SVS PB2-Plus Test and Review - Long (2 Viewers)

[terence]

Ed you have done it again!! Excellent review! Thank you for your time and detailed review on another great product from SVS. Now if you will excuse me, i have to go an sell a kidney something so i can buy a PB2+!

 

[Edward J M]

I've had some fairly decent subs in my system; Paradigm Servo 15, 20-39cs, Paradigm PW2200, Von Schweikert S/3 and the PB2 outperforms them in all categories. I thought the S/3 was very quick and tight with no overhang yet the PB2 is its equal in this department.

Steve:

I have tried (in vain) to determine which objective design criteria affect the subjective impression that a subwoofer is "tight", "fast", or "musical". It's not as easy at it might first appear.

Once might be tempted to say transient response and group delay are the two primary criteria responsible for these subjective impressions, but I have found it's not that simple.

For example, group delay cannot be reliably detected under about 30 ms and only becomes significant in a vented enclosure at/near the near-subsonic tune point. In a properly designed vented alignment, GD can't make an audible difference on how a kick drum or bass guitar sounds.

Regarding transient response, here's a quote from a Secrets of Home Theater and High Fidelity article:

"I know that "fast" bass is an oxymoron, and if you really care about transient response, assuming a competent subwoofer design, you’re best off spending your energy addressing room interaction to obtain the flattest frequency response, and the transient response will follow. However, if you really want to nitpic, the fact is that aside from subwoofers that have peaky frequency responses themselves, and are doomed from the beginning, the greatest limitation of transient response is usually at the low-frequency limit of the subwoofer (and if it’s low enough so that you can’t hear it, who cares) and at the high-frequency limit, imposed by the low-pass crossover slope."

Here's a quote from Tom V:

"The 'musicality' of a subwoofer is dominated by several factors non related to the subwoofer at all (or related incidentally---like a built in XO). The room, the positions of the listening position and position of the subwoofer, the lowpass and highpass XOs used for both the subwoofer and the rest of the speakers, the phasing of the subwoofer relative to the rest of the speakers, and the calibration of the subwoofer.

The primary factor not related to the listening room or the setup method is simple user preference. The deepest bass has the longest soundwaves...the longer the soundwaves, the more of a bass *decay* the room will have. Deep bass takes time to decay, that is natural and inherent to the beast. Some folks mistake the longer decay for "slow" bass...when in fact, it is actually a more faithful reproduction of the source material.

Then there is an issue of harmonics. Much of the pitch of the musical bass/drum will be determined by the number and amplitude of the harmonics of the fundamentals note played. To some ears, if those harmonics are emphasized...even by a very small amount...the *pitch* of the bass guitar is made more obvious. The pacing of the bass line(s) become easier to follow...and folks can feel like that aids in the musical nature of the source playback.

So in the end, the most accurate audio reproduction may not be what someone prefers."

Tom is clearly onto something here, as I personally prefer sound of the PB2+ with all ports open, probably because of the slight emphasis this tune provides in the 25-50 Hz region, possibly making harmonics easier to follow to my ear. However, it could be argued that this tune is technically less "accurate" than the tune with a port plugged, which in comparison displays a slightly flatter response in this region.

Whatever the reason, in the end, to my ears (and to yours), the PB2+ kicks ass on music and that's all that really matters.

Regards,

Ed

 

[Edward J M]

Now if you will excuse me, i have to go an sell a kidney something so i can buy a PB2+!

Mike/terence: It's comments like yours' that made the long hours that went into this review worth it. IMO, we owe it to each other as a collective forum/community to provide detailed assessments of gear we own (especially in this price range), so that others can make informed purchase decisions.

For example, I bought my Denon AVR-3803 and DVD-2900 largely based on what I read in the forums from experienced owners.

Honestly, if someone plunks down $1,250 based on my review of the PB2+, and afterward is totally thrilled and considers it money very well spent, I would be both honored and flattered.

Regards,

Ed

 

[Arnold_R]

Incredible review Ed!!!!!

Arnold

 

[Ernest Yee]

scottavsfan: Sometimes I hate reading reviews like yours. I am a happy owner of 2 PC+2039s. I bought the second one because I read so many people having 2 the wondering what 2 would be like was killing me.

Well Scott, if you're still leaning that way - you can sell one of your PC+s to me! And I'm sure the other one will fly just as quickly. Then you'd have more than enough to get that PB2+!

 

[John Kotches]

Ron,

My theater is going way too slowly... and as with a typical software project never delivers on time

I lost a good deal of time in March/April/May because of some quite intense testing at the real job which was meaning very long weeks with little spare time.

I close on the house in Chicago early next week, and I think things will be in very high gear once that's done.

Regards,

 

[Scott MacKay]

Ed,

Thanks for costing me $1200+ with that great review. I currently have 20-39pc+ and till now have been very happy. After reading your review, I once again have the fever to upgrade. Just when I almost had enough money for a new HK 525 receiver. Well maybe I can put that purchase off for a few more months and get in line for a PB2.

On a similar note, doe anyone know about how long the wait for the PB2 is?

Scott

 

[Edward J M]

Jerry said:

Thanks for costing me $1200+ with that great review. On a similar note, does anyone know about how long the wait for the PB2 is?

The PB2+ is a significant upgrade from the already stellar 20-39PC+. In my HT room, the extra 5-6 dB increase in maximum output (4-5 dB in the 20 Hz tune) ups the bass levels from pretty stunning to mind-blowing.

While it's best to check with Ron, I think they are getting caught up with pre-orders and the wait for a new order should be around 2 weeks. Hopefully Ron will check in and give you a firm answer on that. The enclosure is very high tech and the enclosure builder and SVS are being very picky about the finished product; hence the current slight delay compared to SVS' usual shipping in 2-3 business days.

Regards,

Ed

 

[SVS-Ron]

Scott,

We're conservatively estimating 3-4 weeks for new orders. Far longer than we'd hoped at this stage but we're working hard to eliminate this lag.

Ron

 

[Andre D]

Hey Edward, are you located anywhere near Brooklyn?

 

[Edward J M]

Hey Edward, are you located anywhere near Brooklyn?

No, I'm quite a bit farther north, sorry.

Regards,

Ed

 

[Andre D]

I'm sorry too. I want to hear (or feel) one of those subs so badly. I know if I order one for a trial period I will end up keeping it.

 

[SVS-Ron]

Andre,

If you hear (or feel) one, you will only end up ordering it.

;^)

Ron

 

[Andre D]

If you hear (or feel) one, you will only end up ordering it.

Yeah, you're probably right. Ever since I've been visiting this forum I've been hearing good things about SVS. I swore to myself that I wasn't going to purchase anymore electronics until I finally purchase my own home, but it's easier said than done. It's like trying to stick to a diet.

 

[Edward J M]

I'm sorry too. I want to hear (or feel) one of those subs so badly. I know if I order one for a trial period I will end up keeping it.

If I were a bettin' man.......

Andre, while the objective numbers in my review certainly speak volumes (sorry), subjectively the PB2+ owns the room at high volumes. It hits like a friggin' freight train while still staying clean and tight.

The house can wait....live a little.

Regards,

Ed

 

[Haris Ellahi]

Will it be okay to place the SVS PB2-Plus at the back of the room in one of the corners?

 

[Edward J M]

Will it be okay to place the SVS PB2-Plus at the back of the room in one of the corners?

As long as you are low passing the bass at 80 Hz, I think you could place the sub just about anywhere in the room and be OK, since low bass is pretty much non-directional.

Just make sure to give the vents about 6" breathing room in the back.

I think some people experience problems with sub localization because the sub in question generates high levels of THD, and the 2nd and 3rd order harmonics are audible and easily localized.

Regards,

Ed

 

[Manuel Delaflor]

Edward

Most excellent review, thanks for the good work. And also Very Good explanation on the "fast bast" issue. It is amazing how this industry is still full of myths.

 

[Andre D]

The house can wait....live a little.

I guess you're right Edward. It doesn't make any sense depriving myself like this.

 

[Parker Clack]

Andre:

I agree with Edward. Go for the sub and buy your house with a big grin on your face.

Once you get into a house it is a money pit and all your free money goes to things like painting, landscaping and on and on.

Pull the trigger on the sub. You are going to be totally elated with it.

Parker