been out on DVD and aired in HD stations was too red but that does not automatically mean that what we now have is correct. Apparently Fox has released a 4k DCP to theaters that is somewhere in between and if that is true it would be nice if it could find its way to Blu-ray or possibly even UHD Blu-ray.

 

[FoxyMulder]

It’s frustrating that we have not had any classic musicals released on UHD disc yet, it’s even more frustrating that they always wait for an anniversary year, if I look on iTunes they probably have some and that’s even more annoying that disc gets passed up first.

 

[Brent Reid]

The Blu-ray is sincerely flawed, with muddy colors and a blue caste. Even if we disagree on the intensity of the blue lean, The King and I on disc looks absolutely nothing like it did when projected in theaters in the mid-50's in actual Cinemascope. It also, in no way attests to the Oscar-winning cinematography of Leon Shamroy. You can make color adjustments to your TV set all you want (and certain sets will have their own pre-set color push that may offset the intensity of the blue tint). But nothing ever rids this transfer of its blue tint, and yes - the whites on both my Sony projector and my Panasonic and Sony TV's all lean to blue in the whites, even whites of the eyes.

Let's just agree - something is remiss with The King and I, as is sincerely off with The Blue Max, The Best of Everything, The Black Swan (Tyrone Power movie), Garden of Evil, Desk Set, River of No Return, Wild River, and a slew of other vintage Fox/Scope catalog already on Blu that were released at approximately the same time (from 2011 to 2014 approximately). While a few 'scope' titles were released during this interim without any bias, something went wrong when these aforementioned titles were color-timed. Have spoken to a colorist at DeLuxe who has had the opportunity along with me, to sit down and go through these discs, and who confirms (without wanting to be identified - he values his job) that these discs look nothing like they should or did if properly struck from original film elements. This is not vintage color by DeLuxe. Another dead giveaway color-timing is off. There are no true reds - just muddy/ruddy oranges and dull browns.

If you are satisfied with the way these movies look, I may have some pan and scan and colorized old VHS tapes that may also be of interest!

This. Times 10. All the transfers cited and far too many others have been ruined by giving them the strong blue push so beloved of modern action movies. There's far too much opinion touted as fact bandied around this subject, especially by self-proclaimed experts with supposedly infallible decades-old memories of original theatrical screenings. As usual, confirmation bias also plays its part, but the latest is not always the best:

Some praise at morning what they blame at night / But always think the last opinion right. – An Essay on Criticism, Alexander Pope (1688–1744)​

No amount of insistent lecturing will sway me from my own opinion. There's simply no way countless directors, cinematographers et al, from the 1940s–1980s, spontaneously and unanimously decided their collective works should have the light and colour sucked out of them in favour of looking like they were shot through a thick blue/green/teal/whatever filter. Further, that this supposed trend has in large part only recently been revealed by whoever is now retiming these transfers thusly.

 

[Robert Crawford]

This. Times 10. All the transfers cited and far too many others have been ruined by giving them the strong blue push so beloved of modern action movies. There's far too much opinion touted as fact bandied around this subject, especially by self-proclaimed experts with supposedly infallible decades-old memories of original theatrical screenings. As usual, confirmation bias also plays its part, but the latest is not always the best:

Some praise at morning what they blame at night / But always think the last opinion right. – An Essay on Criticism, Alexander Pope (1688–1744)​

No amount of insistent lecturing will sway me from my own opinion. There's simply no way countless directors, cinematographers et al, from the 1940s–1980s, spontaneously and unanimously decided their collective works should have the light and colour sucked out of them in favour of looking like they were shot through a thick blue/green/teal/whatever filter. Further, that this supposed trend has in large part only recently been revealed by whoever is now retiming these transfers thusly.

It seems like there are self-proclaimed experts on both sides of this argument. Just saying. I can't remember what a film looked like five years ago on a movie theater screen, but what I do know is whether a film looks good to my eyes today on my HT display. Some people don't like the look of certain Fox BD releases and think the color scheme is wrong. That's fine and I respect that opinion. With that said, I think just about all of these Fox BD releases look beautifully displayed on my HT setup.

 

[Alan Tully]

Just a personal & highly subjective view (so no need for boxing gloves), but I do think that Fox releases have a "look" to them now: cool, sometimes downright bluish, but still with warm flesh tones, a punchy picture that doesn't have the grayscale of older transfers, & almost no film grain. The Blue Max seems to have all this in spades, but in this case it suits the subject (I saw the film in London's West End in the sixties, but unlike some here I don't have the photographic memory to remember exactly what it looked like), but I got rid of The Garden Of Evil as I didn't like that look on this film at all. I'm glad Fox did the excellent Egyptian HD transfer before they started all this stuff. Anyway, no blind buying any new Fox transfers for me, I'll need to read a few reviews/comments first.

 

[RolandL]

Let's just agree - something is remiss with The King and I, as is sincerely off with The Blue Max, The Best of Everything, The Black Swan (Tyrone Power movie), Garden of Evil, Desk Set, River of No Return, Wild River, and a slew of other vintage Fox/Scope catalog already on Blu that were released at approximately the same time (from 2011 to 2014

Well the title is The Blue Max so I guess it's OK

 

[skylark68]

Guess I need to revisit garden of evil. I hadn’t seen the film before so no reference but now I want to check it out again after my initial viewing. I did notice a blue push in river of no return though. It did make the river look mighty blue and cold.

 

[haineshisway]

Time for you to bone up on color grading in the all digital realm. Why you can even color grade only a portion of an individual shot! The days of color grading in chemical baths are long gone. And you of all people should know not all technicolor prints are created equal. Anyway end of discussion. Sorry I saw this 16X9 mess on HBO and it brought the whole thing back up in my mind. I should have just let it go as Fox certainly has and you will never give an inch and neither will I so I'm out of here regarding this lousy electronically color graded digital file we seem to have to live with in perpetuity. For all those happy with this I envy you and enjoy the show. I'll refer to the old DVD transfer that isn't blue or close to correct overall but at least white and red are somewhat normal . Bye again.

I know you won't be here to read it, but one has to address this: I don't need to bone up on anything - I understand color grading the the digital realm, just as I understand how truly absurd it would be to color grade only Anna's dress and eyes but not her face and other elements of the frame. And again, the mess you're seeing does not resemble what OTHERS are seeing on their Blu-ray. If Fox has done a new transfer that's a bit less blue, bring it on and let's see it - then we can compare. But the DVD is a joke, color-wise.

 

[Alan Tully]

It goes on, it goes on, Judah: the race is not over.

 

[PMF]

[...]So unless we hold a seance and call Leon Shamroy from the beyond, this old argument will continue to go in circles.[...]

Oh, and don't forget to ask Mr. Shamroy about those color-filtered shots from "South Pacific", okay?

 

[Mark B]

 

[Thomas T]

No amount of insistent lecturing will sway me from my own opinion.

I don't think any here have a problem with that. It's when some are insisting it as fact that it gets messy.

 

[Alan Tully]

Ha, very interesting. Of course with the old film grading/timing in a film lab, you could make it lighter or darker & change the colour using just different numbers of red, green & blue, or if working at Technicolor, cyan, magenta & yellow (same thing really). They now have all the toys & can be very creative, fine with new films, not so good with catalogue titles.

 

[Alan Tully]

I don't think any here have a problem with that. It's when some are insisting it as fact that it gets messy.

Yeah, fact like, I saw this film sixty years ago & I remember exactly what it looked like

Prior to 1996 I've never seen a film in a cinema looking like some of Fox's efforts.

 

[ahollis]

I saw The Blue Max about eight times when it was first released. To me, the Blu-Ray recreates that experience.

 

[Thomas T]

Yeah, fact like, I saw this film sixty years ago & I remember exactly what it looked like Prior to 1996 I've never seen a film in a cinema looking like some of Fox's efforts.

Hey, Billy. I may not remember what I had for dinner last night or where I put my car keys but my movie memories from growing up are burned into my brain (what theater I saw the movie in, who I saw the movie with, what the movie looked like, what the co-feature was etc.). Some of us senior movie geeks are like that

 

[dpippel]

I'm sorry, but unless you have a positronic brain, ANY memory of a film's color timing, etc. from 50 years ago or even 10 years ago has to be taken with a HUGE grain of salt. You may THINK that you remember it correctly, but that's how the mind works. If you have a print in-hand or some other kind of hard reference, that's a different story.

 

[PMF]

Hey, Billy. I may not remember what I had for dinner last night or where I put my car keys but my movie memories from growing up are burned into my brain (what theater I saw the movie in, who I saw the movie with, what the movie looked like, what the co-feature was etc.). Some of us senior movie geeks are like that

True for me, as well; but now that I think of it, I can also remember most of my school lunches, as well.
Wow, Thomas T, how'd that memory just happen?

 

[Thomas T]

I'm sorry, but unless you have a positronic brain, ANY memory of a film's color timing, etc. from 50 years ago or even 10 years ago has to be taken with a HUGE grain of salt. You may THINK that you remember it correctly, but that's how the mind works. If you have a print in-hand or some other kind of hard reference, that's a different story.

Well, thank you Doug for letting me know how my mind works. Something that has defeated even life long friends yet here you immediately diagnosed it within minutes on the internet. I'm impressed. Now you have me doubting my memories of my grandmother's blue rosary beads. Maybe they weren't blue at all maybe they were green and maybe Dorothy Malone didn't do the mambo in Written On The Wind, maybe she did the samba, oh dear ........

 

[dpippel]

So we have people referencing a 50 year old memory of a film's color timing arguing with people referencing DVD/Blu-ray/screenshot color timing about which one is "correct." Awesome.