*** Official Rotel RSP-1066 pre/pro DISCUSSION Thread *** (1 Viewer)

[Karl Englebright]

Sorry, I should have had the
I don't agree with the break-in theories (other than catching infant mortality or DOA's). So we'll leave at that...

 

[Joe e h]

I built circuit boards for General Motors for 6 years. We would burn in a sample bunch of boards out of a predetermined run size. The burn in chamber would simulate the circuit board going though normal and adnormal driving conditions. It ranged from -40 to ~170 in tempature.

This was done just to test the components on the board. This provides the customer with good parts. Just my experiance with Burn In

 

[Neville]

O.K.

Here is my final input on the Rotel RSP-1066.

My dealer has got my business for life after this evening. I called him this morning to discuss the issues and he offered to stop by this evening and listen to the piece with me. He also brought the Classe piece with him.

First thing we did is listen to the noise I was getting when the sources were not turned on. Basically the conclusion we came was that it was the potentiometer for the volume knob. When the volume is all the way down it appears that it turns that device completely off. As soon as you turn the volume up (even to just the first setting) the potentiometer engages which then causes the slight hiss from the speakers. I want to clarify that this is a slight hiss and you need to be close to the speaker to detect it. It can not at all be heard at any distance from the speaker. I am not an EE nor do I pretend to be one, so some else maybe able to elaborate better on this, but what ever that hiss was it has something to do with the potentiometer in the unit.

Now earlier I was worried that this was related to the hiss I was hearing at high volume on some of my CD’s. Turns out that the hiss I was hearing was tape hiss from the original recording, and had nothing to do with this other hiss what so ever. He looked at the CD cases and showed me on both CD’s that they were AAD recordings. I never knew about the codes on the CD case indicating the original recording medium. He brought some digital recordings with him and not a bit of hiss. I think this is a good thing. I was never able to detect this hiss with my previous pre-amp. So it is not that the Rotel is creating the hiss, it is actually reproducing the hiss from the original recording. I would say that this speaks to the ability of the Rotel piece. For it to actually reproduce the tape hiss from the original analog recording before it was transferred to digital is a testament to it’s capability to reproduce sound.

Just to substantiate the above conclusions, Greg then spent about 30 minutes hooking up the Classe piece for me. The slight hiss when no source was turned was gone with the Classe piece. So I this confirmed for me that it was not a ground loop issue or anything on my part, but it was indeed something internal to Rotel. When we listened to the two CD’s in which I was detecting the Hiss at high volume it was also present with the Classe piece.

I absolutely had never head this tape hiss on these two CD’s ever before. However, I will admit that I rarely have the volume up to where it was today.

After we diagnosed both these problems, we then spent some time listening to the two. With the digital recorded stuff the Rotel was very nice sounding. Nice soundstage, great depth. High ends where a little flat. For instance when I was listening two Rush “Xanadu” the opening to the song where it simulates some outdoors sounds like birds chirping and with some chimes it just sounded like it was missing something. Once the music kicked and there was more mid-range sound it sounded very nice. I had no complaints I would have been very happy with this piece. However, when compared to the Classe piece it just fell a little short. The Classe had a lot more air in it. The high end was more present but not fatiguing. Just had more separation.

When comparing these two pieces in DPL (Classe), vs. DPLII(Rotel) the Rotel sounded better. The Rotel has a lot of features for HT processing and the remote is beyond belief. If you want a very good sounding pre-amp for music and an excellent pre-amp for HT. I have to believe that this piece should be considered. It isn’t a steal at $1500, but it is definitely worth $1500, especially if you great HT performance.

I myself am looking for the best sounding musical piece I can find, that just happens to do HT. The Classe fits my needs better. Especially with the really, really, really good price Greg offered it to me at. It doesn’t have all the new HT modes, but that doesn’t bother me. As far as the music surround modes went. The only one I like on the Rotel was 5ch Stereo. All the others I could just do without. I much prefer the music surround modes on the Classe. They just seemed more natural, not as forced and fake.

Again, I can’t say enough for this dealer. Anyone who would provide this kind of service for such a small sale is beyond belief. My days of comparison shopping are over. You can’t substitute price for service in my opinion. Greg was at my house for over and hour swapping pieces and listening and testing. AWESOME!!!

I hope I have been helpful and have been able to provide some good input on this unit. If anyone has anymore questions I will try to answer as best I can. I am not the best person for describing sound. I do know what I like and don’t like though, and I liked the Rotel. My biggest flaw is sometimes being to critical of the details and forgetting to actually listen to the music!

 

[John Morris]

Steven: If you get a chance, could you try some 2 channel music using the analog bypass mode of the 1066, and then report back as to how it sounds. Thanks!

Okay, I gotta do it, I gotta say it. I told you so. Almost any mid-fi receiver can sound good during movie playback. True fidelity exists when that HT processor can also replace your 2 channel preamp. It seems that, in accordance to what I was told by an insider, the Rotel doesn't do that. Conversely, the Outlaw, Anthem, and to a lesser extent, the Ref 30 does.
Steven: BTW, I've owned a couple of CP- Classe A preamps and they were soooooo clean. Very nice preamps. I always made fun of their remotes though. Solid metal, with about 6 buttons total. Only good for adjusting the volume and knocking out the burglar who wanted to take your Classe A.

 

[Will]

One difference between the Rotel review and the Outlaw beta testers reviews is the Outlaw beta testers had a long time to get familiar with their units and discuss any problems they found with the Outlaws, and get the Outlaws response, before they were released from their NDA.

The Rotel pre/pro reviewers by comparison, haven't spent as many weeks with their unit, nor could they discuss any potential problems they've found with the manufacturer, and hear the manufacturer's response, before reporting those potential problems to us.

As more people get their hands on the Rotel, we may find the concensus opinion may be different, perhaps better or perhaps worse, than the opinions reasonably drawn from the earliest reviews.

 

[John Morris]

One of the differences between the Rotel review and the Outlaw beta testers reviews is the Outlaw reviews had a long time to get familiar with their units and discuss problems they found with the Outlaws, and get the Outlaws side of things, before they were released from their NDA.

Will: Please better explain your comments above with regard to my beta testing objectiveness. I am flying out of internet connection at 300 tonight, and I expect your response before then. I interpret your comments to say that my posted opinions of the 950's performance are somehow influenced by my discussions with Outlaw. If that is the case, I will NOT allow anyone to insult me publicly without penalty. Please further explain your statement. Thank you for your prompt consideration.

 

[Will]

Hey John,
I am not saying you or any Outlaw beta tester was anything but objective. So if that's what you're worrying about, put your mind at ease!
What I mean is that when Outlaw beta testers first examined the 950, you guys may have found what only appeared at first to be problems but afterwards as you got more familiar with the 950, you learned they were not problems at all. Fortunately, the public never had to hear about those (non)-problems because, when you were eventually released from your NDA, you were no longer naive green users of the 950. By then you were experienced accomplished users.
I'm guessing that some beta testers found what appeared to be problems that the beta tester then reported to the Outlaws as part of the beta tests. And (and yes, I'm still guessing here) sometimes the Outlaw response might be something like Hey, did you forgot to switch the do-hicky knob? That's why it sounds lousy. Or Hey, you forgot to connect using the thing-a-giggy connection. Unless you do that it won't sound like it's supposed to the way you've got it set up.
The Rotel reviewers, on the other hand, don't talk to the manufacturer. Also, some of the Rotel reviewers give us their reactions without really understanding how their unit works. That's understandable. Especially if it's a demo unit that has to be returned quickly.
With the Outlaw beta testers, we (John Q. Public) got your lasting impressions. Your impressions with the 950 are quite positive. Which is a good thing! But with the Rotel pre/pro so far, all we have are initial impressions. And the initial impressions found some problems. That's a cause for concern with the Rotel. No doubt about it. But to put this in perspective, the jury is still out on the Rotel. Because who knows, it's possible we may find some of the initial problems were actually caused by one reviewer who forgot to switch the do-hicky knob or forgot to connect using the the thing-a-giggy connection. Or there could be some real problems, at least with the first batch of the Rotel pre/pro.
Time will tell!

 

[Kevin C Brown]

Logic would say:
That if Neville heard the problem with the volume knob/noise floor on the Rotel in the short time he's had the unit, that the Outlaw beta testers should have heard any similar problem with their units in that they *did* have a lot longer to evaluate them.
P's and Q's and such...
On the Sony TA-E9000ES, an interesting data point. If you leave each input in "auto detect source mode," (not the same as "auto detect format mode"), the noise floor *is* a lot louder than if you set the input. I.e., for DVD set the optical input. For CD it's the coax input. Etc. If you try to let each input figure out the coax, optical, analog connection itself, that's where the problem occurs.
My experience, and I work for a semiconductor company BTW, we don't do any burn in of the actual semiconductor devices before they leave the fab. As far as board level burn in, it is for "infant mortality" reasons. Trying to force the marginal units to fail *before* they get to a customer. Not for any performance reasons.

 

[Will]

I don't know if there is or is not a problem with the volume knob/noise floor on the Rotel unit. It's possible Neville's unit was set up wrong or was a bad unit. We don't know. But I would be interested if others who review the Rotel pre/pro hear the same problem Neville heard.

 

[Steven Simon]

This bantering will end guys.,.....

Let's get back on topic......

 

[BruceD]

Like LarryB, the previous Rotel pre/pros I've listened to have never really been up to my standards in the quality sound department (I haven't heard the 1066 yet). In the past they also had a major flame-out with one of their prepros that was seriously flawed (I forget the model #).

Rotel makes great amps, they just don't quite have the prepro game under control yet.

 

[Neville]

Just to clarify a point made by LarryB regarding the Classe SSP-30. He is absolutely correct in that this piece does not have all the new fancy surround processing modes like DPLII, NEO:6, etc.

This piece does however have 7.1 inputs and outputs. I believe this should allow me to add the other processing modes if I ever feel like I have to have them by adding and external processor at a later date. Please correct me if I am wrong on that.

I really don't think I will ever go beyound 5.1 though just because of the room set-up. Now if I were to ever get a chance to build a Music/HT room in a new house, then all bets are off.

 

[RAF]

This bantering will end guys.,.....
Let's get back on topic......

Thanks, Steve, for jumping in here. I was going to do this myself, but, as a beta tester for the 950 as well as an administrator here I'm sure I would have generated some uncalled for flack from certain members.
However, before this turns ugly let's all get something straight:

• The beta test on the 950 is now officially over (as the Outlaws themselves have explained in their newsletter.
• At this point we will be turning to a phase of this product's presence in the marketplace (units in the hands of consumers) that will put it on a par with the Rotel 1066 in terms of reviews and user impressions. I welcome this phase and will, when this product is released (I believe the 3rd week of March timeline the Outlaws have indicated is a realistic one at this point), establish a thread where consumers can speak their minds.
• Now that the beta test is over I am going to respectfully ask that any further discussion involving the test, the testers, their motives, perceived "conspiracy theories," whatever, cease immediately. I think it has been clearly established that everyone, following the forum guidelines of good taste, etc. has had more than ample opportunity to state their case so this is not a reaction by a beta tester with certain forum clout. I'll let the record speak for me on that one if you have any problems in that regard. However, I'm sure that the vast majority of the membership here is getting sick and tired of the endless banter and it serves no useful purpose here.
• In other words, as Steve said, time to get back on task. Let's concentrate on HARDWARE issues, and not personalities. I'm leaving all these threads up here on the forum so that others can see what took place. I'm just not going to tolerate any further discussion regarding the beta test at this point because that is now history.

If anyone has a problem with this, then so be it. There are other venues on the Internet that seem to encourage this type of endless debate and I'm sure you can find a place better suited to your needs and temperment.
No names.
No banishment.
No particular people.
So don't start taking this personally. It's a general statement to prevent any future confrontations, and not directed specifically at any individual.
Reasonable people will understand this. Unreasonable people will be dealt with as need be.
Thank you for your cooperation. I've learned a lot about pre/pros over the past several months and just about everyone here, even those with apparent hidden agendas, has contributed to this in a positive way. Let's just get back to the letter and the spirit of the title of this section of the Home Theater Forum.
Case closed.

 

[RAF]

It would be a shame if anyone wrote the unit off based on what we've heard yet. I'm still very eager to hear a report from someone who's really put the unit through its paces.

LarryB,
Excellent point. And the very reason why I'm hoping that users will come forward (my assessment of human nature tells me that this will occur) and start a lively, informative discussion.
That's the purpose of this forum. And, I would also state, probably one of the reasons that people get frustrated when there is the delay of a product, any product, from any manufacturer.
The court of public opinion, weighing the evidence available to the owner, not just to the casual observer, is probably the most valuable source of information to potential comsumers.

 

[Legairre]

Can someone tell me what happened in the OFFICIAL Rotel thread that caused the mods to respond so harshly. I posted my review and answered a couple of questions yesterday. After that I logged off HTF until this morning. Now it seems that something must have really gone wrong. Did someone think I wasn't honest? Did someone really disagree with my review? If that was the case let me just say this. I liked the Rotel for movies(DVD) and for anolog music, but I wasn't thrilled with it's digital connection. I'd say if you like DVDs and have a good CD player go ahead and give it a try, but if you have a cheap CD player and need to use the digital connection you may be

disappointed like I was.

What happended guys? Did I piss someone off?

 

[Rusty J.]

I think that it was because John Morris started complaining about the delay of the Rotel 1066 from his dealers. He said that his dealer misled him about when the 1066 would be in stock. Other people in the thread didn't like him complaining about the Rotel. I think he probably was trying to polute the Rotel thread just like other people had been doing in other threads by complaining about the Outlaw 950. Maybe, he was returning the favor? Maybe he can chime in here himself and tell you why he was complaining about the Rotel 1066?

 

[John Tompkins]

Legairre, I sent you an email

At this point after my Kool-Aid thread was shut down. I not exactly sure of what I can and cant say..Oh well

 

[Rusty J.]

Mr. Tompkins,

What did you say in a Kool aid post? I am new here and am wondering what you mean by shut down, and your reference to not being able to say something? Isn't this America?

 

[Alex Yang]

Legairre,
It wasn't anything sinister nothing was edited out that shouldn't have been... There were a few posts that were listed that didn't adhere to the original theme of the thread "Official Rotel 1066 reviews"...
Posts that dealt with "delays" and "complaints" were taken off...
Basically in that "official" review thread ONLY posts regarding ACUTUAL review of the Rotel 1066 unit should be posted...and that's EXACTLY what RAF did, he cleaned out all the non essential posts...
-Alex

 

[Legairre]

Thanks, guys. I didn't think it was a conspiracy or anything. I just check the forum this morning and saw the mods comments. I felt like I missed a good Tyson fight. I didn't get to see any of the threads after mine. Darn, darn , darn :frowning:. I'm always late to the party. I went to bed early last night. I guess if you snooze you literally do loose.