Scott Atwell Star Trek Discussion thread (Series and Films) (3 Viewers)

[Bryan^H]

I also love The Royale. Perhaps there’s a support group for monsters like me

I love that episode. I'd take it over most season 6, and 7 eps any day of the week.

 

[Osato]

I’m a TOS, DS9 and voyager fan.

I have tried to go back and watch TNG many times. The last time I didn’t bother with the first 2 seasons and went to season 3. I still didn’t make it far.

Enterprise I would like to rewatch as I feel like it will play better now then when I originally saw it.

I’ve only seen an episode or 2 of the nu star trek series. I don’t have paramount + currently.

TOS I have so many times of course. Local Des Moines affiliate had them on during the 80s and I tried to record each one.
Same with DS9, voyager and Enterprise when they aired. I also caught many of the shows in syndicated reruns too.

I’m slowly watch TOS with my 3 sons. We are on season 2.

My wife was willing to watch all of voyager and DS9 with me a few years back. She enjoyed both of those series. She’s also seen many of the TOS episodes too.

As I said I have enterprise on vudu and that will be my next series to try and watch again.

 

[Josh Steinberg]

But then, I'm one of the few people who think "The Measure of a Man" is nonsensical.

I don’t really care much for that episode but I had plenty of high school and college teachers that did - the A/V cart must’ve been dragged out at least half a dozen times in my academic career to show that episode to indifferent classes.

Generally, I’m not a fan of Melissa Snodgrass’s contributions to TNG. By all accounts she seems like a wonderful person but I simply disagree with her conception of what TNG should have been.

My problem with Measure of a Man is that, on its surface, it’s just absurd - as Dr. Pulaski already notes in an earlier episode, Starfleet has already declared that Data is alive and sentient. In legal terms, that question was already “asked and answered” before the series even began.

Our legal codes in the 20th and 21st century don’t allow for people with severe conflicts of interest to represent people against those conflicts voluntarily, let alone provide a mechanism to compel people to do so against their will. It’s absurd that Picard would be forced to defend him and that Riker would be forced to oppose him in a tribunal setting, let alone with zero notice, let alone in the middle of a mission.

Everything is so obviously manufactured from the beginning, the conflict so false, that there can only be one foregone conclusion, which pretty much negates any reason for even having the exercise.

A better way to have approached that idea might have been for the Enterprise to have discovered a colony with a group of Soong-type androids serving as slave labor, with Data driving the plot in questioning “If I am seen as a living being, why are they not?”

 

[jayembee]

Yup, that's my objection to the episode. The idea of the defense using the slavery issue for their argument was actually a good one on its face, but the question of Data's status should've been resolved almost immediately, for the reasons you state. Data is de facto a sentient, rights-bearing entity because Starfleet has consistently treated him as one. He's not just a "tool" as Maddox argued, because tools aren't sent to Starfleet Academy, given an officer's commission, or made an executive officer on a starship (let alone the fleet's flagship).

DS9 tried a similar thing with the episode "Dax", which was just as sloppy. It's been clear from various episodes that the Trill consider each symbiont/host pair to be a separate legal entity from the same symbiont paired with a different host.

 

[ScottRE]

Well if we're talking about Treks we prefer:

The original at all times is my go-to. My all time favorite series. I love all three seasons and all 6 films. Everything else pales. It is the most rewatchable series I've ever seen. And I rewatch a LOT of older television shows.

Enterprise: it has aged well and it has the rewatchability factor that makes Trek so long lived. Iffy start but better now that the sting of "that song" has worn off.

DS9: well, okay from season 4 on. The first 3 years are "meh." What the producers wanted it to be was not what audiences were looking for. As soon they let Avery Brooks shave his head, the show just got more immediate. Our leading man was dynamic now and the Klingon/Federation conflict was great. All of the characters grew and it was the only Star Trek series where the aliens were ALL interesting and enjoyable to watch. Season 7 wasn't the best, though.

Voyager: like DS9, it got more fun when 7 of 9 joined the series. The series was often excellent but most of the character were bland. The two parters were epic.

TNG: Watched it every week and was sad when it ended, but I don't miss it. For all the reasons I said a few posts back. Amazing cast though and the fact they're all close friends IRL really comes across on screen.

TAS: Soft spot for that series. Always fun, if sometimes weirdly childish.

Paramount +

For the most part, I let others enjoy them, they're not made for me. DISCO had a VERY negative and disturbing first season, an EXCELLENT second and then I got bored. I hoped going thousands of years into the future would be incredibly alien and new. It was just...the same thing only with faster tech. And every arc was a "Universe is ending only Discovery and save it but Burnham needs to cry every episode" sort of thing. I bailed at the start of year 4 and never looked back.

SNW: I had high hopes but, eh, word for word episode remakes, cartoon crossovers and full length musicals don't do it for me. "It's just like TOS!" Yes if every episode of TOS was "I. Mudd" and "The Way to Eden." And I don't care what anyone says, it's not Prime Timeline Star Trek.

Got 5 minutes into Lower Decks. Next.

98 seconds into Prodigy.

Picard: Season 1 - meh. Season 2: great start, amazing finale, pointless middle. Season 3: enjoyed it for the most part, but they were too wrapped up in callbacks and Easter Eggs, many of which had NOTHING to do with TNG (why quote James Horner's music when he didn't compose any TNG film scores?). Picard has a son. Snore. Someone is hunting the old crew: sounds great on paper but it wasn't anyone special - or even interesting. Changelings without Sisko involved? That's a sin. The cast was great fun to watch though and the resurrection of Data was perfect. Some good came of it. Best of the 3 seasons, but it's a low bar.

Say what you want about Berman Era Trek, he kept the franchise alive for 18 years. Those shows were longer, often had better characters and more varied stories. But then again, I was that audience. My Paramount + subscription lapsed last year. I'm not renewing. Enjoy the ride, but I'm happy with 1966 - 2005

 

[trevanian]

Because of the revolving door of writers, story editors and showrunners, not to mention the iron fist of Roddenberry's attorney who took on a creative and managerial position well beyond his actual attorney status, TNG changed its focus a lot in those first 2 and a half years.

The show didn't know what it was doing or wanted to be and if it were a network show, or one without the words "Star Trek" in the title, it may not have lasted the first 13 weeks. The back half of the first season was actually really gaining steam and was taking chances. Once the strike kneecapped them, they lost that momentum. The second season was also a mess, but had those bursts of great creativity.

Season 3 was still great and I feel the best of the Piller regime. After that, the music got boring and that's a huge factor for me. It stayed boring until Dennis McCarthy snuck in some action licks from Generation into DS9's "The Die Is Cast." After that, music got bold again. But TNG's soundtrack albums are mostly blah. It also didn't help that it was the height of the synth era. Ron Jones' work had lot of energy and melody, but he leaned way too hard on the synth. It's extremely 80's.

Sometimes I think the bombast of TIN MAN's score by Jay Chattaway (before the producers cut him off at the knees creatively) is the only really great TNG scoring, though Moore's work was often very effective.

I really like TNG s3 best as well, and I think it is because they didn't have time during most of that season to rewrite everything to death. If there was ever a show that proves the only Heinlein adage 'a committee is a life form with six or more legs and no brain' it would be Trek writer rooms (especially the current batch!)

 

[Nelson Au]

I watched Times Squared tonight. I was surprised, I had always avoided this episode because it never made sense. This time it made some sense. While IIRC, this story was supposed to be a multi-episode story arc, it ended up working out in my head this time.

I wonder why the Owon eggs were so unpalatable? I did find that teaser memorable.

So why I liked the episode this time is it plays like an episode of The Twilight Zone or more like an episode of The Outer Limits. The puzzle is what do they need to do to avoid destruction. Worf says it, they could be in a Mobius loop. And in a way, I saw it as the precursor to Cause and Effect. They are trapped and Picard determines the answer is to not do what his future self did. It really didn’t amount to much more then that it seems. At least this time, I felt like there was a resolution. There was a bit of metaphysical-ness going on with the future Picard and shuttle vanishing once they break out of the trap. I guess they needed a way close that plot. Not sure, what the energy bolts that strike Picard was about. Maybe to tell Picard the answer is in him, he needs to break the cycle.

 

[Harry-N]

I loved "Time Squared" from the first time I saw it way back in 1989 during first-run syndication. Time travel has always been a fascination of mine, so when THE NEXT GENERATION started dipping its toes in the subject, I was right there with them. With the idea of a person slipping six hours into the future, there would of necessity be two of them, and this dealt with that possibility in a fairly imaginative way. I liked that the six-hours-ahead Picard was disoriented and unable to really function.

Later on, when I found out that this was originally to have been a Q-caused event, I was less than impressed. For me, I think it works better as a sort-of unsolved mystery.

 

[Josh Steinberg]

I wonder why the Owon eggs were so unpalatable?

I think the joke was that they had gone bad in between the time Riker acquired them and when he used them, but as someone more familiar with replicators, wasn’t aware that eggs have a finite shelf life. At least, that’s how I always took it.

 

[Harry-N]

I think the joke was that they had gone bad in between the time Riker acquired them and when he used them

...and that Worf liked them just fine!

 

[jayembee]

I wonder why the Owon eggs were so unpalatable? I did find that teaser memorable.

Probably for the same reason no one in the Alien franchise seems to like cornbread.

 

[KPmusmag]

Two episodes of TOS that I distinctly remember watching with my parents in their original prime time run are By Any Other Name and Wink of an Eye. In a fit of nostalgia, I watched both this afternoon and I realized they are basically the same script, with details reworked.

Both have an "advanced" race that needs the Enterprise to save their race, and they must do it their way rather than ask for help from the Federation.
Both have a beautiful female interested in Kirk and an authoritarian male who must fight Kirk.
Both must incapacitate the Enterprise crew, either by transforming them into cubes or putting them in cold storage.
Etc.

After watching these 79 episodes uncountable times, I can't believe it took me more than 5 decades to realize that. And yet I still have great affection for both episodes.

 

[Nelson Au]

Two episodes of TOS that I distinctly remember watching with my parents in their original prime time run are By Any Other Name and Wink of an Eye. In a fit of nostalgia, I watched both this afternoon and I realized they are basically the same script, with details reworked.

Both have an "advanced" race that needs the Enterprise to save their race, and they must do it their way rather than ask for help from the Federation.
Both have a beautiful female interested in Kirk and an authoritarian male who must fight Kirk.
Both must incapacitate the Enterprise crew, either by transforming them into cubes or putting them in cold storage.
Etc.

After watching these 79 episodes uncountable times, I can't believe it took me more than 5 decades to realize that. And yet I still have great affection for both episodes.

That’s quite a find, Kevin!

I’ve always made a connection between Who Mourns of Adonais and The Apple, mainly because the Enterprise cannot escape and they had to use the phasers to defeat the powerful god figure. Though these two episodes have those similar elements, the rest of the episodes do not have as much in common. I always did like the theory of the ancient astronauts.

 

[Osato]

X-Men Producer Simon Kinberg Reportedly In Talks To Oversee Star Trek Feature Films

There are also new details on the upcoming origin movie.

trekmovie.com

 

[Nelson Au]

I think the joke was that they had gone bad in between the time Riker acquired them and when he used them, but as someone more familiar with replicators, wasn’t aware that eggs have a finite shelf life. At least, that’s how I always took it.

hmm, I always thought it was because Owon eggs just taste different from chicken eggs. But thats a very good theory I had not thought of! I can believe a 23rd century man may not know about refrigerating fresh food!

 

[Nelson Au]

I enjoyed Times Squared so much, I decided to carry on with A Matter of Honor. I always liked A Matter of Honor, but I just haven’t revisited it in a long time. Lots of good stuff. We get to see another Benzite. John Putch did a great job returning to play a different Benzite. It’s been so long, it was interesting to see the Klingon Captain as he reminded me very much of the Klingon Captain from The Chase. Yet, it’s not the same actor If my research is correct. This was also a great episode for introducing the audience to Gagh and it gives Frakes a chance to show Riker as a strong and clever character. We also get to see more about the Klingons in an early episode.

 

[Alex...]

Matt Freguson-

"I’m extremely happy to show my new official key art for the UK re-release of Star Trek III The Search For Spock. I’ve long been a champion for this film so to be able to work on art for it is just the best. Back in cinemas June 14th, in shiny new 4k…"

https://x.com/Cakes_Comics/status/1793298062695137394

 

[Josh Steinberg]

If it wasn’t limited to the UK, I’d go see it again.

 

[Neil S. Bulk]

If it wasn’t limited to the UK, I’d go see it again.

And you call yourself a fan...

 

[Josh Steinberg]

And you call yourself a fan...

If you’re volunteering to babysit for me I’ll be glad to hop across the pond.