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2001: A Space Odyssey..bits and pieces.


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#21 of 68 Francois Caron

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Posted April 25 2006 - 04:55 AM

Interesting concept, Man losing control of his tools. What's ironic is that to watch the flash film, I stopped listening to This Week In Tech for a few minutes, a show about people losing control of their computers. Posted Image

#22 of 68 Lew Crippen

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Posted April 26 2006 - 12:52 AM

Thanks for the link Dan.
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#23 of 68 Dan Keliikoa

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Posted April 26 2006 - 01:17 AM

You are welcome, but Mr Flemming provided the link originally. Posted Image Isn't it cool?
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#24 of 68 MarcoBiscotti

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Posted April 26 2006 - 01:48 AM

That flash film was great.

#25 of 68 Flemming.K

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Posted April 26 2006 - 04:02 AM

Hi! Glad you all seem to like it Posted Image

I really think I "nailed" it beforehand, but efter seeing the flash, I believe some things are better explained in it. I guess I buy that for a dollar Posted Image
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#26 of 68 JediFonger

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Posted April 26 2006 - 04:13 AM

if you read the most recent edition's forward by Arthur C. Clarke, the story of 2001 was developed by both Kubrick and Clarke. so, the novel IS authoritative in every sense of the word. although Clarke doesn't say so explicitly, both the movie and book should be enjoyed to fully capture the 2001 experience. =). 2001 doesn't work (imho) as a standalone movie. i'm not one of those Gen X/Y, etc. w/ short attention span, in fact, i like silent films more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JeremyErwin
The novel is not authoritative...


#27 of 68 JeremyErwin

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Posted April 26 2006 - 05:40 AM

the novel is the novel, and the film is the film. To argue that either one is necessary to understand the other cheapens both.

#28 of 68 Jack Briggs

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Posted April 26 2006 - 07:36 AM

Agreed.

#29 of 68 Chris Lynch

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Posted April 26 2006 - 10:33 AM

Quote:
But that still doesn't explain WHY they had him rotate the pod in the first place. Which is something I've always wondered myself.

And the answer is: Because Kubrick needed Hal to see their lips. Simple as that.

Actually, I always assumed that Dave asked HAL to rotate the pod just to test HAL, i.e. to check his response to the order when Dave knew HAL could hear him, and then follow that with the test when he turned off the sound transmission.

Besides, I would think that if Kubrick needed HAL to see their lips, he could've put HAL's "eyeball" anywhere in the room to make that happen

#30 of 68 andrew markworthy

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Posted April 26 2006 - 08:02 PM

Quote:
Also, is Dave aging in a matter of minutes, or is he aging in real time?

Neither and both. Posted Image Essentially, the final sequence represents Dave learning the wisdom of the aliens. This seems like a matter of moment for the aliens but is a lifetime for human beings. The broken glass section is symbolic of the marriage of human and alien minds (think of the jewish wedding ceremony) and from this union comes the starchild. It's useful to remember that in the original version of the script, the starchild doesn't just gaze at the Earth but blows up the various satellite weapons (remember the bone that jump cuts into the spaceship at the start of the film? - that spaceship is meant to be some kind of weapon) that threaten humanity. However, Kubrick scrapped the idea because he thought it would remind people too much of his previous film Dr Strangelove.

In a less metaphysical frame of mind, you can explain the ageing in minutes as the effects of relativity playing themselves out. However, I get a headache trying to explain it.

#31 of 68 Ricardo C

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Posted April 26 2006 - 10:21 PM

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2001 doesn't work (imho) as a standalone movie.

I enjoy the novel (and its sequels), but I think they should only be read after taking in the film. 2010 and the rest diminish the beauty of the film's third act by explaining and trivializing too many things the film made mysterious and majestic.
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#32 of 68 Holadem

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Posted April 27 2006 - 01:09 AM

Quote:
remember the bone that jump cuts into the spaceship at the start of the film?

It's a match cut. An extremely common error.

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#33 of 68 Dan Keliikoa

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Posted April 27 2006 - 01:16 AM

Great responses everyone Posted Image
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#34 of 68 Ike

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Posted April 27 2006 - 07:58 AM

I'm sure that at some point-be it while writing the scene, or rehearsing the scene, or while the mechanics for the pods to spin were being made-the thought was had that they could simply have the pods facing forwards when the two enter and save a lot of money and time. That the film goes out of its way to include the scene should not be looked at as a flaw. Without looking at the scene again, I suspect the point might be along a similar vein to the anti-gravity toilet, showing the fearless crew either unwilling or unable to walk the few steps to the front of the pod, so they instead have to rely on HAL to slowly spin the pods around. That seems to be the major point of the scene-how slow the movement of the pods is. A seemingly pointless action that takes up a lot of time, which encapsulates a lot of Kubrick's version of the future.

#35 of 68 rich_d

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Posted April 29 2006 - 12:26 AM

I think a highlight of 2001 is that there are different valid ways of interpreting the film. Personally, I'm not wedded to any particular 'this is it' kind of viewpoint.

I like the idea that the monoliths are more than just tests of accomplishment as well as:

- beacons that report progress back to their maker

- passing of intelligence

The last point being the possibility that intelligence of man didn't evolve over millions of years but received as a 'booster shot' (for lack of better words) from a more advanced civilization.

Using a bone as a weapon occurs after the apes touch the monolith.

I also like the idea that the ape age monolith was not the only monolith on Earth. I fancy the idea that one jump started the Renaissance. After all, that was a remarkable period of human creativity and production. Further, was this the last report back from the Planet Earth (itself) to the monolith's maker? After all, the guest quarters are done in Louis the 15th pattern (or whatever Louis that was). Was that done to make the guest feel at home or was the maker's style reflected on Earth though our encounter with a monolith?

Fun stuff.

#36 of 68 JeremyErwin

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Posted April 29 2006 - 01:15 AM

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After all, the guest quarters are done in Louis the 15th pattern (or whatever Louis that was).

Louis Seize (at least according to this article)

(as much as I can figure out, XIII is renaissance, XIV is baroque, XV is rococo, and XVI is neoclassical.) see Wikipedia:Louis for more details.

Perhaps it was in fashion in 1968.

#37 of 68 JeremyErwin

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Posted April 29 2006 - 02:11 AM

I found this Claudia Zimny essay on the significance of 2001's Louis Seize Room For instance,
Quote:
The Louis-seize room is chiefly regarded as the most mysterious and puzzling sequence of 2001. Its symbolic importance is often stressed but hardly ever analyzed beyond mentioning the mere word. To Nelson, it represents the "ephemeral nature" of Bowman's memory [Nelson 177]; Geduld analogously calls it "a prototype of past world history in alien territory." [Geduld 61f] Neither of them goes into detail on why Kubrick chose this interior. Nelson [181] and Geduld [61f] accept the explanation Clarke gives in the novel: the room is a set provided by Bowman's (extraterrestrial?) hosts. They have taken their inspiration from a TV film on earth; the signals of the broadcasting station were sucked in by the monolith on the moon and were sent to Jupiter along with the radio signal to prepare Bowman's welcome. [Clarke a) chapter 44; 210-217]

Clarke's explanation is fathomable but reduces the room to a mere theater-like decoration and ignores the historical and symbolical importance of the Louis-seize style. Louis XVI. was the last King of the Ancien régime (Fr. "old, archaic ruling system"), the absolutist form of rule of France, which found a bloody ending in the French Revolution. The end of absolutism was closely linked to the American War of Independence against England, in which France took part on the American side. The new ideas of human and civil rights that came back to France this way proved fatal to the French monarchy. Attempts at reform made by Louis' ministers could not gain acceptance with clergy and nobility. In 1793, at the height of the French Revolution, he was publicly guillotined after an attempt to flee. The Louis-seize Epoch was an era of deep-rooted change, in which archaic power structures, based on (absolutist) Gewalt, were broken up as violently.

And, of course, had the room been Louis Quinze, those connections could not have been made.

#38 of 68 george kaplan

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Posted April 29 2006 - 02:25 AM

I always thought it would have been better as Louis De Palma, with tiny furniture, that Bowman had clearly outgrown. Posted Image
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#39 of 68 Dick

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Posted April 30 2006 - 05:06 AM

It's a match cut. An extremely common error.

Not a perfect match cut, either. The positioning of the bone is about 45 degrees off from the positioning of the warhead. With a super 8mm print I owned of this film, I cut 4-5 frames so that the transition was smoother. I know, Kubrick was a perfectionist and what is in the film is exactly what he intended, but for me, a more aligned transition worked better. Playing God? I don't know. Worked better for me.

#40 of 68 Holadem

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Posted April 30 2006 - 05:12 AM

Agreed. It's a nitpick, but perfectionism is ALL about nitpicks. And for the work of such a vaunted perfectionist, that cut could have been much better. But I am sure the "Kubrick can do no wrong" crowd will find a way to rationalize it Posted Image

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