UHD Review A Few Words About A few words about...™ - High Noon -- in 4k UHD (1 Viewer)

[Robert Crawford]

I already have the Olive disc, but I’m ordering this 4K of High Noon along with the 4K Rio Bravo. As discussed in another thread, John Wayne wasn’t a fan of High Noon so he made Rio Bravo.

During her audio commentary, Julie Kirgo takes John Wayne to task regarding his words and actions after High Noon was released. The Duke is my all-time favorite actor, but this was far from his best moment.

 

[Sam Favate]

After watching this movie again in its entirety three times in less than 24 hours, I'm more convinced than ever that this is not only best western ever filmed but one of the best movies ever made. For many years, I thought The Searchers was the best western ever made.

Interesting, because I was just thinking The Searchers was my favorite Western of all time. But now with this disc set to arrive at my house this week, I will revisit this with that in mind.

 

[jayembee]

Rio Bravo was a bit of a Garden Party compared to High Noon ...

I saw what you did there...

 

[jayembee]

Interesting, because I was just thinking The Searchers was my favorite Western of all time. But now with this disc set to arrive at my house this week, I will revisit this with that in mind.

My favorite Western of all time is My Darling Clementine, but The Searchers is probably second place. Looking forward to seeing the High Noon UHD, though.

 

[Robert Crawford]

There is a difference between what is your favorite western and what you think is the best western.

 

[jayembee]

There is a difference between what is your favorite western and what you think is the best western.

True enough, but my choice for "favorite" tends to remain relatively constant. My choice for "best" can fluctuate.

 

[Robert Crawford]

True enough, but my choice for "favorite" tends to remain relatively constant. My choice for "best" can fluctuate.

Which is the case with me as stated in my previous post below when talking about best western versus westerns I enjoy watching more which are my favorite western films:

"After watching this movie again in its entirety three times in less than 24 hours, I'm more convinced than ever that this is not only best western ever filmed but one of the best movies ever made. For many years, I thought The Searchers was the best western ever made. However, in the last 20 years or so, my opinion changed due to changes I observed in our own society that kind of mimics some similar issues conveyed in High Noon. With that said, there are some westerns like The Searchers that I enjoy watching more than High Noon."

 

[mskaye]

During her audio commentary, Julie Kirgo takes John Wayne to task regarding his words and actions after High Noon was released. The Duke is my all-time favorite actor, but this was far from his best moment.

We will never have to make this choice, but if we had to choose one of the films to save for posterity, what would make the cut - High Noon or Rio Bravo?

Which is the case with me as stated in my previous post below when talking about best western versus westerns I enjoy watching more which are my favorite western films:

"After watching this movie again in its entirety three times in less than 24 hours, I'm more convinced than ever that this is not only best western ever filmed but one of the best movies ever made. For many years, I thought The Searchers was the best western ever made. However, in the last 20 years or so, my opinion changed due to changes I observed in our own society that kind of mimics some similar issues conveyed in High Noon. With that said, there are some westerns like The Searchers that I enjoy watching more than High Noon."

I've seen HIGH NOON and RIO BRAVO within 48 hours of each other. They are linked by Wayne's and Hawks' comments but they couldn't be more dissimilar. I love them both for different reasons but I feel HIGH NOON is the more modern, deeper, stylish, powerful, serious piece of cinema. It's a masterpiece of compression and it still packs emotional power. And like On the Waterfront, it's a fairly accurate barometer of what was happening in America at that time. RIO BRAVO is brilliant entertainment of its kind, but it's a cartoon. It's great Hollywood Hokum (that's not a dig.) It's great and I enjoy every minute of it but it's a summation/celebration of a certain style of filmmaking and approach and star power acting (and a little non-acting as well (sorry Ricky.) It has nothing to lose by this approach and it's obvious how it has influenced Tarantino and others. Though for all of Hawks' bellyaching about Sam Peckinpah, the final battle is fairly lame by today's standards. Hawks never had John Ford's poetic eye and heart (watch How Green Was My Valley, Grapes of Wrath, and The Long Voyage Home for the heart.) They were different artists with different concerns. John Ford was a dark soul. THE SEARCHERS is a bit of mix of both approaches while adding the epic and the power of the journey. The corrosive power of HATE is on display. It's John Wayne in his darkest most nuanced role (alongside VALANCE.) It's visual poetry and the final "Let's go home Debbie" can still reduce me/us to tears.) Yes like RB, it's still Hollywood entertainment (like RB it has a song - as did many Ford films, and after a major battle, we get a Three Stooges moment w Ward Bond.) Three masterpieces of cinema. Everyone is going to have a preference.

 

[mskaye]

Interesting, because I was just thinking The Searchers was my favorite Western of all time. But now with this disc set to arrive at my house this week, I will revisit this with that in mind.

We will never have to make this choice, but if we had to choose one of the films to save for posterity, what would make the cut - High Noon or Rio Bravo?

I've seen HIGH NOON and RIO BRAVO within 48 hours of each other. They are linked by Wayne's and Hawks' comments but they couldn't be more dissimilar. I love them both for different reasons but I feel HIGH NOON is the more modern, deeper, stylish, powerful, serious piece of cinema. It's a masterpiece of compression and it still packs emotional power. And like On the Waterfront, it's a fairly accurate barometer of what was happening in America at that time. RIO BRAVO is brilliant entertainment of its kind, but it's a cartoon. It's great Hollywood Hokum (that's not a dig.) It's great and I enjoy every minute of it but it's a summation/celebration of a certain style of filmmaking and approach and star power acting (and a little non-acting as well (sorry Ricky.) It has nothing to lose by this approach and it's obvious how it has influenced Tarantino and others. Though for all of Hawks' bellyaching about Sam Peckinpah, the final battle is fairly lame by today's standards. Hawks never had John Ford's poetic eye and heart (watch How Green Was My Valley, Grapes of Wrath, and The Long Voyage Home for the heart.) They were different artists with different concerns. John Ford was a dark soul. THE SEARCHERS is a bit of mix of both approaches while adding the epic and the power of the journey. The corrosive power of HATE is on display. It's John Wayne in his darkest most nuanced role (alongside VALANCE.) It's visual poetry and the final "Let's go home Debbie" can still reduce me/us to tears.) Yes like RB, it's still Hollywood entertainment (like RB it has a song - as did many Ford films, and after a major battle, we get a Three Stooges moment w Ward Bond.) Three masterpieces of cinema. Everyone is going to have a preference.

PS - there is something in the air about Sheriffs. I have watched the following four films in the last week: The Tin Star, Rio Bravo, High Noon and tonight, the new Criterion of John Sayles' Lone Star. If I was back in Film Studies, I could write a paper titled The Sheriff as Metaphor.

 

[Nelson Au]

It seems in recent days, so many posts about Westerns has been catching my eye. I’ve never been a fan of the genre. I grew up in an era as it was fading. Not that I‘ve never seen them, I’ve sampled the famous TV series of the late 1950’s and early 1960’s. I haven’t seen a lot of the so called film classics. Now I might have to check out The Searchers. And I saw the thread for the 4K Once Upon A Time in the West. I’ve never even heard of this one. I thought it was How The West Was Won. I have seen The Good, The Bad and the Ugly once or twice. So I got the reference in Back To The Future Part 3. But not the other two Man with No Name Leone films. I don’t even have those three in my library. I may consider checking all these out.

 

[sbjork]

During her audio commentary, Julie Kirgo takes John Wayne to task regarding his words and actions after High Noon was released. The Duke is my all-time favorite actor, but this was far from his best moment.

I brought that issue up when I wrote about Rio Bravo, and the way that Kirgo responded shows that it's still an open wound for her. And she's a big Hawks admirer, too, but Wayne's treatment of Carl Foreman and High Noon really rankles her to this day.

 

[mskaye]

During her audio commentary, Julie Kirgo takes John Wayne to task regarding his words and actions after High Noon was released. The Duke is my all-time favorite actor, but this was far from his best moment.

 

[Wayne Klein]

Never got why Hawks disliked this. Yes, it’s the opposite of something he would have made and that’s exactly what’s special about the film. It turns many of the western tropes in their head. It’s a marvelous movie and one of Zinnemann’s best iMHO. He shows a tremendous affinity not just for the genre but, as always, about character development, psychology and conflict. A brilliant film, great performances and well written.

 

[Stephen_J_H]

During her audio commentary, Julie Kirgo takes John Wayne to task regarding his words and actions after High Noon was released. The Duke is my all-time favorite actor, but this was far from his best moment.

Between this and his reported conduct at the 1973 Oscars, he has a handful of these moments.

 

[Mark McSherry]

Between this and his reported conduct at the 1973 Oscars, he has a handful of these moments.

The 1973 Oscars event was debunked by Michael Hiltzik's LA Times piece from August 2022--

Column: Did John Wayne try to assault Sacheen Littlefeather at the 1973 Oscars? Debunking a Hollywood myth​

Hiltzik ends his column with this---

"As for the John Wayne story, it’s an insult both to the academy and to Wayne himself...

"Wayne was a dyed-in-the-wool political conservative, but according to his biographer, Scott Eyman, in real life he was a “well brought up Edwardian man” who would never think of assaulting a woman. Nehme elicited that insight from Eyman directly, noting that he didn’t even mention the episode in his book about Wayne.

"“Nobody I talked to who knew Wayne,” Eyman told her, “ever referred to or, apparently, believed that story.” It would be justice to retire it forever. "

 

[Kyle_D]

Never got why Hawks disliked this.

It's hard to get into without violating the forum's rules against political discussions. Suffice to say, High Noon was widely viewed at the time as an allegory for Hollywood's response to the McCarthy hearings. Wayne was a vocal anti-communist, and he viewed it as communist propaganda. Hawks never discussed his politics publicly, but many have speculated he was privately sympathetic with Wayne. In Hawks' public statements, he mainly complained that Kane was a professional who knew what his job entailed when he took it, and so he should have "manned up" and never asked the townspeople for assistance in the first place. He also hated the moment where Kane threw away his badge, as it was a rejection of the professionalism that Hawks venerated.

I've tried watching the film many times over the years, and while I admire its technical qualities, I've always taken issue with its central thesis and worldview. As I noted in another thread, "You can't count on society, and it's the duty of lonely individuals to do what's right," leads to the ending of Taxi Driver.

 

[sbjork]

Apocryphal Oscars stories or not, Wayne did brag in a Playboy interview about playing role in driving Carl Foreman out of the country. His activism in the name of anti-Communism, and all the excesses that he condoned or even actively participated in, is a big reason why some people resent him to this day.

While the political circumspection on these forums is laudable and appreciated, you just can't discuss movies like High Noon without touching on politics.

 

[Mark McSherry]

In Darkness at High Noon - Directed by Lionel Chetwynd mention is made of two times Wayne and Foreman met. The full movie is available to view on youtube.

---The first instance quotes from Foreman's documents (starts at the 1:28:05 mark.) Foreman says that Wayne convinced him that unless he 'named names' he would not work in this town again. Foreman realized he needed to get a passport while he still could.

---The second time occurred in the late 1960's. The meeting is told by Foreman's daughter beginning at the 1:49:00 stamp.

 

[Wayne Klein]

It's hard to get into without violating the forum's rules against political discussions. Suffice to say, High Noon was widely viewed at the time as an allegory for Hollywood's response to the McCarthy hearings. Wayne was a vocal anti-communist, and he viewed it as communist propaganda. Hawks never discussed his politics publicly, but many have speculated he was privately sympathetic with Wayne. In Hawks' public statements, he mainly complained that Kane was a professional who knew what his job entailed when he took it, and so he should have "manned up" and never asked the townspeople for assistance in the first place. He also hated the moment where Kane threw away his badge, as it was a rejection of the professionalism that Hawks venerated.

I've tried watching the film many times over the years, and while I admire its technical qualities, I've always taken issue with its central thesis and worldview. As I noted in another thread, "You can't count on society, and it's the duty of lonely individuals to do what's right," leads to the ending of Taxi Driver.

I don’t have an issue with its central thesis. i honestly don’t see it as that way with the film at all. In fact, it argues the opposite. I don’t see it as any sort of communist propaganda (which is how Wayne may have viewed it) If anything, I think it points the way towards Leone’s revisionist take on the western hero in many respects. I have always taken it as Hawks was jealous of Zinnemann breaking the mold and being critical of how American is supposed to be rather than Hawks version. It deconstructed the machismo of Nawks own films. I don’t see anything political per se 8n the message but I do see a cultural critique. Perhaps there was jealousy on the part of Hawks or the fact that he subverted much of Hawks’ own films put forward was his problem. If anything, Wayne’s take is unjustified as Cooper is anything but what he might see in it. It’s certainly a different world view but that’s the advance of cinema so the arts- being able to challenge the status quo.

Given what happenEd with the McCarthy hearings, if it was indeed meant to be a critique of that, it’s a brilliant take on it. Just because one can enjoy steak it doesn’t mean one can’t enjoy chicken as well.

 

[Robert Crawford]

I don’t have an issue with its central thesis. i honestly don’t see it as that way with the film at all. In fact, it argues the opposite. I don’t see it as any sort of communist propaganda (which is how Wayne may have viewed it) If anything, I think it points the way towards Leone’s revisionist take on the western hero in many respects. I have always taken it as Hawks was jealous of Zinnemann breaking the mold and being critical of how American is supposed to be rather than Hawks version. It deconstructed the machismo of Nawks own films. I don’t see anything political per se 8n the message but I do see a cultural critique. Perhaps there was jealousy on the part of Hawks or the fact that he subverted much of Hawks’ own films put forward was his problem. If anything, Wayne’s take is unjustified as Cooper is anything but what he might see in it. It’s certainly a different world view but that’s the advance of cinema so the arts- being able to challenge the status quo.

Given what happenEd with the McCarthy hearings, if it was indeed meant to be a critique of that, it’s a brilliant take on it. Just because one can enjoy steak it doesn’t mean one can’t enjoy chicken as well.

Frankly, it’s a better film than any Hawks has directed. And I’m a huge Hawks fan.