*** Official "MINORITY REPORT" Discussion Thread (1 Viewer)

[Ernest Rister]

Busted!
Here's a snippet from Scott Frank's screenplay of Minority Report, Revised May 16th, 2001, pgs. 143-144
INT. PRECRIME ANALYTICAL ROOM - NIGHT
As Jad listens a moment, then hits a switch and now we hear
the conversation between Burgess and Anderton...
ANDERTON (PHONE)
All these years Agatha's had the
truth locked inside of her -- the
Minority Report. All these years
she's the only one who knew what
really happened...
INT. PRECRIME TEMPLE - NIGHT
As Agatha lies there, staring upward.
ANDERTON (V.O.)
... until last week when she took
my hand and showed me the image of
a drowning woman... an image that
would eventually lead me back to
you.
---------
If the writer of the film agrees with me that Agatha's vision was a Minority Report, I consider that damned good company.

 

[Robert Anthony]

I haven't watched the movie in a little bit, but this is fun anyway.
Does that line you just quoted from Frank's screenplay actually appear in the movie? If it does not, it really has no more validity than a deleted scene. If it does--then I'm cornholed, but hey.. if it's not in the movie, it might be because Frank realized it wasn't really a minority report, and deleted the line accordingly
anyone else smell any methane? Oh yeah, that's just me, talking out of my ass
I interpreted it as NOT a minority report, only because they DID report on the patsys murder attempt. That was ONE report. all three reports lined up, Pre-Crime went out and stopped it. Then Angela reported on the SECOND murder attempt on the same woman in the same place by the (apparently) the same guy. THIS murder attempt was written off as an echo of Angelas, and nothing was done.
COMPLETELY separate, different report.
Now this is where it gets shady: Since the other two didn't even get a vision of this second murder attempt at ALL, and it's a completely different report (hence the pre-crime unit writing it off as an echo instead of a continuation of the first vision) is that really a minority report?
I think it isn't, because by the dialog in the movie, a minority report is when one of the pre-cogs has a slightly different interpretation than the other two. In this case, the other two don't have a premonition at all. Just Agatha.
Now *I'm* splitting hairs
Besides, what does Scott Frank know? Frigging hack...

God bless the internet.

 

[Ernest Rister]

Here's the full ending of Minority Report based on the third revision dated 5/16/2001...it answers many questions. The dialogue is a bit more fleshed out than the final version we see in the film, which ran long. The dialogue is also a bit different in places because of improvisation, coverage, PG-13 ratings, and subplots that didn't pan out (like a PreCrime officer on the sauce after the Anderton arrest) but basically, this is what Spielberg was working with:

---------------

INT. WILLARD BALLROOM - NIGHT

A VIDEO PRESENTATION of the history of Precrime, and LAMAR
BURGESS. We hear music, see different shots of Burgess at
his Rehab-Prison, we hear about its fabulous success rate.
The video ends to GREAT APPLAUSE.

ANNOUNCER
Ladies and gentlemen, Lamar
Burgess, Director of the new,
national Precrime.

Applause. Then the room falls silent as Burgess' STAFF
presents him with an IVORY BOX. He opens it, looks at his
secretary who smiles.

SECRETARY
Congratulations, sir.

BURGESS
My God...

He holds up a beautiful ivory-handled ANTIQUE REVOLVER and
the crowd ooohs and ahhhs.

BURGESS
How did you get this?

SECRETARY
I padded your expense account for
the last six months.

LAUGHTER. But as he stares at the gun, moved almost to
tears, the room grows silent. He looks up.

BURGESS
Revolvers like this one were given
to Generals at the end of the Civil
War by their troops. The cylinders
were loaded with six gold-plated
bullets to symbolize the end of the
destruction and death that had
ripped the country apart for six
years.

He opens the gun and shows them the six GOLD BULLETS. We
pick out LARA in an evening gown at the back of the room,
watching, her eyes fixed on Burgess.

BURGESS
With Precrime going national, maybe
we can all look forward to a time
when none of us have to discharge
another firearm ever again.

Everyone APPLAUDS. Burgess' secretary gets a phone call and
ducks her head so that she can hear...

BURGESS
I think people forget that, for all
the talk about the Precogs,
Precrime is only as good as the men
and women who support them...

INT. PRECRIME ANALYTICAL ROOM - NIGHT

As Anderton's old team watches... silent.

BURGESS (TV)
I'm grateful to you for all that
you've done to make this happen.
And I assure you that I won't
forget you when bonus time comes
around!

Knott raises the bottle.

KNOTT
Now that's cool.

INT. WILLARD BALLROOM - NIGHT

As Burgess smiles now...

BURGESS
Now enjoy yourselves. That's an
order!

LARA watches as Burgess steps off the stage and his Secretary
meets him. He's immediately surrounded by WELL-WISHERS and
AUTOGRAPH SEEKERS.

SECRETARY
You have an emergency call on your
private line.

BURGESS
Thank you.
(into his phone)
This is Burgess.

ANDERTON (PHONE)
Hello, Lamar.

Burgess goes instantly pale as his wife comes up and kisses
him on the cheek.

BURGESS
John --

ANDERTON (PHONE)
I just wanted to congratulate you.
You did it. You've created a world
without murder. So what if you had
to kill someone to do it.

INT. PRECRIME ANALYTICAL ROOM - NIGHT

As Jad gets a phone call...

JAD
A-room. Jad.

INT. BALLROOM - NIGHT

Burgess smiles at his unaware wife, then starts walking to
the side doors, trying to get away from the crowd, many of
whom now thrust PRECRIME BASEBALL HATS at him to sign. He
moves past Lara, on her phone, who turns away...

LARA
(to Jad)
John needs a favor...

INT. PRECRIME ANALYTICAL ROOM - NIGHT

As Jad listens a moment, then hits a switch and now we hear
the conversation between Burgess and Anderton...

ANDERTON (PHONE)
All these years Agatha's had the
truth locked inside of her -- the
Minority Report. All these years
she's the only one who knew what
really happened...

INT. PRECRIME TEMPLE - NIGHT

As Agatha lies there, staring upward.

ANDERTON (V.O.)
... until last week when she took
my hand and showed me the image of
a drowning woman... an image that
would eventually lead me back to
you.

CLOSE ON BURGESS

A forced smile, nodding to this person and that.

BURGESS
I don't know what you're talking
about, John.

CLOSE ON THE BACK OF ANDERTON

We don't know where he is yet...

ANDERTON (PHONE)
I'm talking about Anne Lively.
Just a junkie who had a kid once
and had to give her up.

INT. BALLROOM - NIGHT

As Burgess smiles tightly at people, mouths "excuse me" as he tries to make for the damn door, but can't seem to get away from the crowd of well-wishers including the Attorney General who reluctantly shakes his hand...

ANDERTON (PHONE)
But, surprise, this junkie cleaned
herself up.

INT. PRECOG TANK - AGATHA - NIGHT

As Agatha opens her eyes. We begin moving into ONE OF
THEM...

ANDERTON (V.O.)
And she wanted the kid back.

AND NOW WE SEE IN HER EYE:

The screaming face of Anne Lively.

ANDERTON (V.O.)
She wanted Agatha...

INT. PRECRIME ANALYTICAL ROOM - NIGHT

As Jad sees the image on the screen, starts patching it in.

ANDERTON (V.O.)
But you and Hineman had already
turned the girl into something
else: A Precog.

INT. PRECOG TEMPLE - NIGHT

As Wally looks up at the image on the screen. ANNE LIVELY
DROWNING...

JAD (PHONE)
Wally? You getting this?

WALLY
Uh-huh...

INT. BALLROOM - NIGHT

As Burgess, surrounded by AUTOGRAPH SEEKERS, is forced to
stop and sign their PRECRIME HATS... while Anderton
continues.

ANDERTON (PHONE)
And without her, there was no
Precrime. She's always been the
strongest of the three. And you
know that without Agatha, you had
nothing. Without her, you wouldn't
be where you are now, standing
there signing autographs...

Boom. Burgess stops cold, starts looking around the room.
Knows Anderton is somewhere nearby.

INT. PRECOG TEMPLE - NIGHT

As Wally studies the IMAGE OF ANNE LIVELY DROWNING plays over and over.

WALLY
It's a single stream, from the
female only, with no time or
incident data.

JAD (PHONE)
Meaning?

WALLY
Meaning whatever this is, it ain't
the future.
(watches the drowning)
It already happened.

INT. HOTEL BALLROOM - NIGHT

As the screen starts to show the SAME VISION and people
react. Burgess, at the back of the room sees it, too.

ANDERTON (PHONE)
So now you had to get rid of Anne
Lively, you had to find a way to
shut her up... which presented a
problem. How can you murder her
without the precogs seeing it?
Simple: you use the system against
her.

Burgess quickly goes through a swinging door into...

A CORRIDOR

Where he looks up and down the corridor for Anderton.

ANDERTON (PHONE)
You hired someone to kill her for
you, knowing full well the precogs
would see that murder.

Burgess turns back, looks through a CIRCLE OF GLASS in the
swinging door at...

THE BALLROOM SCREEN - A SERIES OF GRAINY IMAGES

A FIGURE in a black overcoat pulls on a mask...

ANDERTON (PHONE)
You lured Anne Lively out to the
lake with the promise of doing the
right thing, reuniting her with her
daughter...

And now we see Anne Lively standing by the side of A LAKE,
her hair whipping in the wind. As THE FIGURE APPROACHES...

ANNE
Mr. Burgess?

INT. PRECOG TEMPLE - NIGHT

As the IMAGE PLAYS OUT IN AGATHA'S EYE...

AGATHA
Run...

INT. HOTEL BALLROOM - ON THE SCREEN - NIGHT

As Anne Lively looks up, sees the source of the wind is THE
PRECRIME HOVERSHIP. The figure takes off running...

ANDERTON (PHONE)
You even made the arrest
yourself...

And now we see a series of images, Lamar Burgess standing
there in a WHITE COAT getting off the hovership as the KILLER IS BROUGHT DOWN, THE MASK RIPPED OFF. We see the RED LINES AROUND THE EYES. We see it's the JOHN DOE from Containment.

HIS FACE SHOVED INTO THE MUD...

THE CROWD

Stands there stunned by what they're watching.

INT. HOTEL KITCHEN - NIGHT

As we move through the chaos of fifty SERVERS, COOKS, and
DISHWASHERS, we find Anderton for the first time, standing in a corner, in a hooded sweatshirt, his back to us...

ANDERTON
And then, when you were all
alone...

INT. THE CORRIDOR - BURGESS - NIGHT

Staring through the glass at the BALLROOM SCREEN as we see
the younger Burgess facing Anne Lively beside the lake, as
the HOVERSHIP LIFTS OFF IN THE B.G.

ANNE
Where's my daughter?

On screen, the younger Burgess takes off the WHITE OVERCOAT.

He pulls his arm from the coat and we see that the inside is
BLACK; that the coat is REVERSIBLE.

ANDERTON (PHONE)
You killed her yourself in the same
way the Precogs predicted your John
Doe would kill her. You made the
real murder look like an echo,
knowing the tech would ignore it.

INT. PRECOG TEMPLE - NIGHT

As the image plays out in Agatha's eye... Anne Lively backing away...

ANDERTON (V.O.)
You fooled the other two precogs,
but not Agatha.

And now inside her eye, we see the image of BURGESS pulling
on the same MASK that John Doe wore...

ANDERTON (V.O.)
She was going to see the murder of
her own mother no matter what state
you did it in, or how you tired to
hide it.

INT. PRECOG TEMPLE - NIGHT

As Agatha tries to sit up...

AGATHA
Run!

INT. HOTEL BALLROOM - SCREEN - NIGHT

The crowd is SILENT as they watch A SERIES OF FAST IMAGES:
Anne Lively stumbles. Burgess grabbing her... Anne's face
hitting the water... Burgess shoving her head under and
holding it down...

ON BURGESS

Through the glass window, watching himself murder this woman.

INT. PRECOG TEMPLE - IMAGE IN AGATHA'S EYE

As Anne Lively dies under the water, her arm floating across
her chest, beckoning us to her as she floats away. Agatha
raises her own arm now...

AGATHA
Mama...

INT. CORRIDOR - NIGHT

As Burgess turns away from the window and leans against the
wall. Sweating. Ashen faced.

INT. HOTEL KITCHEN - NIGHT

Anderton turns around, so that we see the two different
colored eyes peering out...

ANDERTON
You still there, Lamar?

INT. CORRIDOR - NIGHT

Burgess looks down for a moment, then holds up his hand. And we see that he STILL HOLDS THE REVOLVER.

INT. PRECOG TANK - NIGHT

As now ALL THREE PRECOGS float to the surface.

MALE FACE
Murderer.

CUT TO:

A RED BALL

Screaming at us...

INT. PRECRIME ANALYTICAL ROOM - NIGHT

As an ALARM SOUNDS and Wally appears on screen...

WALLY
We got a Red Ball!

INT. PRECOG TANK - NIGHT

As Agatha rises to the surface...

AGATHA
Think about the lives that little
girl saved.

INT. CORRIDOR - NIGHT

As Burgess collects himself, starts walking...

BURGESS
Think about the lives that little
girl saved.

He peers into a room, looking for Anderton.

BURGESS
Think about all the lives she will
save?

INT. HOTEL KITCHEN - NIGHT

As Anderton moves through the steamy room...

BURGESS (PHONE)
That little girl could have saved
Sean --

Anderton slams his hand down on a metal counter.

ANDERTON
DON'T YOU FUCKING SAY HIS NAME!

INT. CORRIDOR - NIGHT

As Burgess hears the sound, starts down the corridor for it.

INT. PRECOG TANK - NIGHT

As one of the males speaks...

MALE PRECOG
You used the memory of my dead
son...

INT. KITCHEN - NIGHT

People in the kitchen are now looking at Anderton. He turns
away...

ANDERTON
You used the memory of my dead son
to set me up! That was the one
thing you knew would drive me to
murder.

INT. CORRIDOR - NIGHT

As up ahead Burgess sees A WAITER EXIT THE KITCHEN.

ANDERTON (PHONE)
What are you going to do now,
Lamar?

INT. PRECOG TANK - NIGHT

As the male speaks...

MALE PRECOG
How are you gonna shut me up?

INT. HOTEL KITCHEN - NIGHT

Anderton starts for the kitchen door...

ANDERTON
How are you gonna shut me up?

And now, behind him, we see BURGESS COME INTO THE KITCHEN...

BURGESS
John, people have seen a future
where they feel safe. If all it
cost was the death of a former drug
addict...
(then)
Leave it alone, John. Leave it
alone.

INT. PRECRIME ANALYTICAL ROOM - NIGHT

As THE ANNE LIVELY IMAGES distort into static, we now see an
image of Lamar Burgess embracing Anderton, THE CITY SKYLINE
behind them. We see ANDERTON WHISPER IN BURGESS' EAR...
Burgess looks at him, then...

BURGESS
Forgive me, John.

And now Burgess SHOOTS ANDERTON AT POINT BLANK RANGE.

FLETCHER
Oh, God --

ON THE RED BALL (VICTIM)

As it slows and we see the name JOHN ANDERTON...

INT. HOTEL KITCHEN - NIGHT

As the two men move about the giant kitchen, Burgess now
stalking Anderton.

BURGESS
People want to believe in the
system. That's the beauty of it...

ANDERTON
Beauty? The precogs don't even
always agree with each other!

Burgess catches a glimpse of Anderton, moves that way.

BURGESS
The precogs don't have to always
work, John, just as long as people
believe they do, that's enough.

INT. PRECRIME READY ROOM - NIGHT

As the Team gets ready. A drunk Fletcher tries to put on his
uniform.

FLETCHER
Willard Hotel... Two minutes...

Jad rests a hand on his shoulder.

JAD
Fletcher, I think you should stay
with me.

Knott looks at Fletcher...

KNOTT
Not to worry, Gordon. I'll save
your pal.

INT. HOTEL KITCHEN - NIGHT

As Burgess moves through the huge space looking this way and
that for Anderton...

BURGESS
My God, John, a few hundred years
ago, they used to bleed the sick.
Twenty years ago, you had a tumor,
they'd cut it out of you, with a
knife, for Christ's sake.

He peers into a walk-in freezer as it's opened...

BURGESS
Since then the focus of medicine
has gone from cure to prevention.
Well, now law enforcement is going
the same way.

As the FREEZER DOOR is closed, he sees A MOVING REFLECTION IN THE STAINLESS STEEL, turns and sees Anderton go through a
door at the back.

ANDERTON (PHONE)
Lamar, it's over.

INT. TEMPLE - NIGHT

As the male precog rolls over...

MALE PRECOG
The question you have to ask is...

EXT. HOTEL TERRACE - NIGHT

With nowhere else to go, Anderton stands at the balcony. His hood is off exposing his shaved head.

ANDERTON
What are you gonna do now?

He turns, sees Burgess standing in the doorway, holding the
gun on him. Anderton looks off at the SKYLINE. We see a
BLINKING RED LIGHT moving towards us over the city...

ANDERTON
No doubt the Precogs have already
seen this.

BURGESS
(seeing the red light)
No doubt.

ANDERTON
Then go ahead, pull the trigger.

EXT. WASHINGTON D.C. - NIGHT

As the HOVERSHIP whips past us like a gunshot...

EXT. HOTEL TERRACE - NIGHT

Burgess begins moving towards Anderton.

ANDERTON
What's the matter, Lamar? You see
the problem, don't you? If you
don't kill me, it means the precogs
were wrong and Precrime is over.
If you do kill me, you go away,
but... it proves the system works.
The precogs were right.

Burgess is now right in front of Anderton, the gun inches
from Anderton's chest.

ANDERTON
So what do you do?

INT. HOVERSHIP - NIGHT

As EVANNA'S WATCH COUNTS DOWN: SEVEN SECONDS...

EVANNA
We're not gonna make it...

EXT. HOTEL TERRACE - NIGHT

Anderton waits for Burgess to pull the trigger.

ANDERTON
What's it worth? Just one more
murder...

And now THE HOVERSHIP RISES UP OVER THE TERRACE...

ANDERTON
You'll rot in hell with a halo, but
people will still believe in
Precrime.

Burgess looks at the ship...

ANDERTON
All you have to do now is pull the
trigger like they said you would.

Burgess turns back, raises the gun: his hand shakes.

ANDERTON
Except...
(a step closer)
You've seen your own future. Which
means...

A wind blows AS THE HOVERSHIP NOW COMES DOWN ON THE TERRACE,
THE PRECOPS DESCENDING FROM INSIDE.

ANDERTON
You can change it if you want to.

Burgess looks off as the PRECOPS run across the terrace.

ANDERTON
You still have a choice, Lamar...

Suddenly, all at once, THE PRECOPS' WATCHES BEGIN TO BEEP AS
THE TIME RUNS OUT.

Anderton, his eyes on Burgess, raises his hand, and motions
for the Precops to all stop where they are. The SOUND OF THE SHIP IS LOUD, Anderton speaks into Burgess' ear.

BURGESS
(finally)
Yes, I have a choice... and I've
made it.

He lowers the gun, the precops stand there, waiting for him.

Anderton takes Burgess by the arm, but the man is unsteady,
and Anderton holds onto him. Burgess looks him in the eye...

BURGESS
Forgive me, John.

We hear A GUNSHOT and everybody freezes. Anderton falls to
his knees. Looks up at Burgess. A RED STAIN now spreading
around BURGESS' heart...

BURGESS
Forgive me...

And as Anderton and now the rest of the precops all move to a dying Burgess, we HEAR THE SOUND OF RAIN OVER and...

DISSOLVE TO:

EXT. PRECRIME HEADQUATERS - DAY

It's raining. A CRANE dismantles the statue.

EXT. DOWNTOWN - DAY

As "regular cops" patrol the rainy streets.

INT. PRECRIME TEMPLE - DAY

The tank is empty... the equipment gone.

INT. ANDERTON'S APARTMENT - DAY

Anderton stands alone, watching the rain fall, looking out at the city. A figure walks up to him. But this time it's not digital -- it's Lara. She's flesh and blood. And she's
PREGNANT. She stands beside him, watching the rain as we...

DISSOLVE TO:

THE IMAGE OF ANNE LIVELY

On the PLASTIC CARD Anderton had downloaded from Containment.

It's cracked, but the image still moves: Anne Lively
drowning, her hand beckoning us in death. A FINGER caresses
the image as we now PULL BACK TO REVEAL...

AGATHA. Sitting in a rocking chair, bundled up, wind blowing her hair. She stares at the photograph. We hear LAUGHTER O.S. as we continue PULLING BACK TO REVEAL...

A SMALL CABIN. She sits in front of it, rocking back and
forth. She looks off as we PULL BACK FARTHER TO REVEAL...

THE OTHER TWO PRECOGS, dressed in warm clothing, working in a crude garden, one of them pulling rocks from the flower bed.

We now begin TO CRANE UP so that we see they're...

BY THE SHORE. The ocean, murky and fierce, with HUGE WAVES
crashing on the rocky beach. WE CRANE ALL THE WAY UP AND
BACK so that now we see that the three of them are...

ON A SMALL ISLAND. In the middle of the North Atlantic
somewhere. With no other people... no civilization...

And no murder. And then we...

FADE OUT.

 

[Mike Graham]

Isn't the minority report referred to in the film the vision of what happened to Agatha's mother? Anderton himself did not have a minority report.
I believe the scene is where this is revealed in dialogue is when Anderton hooks up Agatha to the viewing screen in the holographic nightclub. Anderton asks, "Where's my minority report?" Agatha replies, "You don't have one."
The fact that Anderton does not kill Crowe is just further proof that the system is most certainly fallible.

 

[Ernest Rister]

The Minority Report is the report Agatha carries inside of her...the one relating to the murder of her mother, Anne Lively. That's the Minority Report. Anderton's desperate search for his own minority report is a red herring. He doesn't have one, while the wrongly-convicted murderer of Anne Lively *does* - even though this murderer fully intended to go through with it, he didn't do it...left unchecked, he *would* have killed Anne Lively, hence, the Twins call him out. Agatha was the strong one, and has a connection to her mother, hence Agatha sees the full tragedy beyond the attempted murder by John Doe. She sees Doe *and* Burgess. Her report (the "minority report" of the title) is missing when Anderton begins to investigate the Anne Lively murder.

 

[Alex Spindler]

But Ernest, there is a problem with what you're showing. None of it is substantially different from the movie, but it still doesn't qualify as a minority report as Hineman describes it.
In a dialogue section contained in whole after your [snip], the reason for my disagreement is made clear:

My God. If the country knew there was a chance...
IRIS
The system would collapse.
ANDERTON
I believe in that system.
IRIS
Do you really?
ANDERTON
You wanna bring it down?
IRIS
You will bring it down if you manage to kill your victim. Oh why? That'll be the most spectacular public display of how Precrime didn't work.
ANDERTON
I'm not gonna kill anybody.
IRIS
Hold that thought...
ANDERTON
Why should I trust you?
IRIS
You shouldn't. You shouldn't trust anyone. Certainly not the attorney general who just wants it all for himself and not the young federal agent who wants your job. Not even the old man who just wants to hang onto what he created. Don't trust anyone. Just find the Minority Report.

In the bold sections, they focus their discussions around alternate futures, which was the original intention of a minority report from the source material. However, what they show as a Minority Report in the film is more like a Director's Cut version (just a longer take of a scene). It is the kind of thing that could arguably be called 'an insignificant variable' because the killer and victim and event are not different but the events leading up to it are shown in greater clarity. The film doesn't show anything of the trial of the killers or how an appropriate sentence is determined, where the movie's version of a Minority Report would come into play.
My point is that the filmmakers had long since lost any understand themselves of what a Minority Report would be or had lost the ability to work its basic concept into the scripted events. The film creates an ingenious solution to how to kill someone in the world when murder is seen ahead of time, but in doing so has far diverged from building their story around a Minority Report as it started out (which was the concept of alternate futures). The MR in the film could easily be replaced with a basic amount of detective work, but the system still worked just fine.

 

[Ernest Rister]

"In the bold sections, they focus their discussions around alternate futures, which was the original intention of a minority report from the source material. However, what they show as a Minority Report in the film is more like a Director's Cut version (just a longer take of a scene). It is the kind of thing that could arguably be called 'an insignificant variable' because the killer and victim and event are not different but the events leading up to it are shown in greater clarity. The film doesn't show anything of the trial of the killers or how an appropriate sentence is determined, where the movie's version of a Minority Report would come into play."

It is made incredibly complicated because of the idea of intent. "John Doe" surely would have killed Anne Lively if Pre-crime had not stopped him. Hence, the Pre-Cogs were right. They saw the future that would exist if nothing ocurred to prevent it. This is where - in my opinion - the only truly deep plot hole exists in Minority Report. Because Pre-Crime exists, by defintion, the future can be prevented. The knowledge that we all have the individual power to change the course of our destinies shouldn't have to be a lesson learned by anyone involved with Pre-Crime, these people change the future every day. And yet, that is the entire story in a nutshell.

The movie is not without flaws, but for me, that is the biggest one of all...how can someone involved with Pre-Crime possibly "learn" that he has the power to choose his future, when he changes the future on a daily basis?

 

[Alex Spindler]

I sort of find the resolution in general to be unsatisfying.

There is really nothing in the film that I could find that would be sufficient cause to shutdown Precrime.

You have one instance of someone exploiting a potential loophole in the system. This is avoided now because they create red and brown balls with both killer and victim name on them, permanently preventing the 'rekilling' of someone (I assume that the names of killers wasn't available back in the past or it is a big plothole).

You have an instance of a precrime cop killing someone. This only proves that he was able to evade the precops long enough to successfully kill someone. It wasn't an instance of failure because he was just good at what he does.

And the Burgess situation isn't a failure either because a precop managed to talk a murderer out of the act. It's odd because the victim was the precop and the killer decided for suicide, but regardless a precop managed to prevent a murder. He used discussion instead of restraints, but it worked in the end.


The only really interesting point I could gain from the film is the age old question of sacrifice for the greater good. The precogs were treated in an inhumane way, so their freedom at the end could be a cause of celebration. However, I have to think about the massive number of people the freedome of those three people will cost. There were like 250 homicides in the D.C. area the last few years. They described the situation as being even worse in the future. The question everyone would have to ask is whether they would prefer to have those three consigned to a non-life experiencing murders or have thousands of people die (and an increasing proportion to expand precrime to other territories).

 

[Mike Graham]

The question the movie poses is the fact that any one of the imprisoned killers may not have gone through with the crime. Yes, most of them would have, but perhaps there were 1 or 2 innocent men sent to jail for a false prediction.
So, would it be worth it to keep the precogs in the coma, while imprisoning the occasional innocent person(s) every year to prevent the death of innocent people?
I'm not sure of the answer myself, but I did think of this same question when I saw the movie for the second time...

 

[Alex Spindler]

That may be true, but the movie does not demonstrate any alternate futures not brought about by Precrime. It is only through the intervention of Precrime that actions are prevented. In essence, the precognitives are not seeing intent but are seeing completed actions. However, these actions can be intervened by those with foreknowledge, but only by those with foreknowledge.

My problem with the movie is that it is named for a condition and discusses a potential fault that the movie does not demonstrate at all. The fallibility of alternate futures may exist, but it is not a part of the film we are shown. I mean, how many innocent people are shown in the film? The addict who tried to kill Anne Lively actually tried to kill Anne Lively. Howard Marx did try to kill his wife. Anderton did actually kill Crowe.

The only alternate future any of them have is created by Precrime. If Precrime didn't exist, they would all have murdered (of course, neither the Lively nor Crowe murder would have been arranged without Precrime being an institution).

 

[Ernest Rister]

Burgess was predicted to kill Anderton, but he didn't. He saw his future and he changed it. His suicide proved Pre-Crime wrong and proved he was in control of his own destiny.

 

[Shayne Lebrun]

Ah, but you still get the fact that there was a murder that would have happened.

It's not that precrime is wrong, so much that precrime only shows what will happen without outside interference.

I think the idea behind the 'minority report;' i.e. one of the precogs, generally the strongest one, is that she sees with might happen *due to* outside interference.

Also, remember that the precogs would be about on the level of eye witnesses; eye-witness testimony is very unreliable. Physical evidence wins the day.

Like Burgess being able to fake them out by looking like somebody. You could easily fake out the precogs by, say, turning out the lights.

That having been said, it seems to be the difference between 'finding the murderer crying over the body, holding a bloody knife' and 'finding the attempted murder heading towards the sleeping body, holding a knife.' One would hope that along with precrime comes a system of rehabilitation; it would truly help the people who kill in a fit of passion, or are mentally unstable.

 

[Dana Fillhart]

Reminds me of a short story I read many years ago by Ursula K. Leguin, called "The Ones Who Walk Away from Omelas" -- basically the above predicament in a slightly different (and more poignant) environment.

 

[Alex Spindler]

Ernest,
Ah, but the murder was prevented by an agent of Precrime. The murder did not occur because Anderton laid out the consequences that it would have on the Precrime system. Their knowledge of how Precrime works and the impacts of it makes them agents of future change and allowed Burgess, himself a Precrime agent, to diverge from his predestined action.

It was done with words instead of physical restraint and a halo, but it still was an instance of Precrime preventing a murder.


Shayne,
I totally agree with you that there is a real hole in terms of how destined criminals are treated. Although I suppose they might have discussed the sentencing and possible rehabilitation, none of that is shown. I got the impression that there was one punishment for all murders, which was to be halo'd for an unspecified period of time.

 

[Ernest Rister]

What's this "Ah, but..." trend in this thread? Are we all turning into Basil Rathbone?

 

[Alex Spindler]

Hehe,
Didn't even notice it myself. I've been getting in a lot of debates at work (work related even) and I find that I'm doing that there as well.