Shopping DVR/HDD - Pioneer 420/520 vs. Tosh XS32 vs. Pana 85 vs. ? (1 Viewer)

[DavidAnthrope]

Phil - In short, to the best of my knowledge, "NO" and "NO". I have found NO way to enter a name (which the E80 had) and no way to tell if the program will fit.

That's not the worst of it, believe me.
No way to specify Sun-Sat recording, that was nice too.
But the scrolling is what's really bothersome.
That plus not being able to fast forward when previewing in the navigator.

I hate to recommend such a thing, but I am so hateful of this unit (and Panasonic) that I seriously recommend anyone who really thinks they want an E85 should go to Best-Buy and TRY one for 29 days and return it. I'm pretty sure inside 29 days you'll see all these wonderfully broken "features".

 

[joe buscema]

wow, i certainly didn't think i was "insulting" anyone or being "rude". if that's the way i came off, then i'm sorry.

having said that, after further research, i have found that technically the "black level bug" does exsist. it just isn't so apparent to most people and it also depends on what type of dvd player is being used for playback.

if your basically making copies for yourself, your in business with the rd-xs32.

as i am.

 

[Marvin]

That's true. Though I wonder if Panasonic hard drives are inherently less dependable than, say, Toshiba ones, or if there's a rate of failure in all brands' DVD recorders.

The "busted interface" is another thing altogether and is a cause for concern. Are there any happy E85 owners out there?

 

[Phil Tomaskovic]

My E80 has been going along great since I bought it new shortly after if first came out. Never had to reformat it and only one bad coaster (fingerprints on it I think).

I see Abt now has the E95 in stock which I assume has all the same glitches. The 100 is be closed out in some places for around $635, that may be the way to go...

 

[DavidAnthrope]

Not to beat this black-level thing to death, but one more bit of info I thought people might find interesting.

I first had a Pana HS2, and a Sony player (don't recall the model but it was middle of the road in price). I would use the Sony player to test EVERY DVD I burned on the HS2. Well, the discs I burned all looked washed out. I swapped the HS2 for a Phillips, thinking the black-level bug was a problem for the HS2 (as I recall reading about it here and never saw it mentioned for any other models). Well - it had the SAME problem, and the Phillips burned DVD+R whereas the HS2 burned DVD-R. I then swapped the Sony player for a Panasonic player, and it played the +R's perfectly with no black-level problems. Then I ditched the Phillips and went -back- to the HS2 (couldn't live without the hard drive!) and it worked perfectly. I have since tested discs the HS2 burned in everything from the cheapest no-name brands to even Playstations, and the ONLY one I've had trouble with was that damn Sony player. Having moved on to the E80 I've continued testing and the new Sony's play them fine.

SO - the moral of the story is - it wasn't just the Pana HS2 that had the problem - the Phillips had it too - and even a fairly pricey Sony player couldn't handle them.

Having said that - I suspect that these days, the current models of recorders & players can handle any/all of the various combinations perfectly. But who knows. Definitely something to watch out for.

 

[DavidAnthrope]

Marvin - It would be very interesting to research the failure rates of the Pana units compared to others. Trouble is, my repair shop was less than forthcoming only to say "No no we don't see a lot of these in for repair". Yeah right.

I wonder if consumer reports has anything on these.

 

[Phil Tomaskovic]

I imagine if someone got an E85 without having an E80, they might not think anything is wrong with the UI.

Just like I tried a new Motorola cell phone and couldn't stand it because its voice dialing feature was so different than on my Sony Ericsson phone. And if I got it without having used the Sony, I would have been ok with it.

 

[Peter Jessee]

I've been playing with my new 420 over the weekend, trying to get used to using it and trying to decide which buttons to program on my two universal remotes. One thing I've noticed already - the Pioneer remote has a very narrow angle to control the deck - needs a gunsite! I'm looking forward to using my MX-500 instead.

First impression - recording in SP (2 hour) mode blows away video tape, even my Panasonic S-VHS deck when it was working. I set up a 2 Hour 40 Minute manual mode for recording F1 races (MN17), and the quality is still better than VHS at SP. I am very pleased. And chase play is great! And so is watching one show while another records. You old-timers already know all this, but you lurking wanna-be owners can relax - digital is a MAJOR improvement in quality and convenience.

I haven't burned a disc yet, and I probably won't very often. I'm a major time-shifter, but not really a collector, and I don't own a camcorder. Burning discs will probably mostly be DVD-RWs to clear off the hard drive of 'Haven't quite had time to watch that' material. I'll let folks know how any burning goes, though.

BTW, any recommendations for good quality DVD-RWs?

Peter

 

[Marvin]

I still haven't bought one of these but am getting closer. Since I'm still considering the same models (plus the new Toshiba model, XS52)I figured I'd revive this thread to see if anyone has any additional opinions, receommendations, warnings etc.

I've been reading the reviews at Amazon and also at Avsforum. The Toshibas supposedly have a black-level bug though not everyone notices it. And I'm kind of concerned about that TV guide feature that Panasonic has. Will it be a problem if I don't use it and/or if my local cable company doesn't broadcast that channel?

Anything else I need to take into consideration?

 

[Elizabeth S]

If you're considering the Toshiba XS-52, is the larger hard drive of great importance to you? From early user reports, it appears that the black-level "bug" is still the same on the XS-52 as on the earlier XS-32. Considering that, the XS-32 is quite a bit more affordable, AND gives you the option of using -RW, which was eliminated with the XS-52. The Toshiba is a bit particular with media, though, and takes only 2X -RWs.

I personally still recommend the Pioneer 420 or 520 for media flexibility and ease of use overall.

 

[Marvin]

Thanks for the response. I guess it would be only if everything else were equal. Based on my presumed usage of such a device (transferring home movies and a bit of TV time shifting), I'm guessing 80 would be plenty.

I'm leaning away from the Toshibas due to the black level bug (someone at avsforum seems to have figured out the reason for it and wrote up a good explanation; at least, it made sense to me).

The E85 is a bit cheaper than the 520 so that would be my current (ever-changing) favorite. There was a post at Amazon in which someone said an earlier Pioneer model (the 510, I think) was noisy due to an internal fan. Is this true of the 520? Also, someone at AVS says his 520H won't let him copy DVD+R's (it treats them as if they were commercial copy-protected DVDs). I don't know if that would be a concern for me and/or if it applies to the E85 as well.

 

[Peter Jessee]

I have the 420 as well. The 'Home Movies' you'll be transferring - do you use a digital camcorder? If so, the 520 with it's Firewire port would be the choice. If you're using an analog camcorder, check out the 420 at Costco.com. It's the same as a 520 less the Firewire port. It was on sale before Christmas for $399.

The 420/520 is very quiet - I hear the hard drive sometimes, but never the fan. They are listed to use DVD-R and DVD-RW, not any of the '+' media, so no surprise it didn't like a DVD+R. I've used mostly Fuji disks, since the free ones in the box were Fuji, and they're the cheapest name-brand -RW's I can buy locally. One TDK DVD-R I tried worked fine too - no coasters after ~25 disks burned. Since the -R/RW disks are more compatible with home DVD players than the +R/RW's, I'm content with Pioneers choice of disks. You can pick up a +/- computer drive for under $50 if you want to save a video in +R/RW mode for some reason.

Overall, I love my Pioneer 420 - it's straitforward to use, makes great copies and disks, the chase and commercial skip features make watching broadcast TV MUCH less annoying, and it holds ~35 hours of shows at SP speed, which blows away Super VHS in picture quality.

Write if you have any questions.

Peter

 

[Marvin]

Thanks Peter. I see that Costco still lists a Pioneer DVD recorder for $399 but I didn't see the model number listed. Is it the 420?

http://www.costco.com/Browse/Product...th=79*81*4477*

In any case, I'm not a Costco member so I assume I'd have to add the cost of a membership into the price.

I don't have a digital camcorder, just an old 8mm (not even Hi-8), so a firewire port isn't a necessity. However it's possible I'd get a digital camcorder at some point so it might be nice to have this port.

 

[Elizabeth S]

Marvin,

That Costco link is for the 810 model. I noticed that Costco presently does not have the 420 model on their site -- looks like they're pushing this TIVO model instead. If you can find a good price on the 520 somewhere, that might be a better deal since you don't have the Costco membership anyway.

I have had the 420 since July and really like it. Recently helped my sister pick up the 520 locally and she's having fun with it.

 

[Marvin]

Thanks Elizabeth. I'm now leaning towards the 520H since it seems to get fewer negative comments than the E85 or Toshiba models. (Though I wonder if that's because fewer people own that model.)

 

[Marvin]

In case anyone's keeping score, I just ordered the Pioneer 520 from Vanns for $549.

Thanks again for answering my questions.

 

[Elizabeth S]

Marvin,

That's great -- let us know how it works out for you! I think you'll love it!

 

[Marvin]

OK. But it won't arrive until a week from tomorrow.

By the way, I know there's a thread for DVD-R media...but are there any brands of DVD-Rs/RWs I should avoid specifically for the 520H?

Update: I see Best Buy has a 50 pack of TDK 8X DVD-Rs on sale for 19.99 (though not available at my local Best Buy). Is there any reason not to get these?

 

[Elizabeth S]

I've had no compatibility problems thus far with the Pioneer 420. I've tried TDK 4X -Rs and they were fine; and Sony 8X -Rs were fine, so I would think TDK 8X should work. That's a great price -- I'd try it! (Too bad we don't have Best Buy yet.)

 

[Raymond_S]

They ususually have great deals online Elizabeth.

They usually ship for free as well. I've ordered from their website many times.
I think you can also get a 50 pack of Sony's for 19.99 as well. At least you could last week.