Pink noise from Speakers at high volume. Will an external amplifier fix this issue? (1 Viewer)

[eggman89]

Reciever: Onkyo RZ50.

120 W/Ch two channel driven.



Problem: On high volume (starts around 80 or more) there's a pink noise that comes from my system. Like crackling and static. Example here:



This is proportional to the volume. The more the volume, the more the noise.



If I turn off DIRAC, the popping reduces. If I turn on any other processing, for example increase the Bass, the noise increases.

Safe to say, this noise is introduced by my AVR.



I have 5 Jamo Concert series speakers (sensitivity: 89 db) and 4 Klipsch in ceiling speakers (sensitvity: 89 db). All 9 speakers are having the same noise.

I also tried different cables and plugs, but nothing helps.



Now, this is not a new issue. My previous AVR of Denon had the same issue. Turning on Audassy would increase the noise.



But then I wasn in an apartment and couldn't play very loud anyway.



Question: Is it normal? Is this what is called "Floor noise".

How can I minimize or fix this.



Would something like Emotiva BasX A5 Five-Channel Power Amplifier help? It also has 120 Watt/ 2 channel driven so Idk if it will even be worth spending any money on that .



Would some special power outlet conditional help?



SInce this is static and not hum, I don't think it's a Grounding issue.



Suggestions please? I want to reduce this noise.

 

[JohnRice]

I can’t think of any reason an external amplifier would make any difference.

For one thing, volume at 100 is usually far, FAR beyond anything you would ever use. Also, the origin of the noise could be source, not the receiver. It could be a lot of things, or might not be a problem at all, if it’s not audible at normal listening levels.

 

[Wayne A. Pflughaupt]

The numbers don't mean much because different manufactures use different metrics for volume level.

What is the range of the volume control? 0-100 or something else?

At what level (number) do you normally listen?

Regards,
Wayne A. Pflughaupt

 

[eggman89]

Range is 0-100.
82.5 is THX Ref.

Usually I listen to around 75 but on occasion I like to bump upto 85. It is loud, yes, but the static noise is driving me insane.

 

[JohnRice]

Just to add…

It’s pretty typical for a maximum usable playback level to be in the 70s. In that case, even turning it up to 100 is extremely risky. You could destroy your speakers, if any sound went through the system.

 

[Wayne A. Pflughaupt]

That seems like really bad background noise for an AVR in this price range. At 85, are you actually able to hear it from the seating position during quiet passages of program material?

Yes, it’s the “noise floor.” It’s not unusual for digital processing to increase noise.

I doubt an outboard amp will help, but it can’t hurt to try. Make sure there’s a generous return policy.

Regards,
Wayne A. Pflughaupt

 

[Edwin-S]

Are you using the same.source? Having this happen with two.diiferent.receivers suggwsrs some other issue. Since the noise is occurring in all.speakers, it could.mean a source with a poor signal.to noise ratio.

 

[ManW_TheUncool]

Since you're saying turning on DIRAC calibrated adjustments (and Audyssey on prior AVR) made it worse, I'm wondering what exactly are the adjustments doing... perhaps in response to some problematic acoustics in your space?

Maybe the calibrations are finding a need (whether rightly or not) to boost the signal (whether at some points on the FR curve or as a whole) so much that substantial noise gets added/created and/or boosted as well. I'd probably wanna check to see if the adjustments at least look reasonable.

BUT is the noise actually noticeable from a reasonable distance when DIRAC is disabled?

_Man_

 

[John Dirk]

You've effectively replaced everything except the speakers so it stands to reason they may actually be the problem. If you regularly listen at the levels indicated it is possible you've fried your tweeters over time. I'd at least test this theory by swapping in a [temporary] replacement speaker if available.

 

[JohnRice]

There certainly seems to be a problem beyond the receiver.

 

[Baenwort]

All amplifiers have some noise of hiss. How much varies by design. You want to look at the THD+N for a given power out to the speaker and also how many W your speakers need for the sound level you are after at your listening position.

Well documented amps give charts that graph THD+N vs power.

Use something like https://mehlau.net/audio/spl/ or other spl calculator to find what wattage your roughly need.

Components with the THD+N chart for the amps you are looking at and compare that to the THD+N number for your current amp to see if it is better and therefore may help with your hiss issue.

Charts for your reciever at: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/.../onkyo-tx-rz50-review-home-theater-avr.30842/

From his measurements this particular AVR isn't among the top performers on the noise floor front.

Ruke of thumb used to be Class D tends to have higher at the same cost class. However, you can certainly find great class D and bad Class AB.

However, this is changing per friends who have the budget to keep up with this: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/noise-floor.14618/

If you want to dive deep https://www.diyaudio.com/community/threads/what-makes-an-amplifier-have-a-lower-noise-floor.104274/ they like to build and design and built amps overthere. Lots of geeky folks.

The short/fast/expensive answer I've found is to massively over build/power your amp section.

Or go to a different speaker design. I like highly efficient horn speakers also but they tend to show this more. I've never hear it from giant ribbon speakers like Magnepan or other electrostatics but those also tend to be paired with giant over spec amps so I'm not sure which came first.

You are now entering the murky and expensive end of the audio pool.

 

[JohnRice]

 

[eggman89]

Thanks everyone for your inputs.
So I figured out the problem. I was downmixing a 5.1 input to All Stereo (or even stereo).
I assume that is adding noise of the extta three channels into the two channels. Causing this issue.

If i upmix a 5.1 to 5.1.4 or play as 5.1 it's not an issue. It's also not an issue with other type of up mixing. Only downmixing.

As to why I was downmixing i was playing Just Dance with my wife on Switch. Because switch was only playing in Main L + R (of a 5.1 input) i thought I'd do a All Channel Stereo.

 

[John Dirk]

Thanks everyone for your inputs.
So I figured out the problem. I was downmixing a 5.1 input to All Stereo (or even stereo).
I assume that is adding noise of the extta three channels into the two channels. Causing this issue.

If i upmix a 5.1 to 5.1.4 or play as 5.1 it's not an issue. It's also not an issue with other type of up mixing. Only downmixing.

As to why I was downmixing i was playing Just Dance with my wife on Switch. Because switch was only playing in Main L + R (of a 5.1 input) i thought I'd do a All Channel Stereo.

But in your original post you said you had the same problem with your previous AVR.

I'm not so sure the issue has been properly identified or resolved but I'd welcome being wrong for your sake.

 

[eggman89]

There's still a hiss at high volume, which is proportional to the volume.
However this is not audible from listening position. That is issue number one.

This is not bothering me as it's very faint.

Then there's another crackling sound that gets intrigued when downmixing. This is issue number two which is bothering me.

My mistake was to think they're the same issue.

Although I dint have denon now, it probably will have the same issue when downmixing. Could be a Nintendo Switch thing too, who knows.

 

[JohnRice]

I agree with the other John. Something isn’t solved. The comment “A 5.1 input” can mean a lot of different things. I still don’t think this should be happening. Since it varies with volume and occurred with a different receiver, I suspect something is wrong the source or how it’s connected but we have no info about that so we can only make blind guesses.

 

[eggman89]

I agree with the other John. Something isn’t solved. The comment “A 5.1 input” can mean a lot of different things. I still don’t think this should be happening. Since it varies with volume and occurred with a different receiver, I suspect something is wrong the source or how it’s connected but we have no info about that so we can only make blind guesses.

Worst case it could be a Nintendo switch thing. I don't have any use case for downmixing otherwise, so didn't bother to investigate further.

I've checked with other sources (ps5, shield and the TV eArc) and this is not an issue.