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DVD's, Focusing on TV/DVD - How's the Future Looking


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#1 of 27 Jeff Willis

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Posted July 15 2013 - 01:21 PM

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Bill Hunt's "The Digital Bits" posted an interesting article about the topic. He linked an article by Dade Hayes at the Forbes site.

 

The full Digital Bits post about the topic (last 2 paragraphs in the post) is here

 

Here's the portion of Bill's post pertaining to this, including the link to Dade's article at Forbes:

 

 

Finally today, here’s something interesting and I think is well worth reading for home media consumers and industry professionals alike: A column by contributor Dade Hayes in Forbes lists Six Reasons Why DVDs Still Make Money – And Won’t Die Anytime Soon.  He’s exactly spot on right, and as most of you longtime readers know, we’ve been saying something similar for a very long time and for exactly the same reasons.  Digital might be where the industry things all the cool and growth potential is, but physical media isn’t going away for a good long while yet.  So it might be a good idea for you studio execs to understand that you need to keep making an effort at BD and DVD quality and features.  Don’t kill your Golden Goose before the next one is even full hatched!

 

 

^ Posted at Bill Hunt's site Mon 07/15 .

 

It's an interesting read.  As a dvd collector, I obviously agree but am interested to see the take of the HTF collector members.

 

I haven't entered the BR mkt yet but may at some point, depending on catalog availability of older tv shows.

 

Regarding physical-media, another reason that's an important one for me is that I can transport a fair # of dvd's to a family member's (or friend's) house and am not dependent on a 'net connection or other devices, ie Netflix, etc, to view specific shows. 

 

This is a considerable advantage for me, having a dvd collection on my shelf.

 

Another example is that I'm often at a location where I don't have a wifi connection away from home but I have the laptop with the dvd drive so I can watch my shows without requiring a 'net connection or downloading onto my laptop before leaving the house.

 


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#2 of 27 jcroy

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Posted July 15 2013 - 03:19 PM

At this point, I don't have much hope for tv on bluray.

 

One just has to see all the then-current tv shows from 2007-2011, which had a season or two released on bluray and then they discontinued releasing any further seasons.  Shows like:  NCIS: LA, Lie To Me, White Collar, Damages, Burn Notice, CSI, 24, The Unit, Scrubs, Nip/Tuck, Grey's Anatomy, Rescue Me, etc ...


Edited by jcroy, July 15 2013 - 04:19 PM.


#3 of 27 jcroy

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Posted July 15 2013 - 03:55 PM

I haven't entered the BR mkt yet but may at some point, depending on catalog availability of older tv shows.

 

The unavailability of bluray for numerous tv shows and less popular movies, is the main reason I still have a large dvd collection.

 

 

I ended up entering the bluray market, largely from happenstance.

 

About a year and a half ago, my old dvd player finally died.  When I went shopping for a new player, I noticed the bluray players were around $15-$20 more than the dvd-only players on the shelves.  I also noticed many movies I was interested in were around $5 or $7 each on bluray.  (A lot of movies from my youth, that I never purchased on dvd previously or the late-1990's/early-2000's dvd versions were crap).  So it was a no brainer to pick up a bluray player.

 

edit:  Over the entire 2000's decade, I only owned around two dozen or so dvds.  Mostly stuff like Star Trek movies, Cheech and Chong, Terminator, Star Wars, world war 2 documentaries, Beavis and Butthead, etc ...  It was a no brainer to replace my old late-1990's/early-2000's dvd versions of stuff like Terminator, Total Recall, Star Trek movies, Dune, etc ..., when the bluray versions were only $5 or $7 a pop.  (I paid more for the dvd versions back in the late 1990's and early 2000's).


Edited by jcroy, July 15 2013 - 04:11 PM.

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#4 of 27 jcroy

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Posted July 16 2013 - 09:52 AM

On the bright side, there are some tv shows which are regularly released on bluray.

 

If you're into various current tv shows with sci-fi, fantasy, zombies, vampires, etc ... type themes, there may be a good chance it will be released on bluray if it also has large hardcore audience.  (For example, a show like Game of Thrones or Fringe looks brilliant and stunning on bluray).

 

If you're into generic procedural type shows on network tv (such as CSI, Law & Order SVU, NCIS, etc ... type shows), then you will be out of luck when it comes to bluray.  Very few of these shows have been released on bluray.  (The only one I can think of offhand which has been consistently released on bluray so far, is the revived Hawaii Five-0).


Edited by jcroy, July 16 2013 - 09:57 AM.


#5 of 27 Gary OS

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Posted July 17 2013 - 02:40 PM

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I'm happy to say that DVDs have not dissipated to the degree I thought they would several years ago.  After peaking in 2008 the industry did seem to pull back a good bit, at least with the older material I'm interested in.  But to be honest I thought by now things would be much more dire than they are.  If vintage TV on DVD is still around and kicking in 2020 then color me absolutely shocked (but very happy). 

 

It's also nice to see that the non-physical media craze hasn't taken off quite as strongly as I thought it was going to a couple of years ago.  That's not to say it isn't strong, but at least it hasn't pushed discs completely out of the picture. 

 

 

Gary "I'm still not convinced BR is going to really make major inroads into b/w TV, but we'll see" O.


Edited by Gary OS, July 17 2013 - 04:41 PM.

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#6 of 27 Mark Y

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Posted July 18 2013 - 04:26 PM

I'm happy to say that DVDs have not dissipated to the degree I thought they would several years ago.  After peaking in 2008 the industry did seem to pull back a good bit, at least with the older material I'm interested in.  But to be honest I thought by now things would be much more dire than they are.  If vintage TV on DVD is still around and kicking in 2020 then color me absolutely shocked (but very happy). 

 

It's also nice to see that the non-physical media craze hasn't taken off quite as strongly as I thought it was going to a couple of years ago.  That's not to say it isn't strong, but at least it hasn't pushed discs completely out of the picture. 

 

 

Gary "I'm still not convinced BR is going to really make major inroads into b/w TV, but we'll see" O.

 

The skeptic in me still suspects a lot of the push towards downloads etc. is the brainchild of studio suits who have figured out a way to take physical copies of their copyrighted shows away from collectors and convince said collectors that this is a good thing, and they don't need them anyway -- actually, they don't have to take them away, the collectors (at least the young whipper-snappers who didn't grow up in a "physical media" environment) will willingly dump them!

 

Or not.


Edited by Mark Y, July 18 2013 - 04:29 PM.

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#7 of 27 Ethan Riley

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Posted July 18 2013 - 05:37 PM

Another good reason to go blu-only and say to hell with streaming:

 

http://gizmodo.com/y...dium=socialflow


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#8 of 27 Ron1973

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Posted July 18 2013 - 05:54 PM

Another good reason to go blu-only and say to hell with streaming:

 

http://gizmodo.com/y...dium=socialflow

I'll give the article an "A" simply for having Lawler and Kauffman's appearance on David Lettermen!!!!


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#9 of 27 tonysam

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Posted July 20 2013 - 08:49 PM

Owning something tangible is far better than having a download or renting Netflix.  The same is true with hard copy books; the e-reader experience is totally different, and you don't own the "books" you download.

 

I love my DVDs, and I love to collect.


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#10 of 27 Andrew Radke

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Posted July 20 2013 - 11:24 PM

I received a Blu-ray player 2 Christmases ago, yet still buy DVD's on a regular basis.  If I DO buy a Blu-ray disc, it's based on the following criteria:

 

1)  The movie was never released on DVD

2)  The movie was released on DVD but has been discontinued.

3)  The movie was released on DVD, but with an incorrect aspect ratio.

 

As for TV shows on Blu-ray, I've yet to purchase any as I find DVD to be sufficient enough.  I may change my tune with Shout's release of "Pee-wee's Playhouse" next year as they state the Blu-ray release will host a wealth of extras.  Depending on what those extras are, I may bite.


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#11 of 27 Harry-N

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Posted July 21 2013 - 04:19 AM

The only TV shows that I have on Blu-ray are THE PRISONER, STAR TREK: TOS, and will probably get into the STAR TREK: TNG releases after the prices calm down. I know that Santa Claus has already sprung for seasons 1,2,and 3. When the inevitable pre-Christmas sales hit, I'll probably pick up Season 4. THE PRISONER was always a special show for me, and the Blu-rays are as sharp and exciting as anything I've ever seen. And STAR TREK: TOS was a nice treat to upgrade to the remasters as well as the originals. If presented a steal of a price, I might spring for THE TWILIGHT ZONE on Blu, but given how seldom I play those on DVD, I'm not all that anxious.

 

Like others in this thread, I treaded lightly into Blu-ray - getting a player a few Christmases ago as a present. I've rewarded myself with a few repurchases of really favored movie titles, and without fail, they all look magnificent. But then I plop on a well-mastered DVD and get just about the same WOW-factor with the upscaling and large TV.

 

I'm sure that if a favored show like THE TIME TUNNEL came along in true Blu-ray, I'd spring for it in a minute. But for the most part, I'm happy with DVDs, and wish that some other favored shows would either finish their runs or get a release in the first place.

 

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#12 of 27 jcroy

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Posted July 21 2013 - 01:23 PM


As for TV shows on Blu-ray, I've yet to purchase any as I find DVD to be sufficient enough.

 

My main criteria for buying tv shows on bluray, is a combination of price, genre, and reviews of the picture quality.

 

If the bluray version is only a few dollars more than the dvd version, then the bluray version is a no-brainer for me.

 

For current sci-fi, fantasy or action type tv shows I am interested in, bluray is preferable.  For other genres, it'll be a toss up between bluray and dvd.

 

 

In regard to picture quality (PQ), current tv shows don't seem to have major PQ issues.  For older catalog tv shows and some then-current tv shows which had blurays released during 2006-2011, picture quality may be an issue.

 

For example, I didn't bother picking up the blurays of "Burn Notice" season 2 and "24" season 7, after reading poor reviews of the picture quality.  (I didn't bother picking up the season 8 of "24" bluray either, largely due to how lackluster the final season was and the sky high prices it was still commanding).  Other poor reviews of picture quality were the bluray releases of older catalog tv shows like Farscape, Highlander, etc ...  Not much point in buying something which doesn't look much better than a "lazy" upscaling of the dvd versions.

 

In contrast, I picked up the blurays of tv shows like Fringe, Nikita, Dollhouse, CSI (seasons 1 and 9), Firefly, etc ... after finding them for the same price as the dvd versions (or less).  Quite a few were $20 a pop or less.



#13 of 27 jcroy

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Posted July 21 2013 - 02:27 PM

 If presented a steal of a price, I might spring for THE TWILIGHT ZONE on Blu, but given how seldom I play those on DVD, I'm not all that anxious.

 

I can relate.

 

There are some tv shows where I'm not particularly anxious about replacing my dvd versions with the blurays, such as:  Stargate Atlantis, the revived Battlestar Galactica, Lost, Mad Men, X-Files, etc ...  This is largely due to not watching these particular shows that often.

 

The only way I would pull the trigger on buying such bluray versions, is if they end up in the bargain bins for $10 each (or less) and that I really really want to watch them again at that point in time.

 

 

For a lot of older catalog tv shows from the 1980's and 1970's, I suspect it will probably be a waste buying such stuff if it ever gets re-released on bluray.  (That is, unless they do an extensive restoration of the episodes where they rescan the original film at 4K and redo the special effects).



#14 of 27 Ron1973

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Posted July 21 2013 - 05:50 PM

I haven't taken the Blu-ray plunge yet. There just hasn't been anything to catch my eye to give me a reason to do so. I'm not much of a movie watcher but more of a classic TV lover. I know some classic TV has made it to Blu-ray but until The Beverly Hillbillies come to that format, count me out for now.  :lol:


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#15 of 27 TravisR

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Posted July 22 2013 - 04:09 AM

THE PRISONER was always a special show for me, and the Blu-rays are as sharp and exciting as anything I've ever seen.

Coincidentally enough, I finally got around to watching The Prisoner Blu-rays last week and was amazed by how great they looked. Anyone who already has a Blu-ray player and is a fan of The Prisoner will be very happy with that set.



#16 of 27 Traveling Matt

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Posted July 22 2013 - 07:20 AM

I'm not sure why this has moved in the direction of DVD vs. Blu-ray, but anyway...

 

As has been said, the advantage of discs is that you have a hard copy. This is the same argument for CDs vs. downloads. When that hard drive crashes or that cloud goes down, your trusty disc will still play. And that beats any matter of ease or convenience provided by soft copies.

 

Frankly, I think even Hunt's comment that discs will be around "for a good long while yet" is an understatement. Discs will almost always be around. If LPs ever fully go away, I might start to think otherwise.


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#17 of 27 BobO'Link

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Posted July 22 2013 - 08:39 AM

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That's an interesting article.  Here are some points made and my observations:

 


“In the future, you’re going to buy a digital copy and then get the disc as another way to view the content,” predicts Victor Elizalde, head of VIVA Pictures and a former studio exec.

Nope.  Spin it any way you wish but I'll be purchasing a physical disk and getting a worthless (to me) digital cloud copy.


The rollout of Blu-ray has been a bit of a New Coke experience for Hollywood but after the smoke and disappointment has cleared it remains a superior format attracting all of the top content producers. “Working closely with the DEG, we’ll be launching a consumer awareness campaign about the merits of Blu-ray and UltraViolet,” says Anchor Bay’s Clark. “A lot of consumers don’t fully understand it.”

Yes, BR is "superior" in quality for most releases (yes, there are cases where the BR release is actually inferior to that old DVD).  There are many benefits of DVD over BR that I'll not go into here.  From my observations it does fairly well mimic the "New Coke" experience for many consumers.  Contrary to Clark's comment comsumers *do* fully understand it.  They just don't buy it.  There's not enough value perceived with BR over DVD to cause most people to "upgrade", plus little Jr. can't play it on his portable player, the built-in car player, the computer, the "play room" player, and more.  Add to that the simple fact that there's still far more content available on DVD with many TV shows not receiving a BR release at all unless they were produced in a WS format.  This is especially true of older TV content.  Throw in that renting a BR typically costs more than a DVD and you have people who look at BR as just another way to get into their pocket a bit deeper.

 

All in all his #6 reason is pretty much all you need:  "For a lot of Americans, it ain’t broke".  I think that especially holds true in the TVonDVD arena.  While HDTV sets have infiltrated quite rapidly, my experiences in visiting people who own them is they haven't a clue how to properly set them up and still don't know a bad image from a good one.  For those folks a $5-$10 price difference in that season set of their latest favorite TV program is too large to expect them to purchase the BR copy over the DVD *if* they make such a purchase at all.  Most of the people I know are content to rent or stream, especially with TV content.  But it's been that way all my life.  I've only known a handful of collectors of media (Books, Records, CD, DVD) over the years with the majority of people I've known being fully content to just take what's provided in what ever manner that might be - Library, TV, Radio, Theater, rental, etc.

 

As far as the "Future of TVon DVD..." The people in charge of deciding what the American Public will purchase need to closely look at what people like *us* are purchasing and, perhaps more importantly, wanting to purchase.  Most homes own only a few TV seasons and many don't want, or care, to own an entire series of most programs.  Households like mine (and likely yours) with dozens of completed series and hundreds of seasons are rare.  Sales figures have proven over and over that there are only a precious few series that garner enough general interest for the majority of purchasers to consider a full series.  Most, if not all, of those have seen release and are now starting to receive BR "upgrades". 

 

The future *could* be very bright but *only* if all parties involved in TVonDVD releases would face reality and realize that no one is going to "get fabulously rich" on most DVD releases, understand that it's mostly a niche market, and that you can no longer expect to sell hundreds of thousands of copies of a TV season (unless it's one of the handful of Golden Egg Goose programs or one of those few unreleased series people constantly ask for).  Some have seemingly understood this and have moved much of their TVonDVD output to MOD.  I'm not a fan of that trend and feel it's a mistake.  I feel that many of the series I've seen wind up as MOD releases could have been fairly good sellers but the "marketing guys" don't seem to understand what people *really* want to see released and how they want it presented.  Or it could simply be a matter of the expected return isn't high enough to satisfy "the board."  In either event I'm sure there are distributors out there that wouldn't mind the lower numbers and would happily sell pressed copies of these titles at lower prices than are being charged for MODs.


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#18 of 27 Gary OS

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Posted July 22 2013 - 08:46 AM

Absolutely fantastic post, Howie!!!  Every portion of your post gets a big thumbs up from me.  We see all the elements of this discussion exactly the same way.

 

 

Gary " :thumbs-up-smiley: " O.


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#19 of 27 Traveling Matt

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Posted July 22 2013 - 09:10 AM

I'm not sure why this has moved in the direction of DVD vs. Blu-ray, but anyway...

 

As has been said, the advantage of discs is that you have a hard copy. This is the same argument for CDs vs. downloads. When that hard drive crashes or that cloud goes down, your trusty disc will still play. And that beats any matter of ease or convenience provided by soft copies.

 

Frankly, I think even Hunt's comment that discs will be around "for a good long while yet" is an understatement. Discs will almost always be around. If LPs ever fully go away, I might start to think otherwise.

 

Vinyl records are making a comeback



#20 of 27 TravisR

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Posted July 22 2013 - 09:11 AM

I agree with Bob's post but to delve a little deeper into a point he made:

Yes, BR is "superior" in quality for most releases (yes, there are cases where the BR release is actually inferior to that old DVD).

That's true but the number of instances of that can literally be counted on one hand. That's not to say that every Blu-ray is a homerun or worth buying but the number of Blu-rays that don't best the DVD is nearly non-existent.


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