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Improve Samsung HT-AS720S HTiB

Discussion in 'Beginners, General Questions' started by chunkywater, Jul 13, 2013.

  1. chunkywater

    chunkywater Member

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    Hey everyone, I currently own a Samsung HT-AS720S and I would like to improve the center channel. Everything else seems fine but the center channel seems like it struggles to deliver good voices. Any recommendations? My budget is ~$100

    Any other recommendations/suggestions are fine as well.

    Specs of HT-AS720S: SPECS

    Inputs/outputs of HT-AS720S receiver: BACK OF RECEIVER

    Manual of HT-AS720S (give it a sec to download): MANUAL
     
  2. schan1269

    schan1269 HTF Expert
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    Where are you?

    That is one lightweight receiver there(and for those "not reading cause it is HTiB"...this one, albeit severely low end, is a real AVR)

    I don't think that was offered in the US...or if it was...I totally ignored it.
     
  3. chunkywater

    chunkywater Member

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    Yeah I live in the US. I got it as a gift like 3-4 years ago. I realize it is a low end receiver but would you care to elaborate why you called it lightweight? I'm just curious and would like to learn more about this stuff. Also, does the fact that it is low end mean it wouldn't support any speakers I buy?
     
  4. schan1269

    schan1269 HTF Expert
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    "lightweight" refers to two things(and will help you buy stuff in the future. And since you didn't buy it, you'll get some slack here)

    1. The receiver pulls 100 watts off the wall
    2. Its power is rated at 4ohm and 10% distortion

    What those two, together, mean is it produces a usable 10-ish watts per channel. An AVR can't produce more than it chews off the wall. So, if the specs were "legit" and not complete BS...this would produce...as advertised, 700 watts total. 100 does not create 700.

    But it isn't listed in the specs if the rating came from 1 channel at a time(likely)...and they just "tagged it" x7. And yes...all the AVR manufacturers do that. But, the spec of "how much it chews off the wall" is a good indicator to how much power it actually does produce.

    In AVR under $500(based on MSRP...not "what you can get it for"), the typical "how is it this cheap?" falls straight on the power supply. Most $500 AVR pull less than 250 watts off the wall. There are exceptions.

    When you increase price, especially nearing $1000, is when you start seeing AVR that are starting to pull upwards of 600 watts off the wall. Some AVR around $1000 will even pull as much as 1000 watts off the wall. Finally, the "big dollar ones" will pull as much as 1300 watts off the wall. The "big dog" Anthem and Integra models($3000-ish) pull as much as 1600 watts. No, that does not mean they pull that much "all the time". Just means when you turn it up...it can grab more off the wall.

    Back to speakers. The reality is, most people don't realize how little power they actually need to fill the room with sound. That falls on(and is almost always my main criteria in picking speakers) their efficiency.

    I'm going to guess the speakers that come with this system(maybe it was in the manual...didn't read speaker specifics...if there were any) are roughly 84db or under.

    What that means is they need 1 watt to produce 84db(or less if less efficient). To double the sound(which is 3db), it takes double the power. Another 3db take ANOTHER double of power...

    84db is 1
    87 db is 2
    90 db is 4
    93 db is 8
    96 db is 16
    and so on.

    Now, let's say I send you over to the BIC DV52clrs(or its bigger brother the 62clrs). Last I checked it is roughly 90db efficient and costs around $80. The 62 costs around $135.

    so...

    90db is 1
    93db is 2
    96db is 4

    The BIC speaker on 4 watts is the same loudness(I'm guessing) as your current center is on 16 watts.
     
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  5. chunkywater

    chunkywater Member

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    Hmm i see. I did find it kind of weird how the 100W would somehow magically turn into more power for the speakers. Seems almost crazy how they would lie like that though. As for the efficiency of the speakers, The BIC speakers you suggest would theoretically be louder than the other speakers in the system because of its efficiency in relation to the power it is getting?

    Also, both of those BIC speakers you suggested are $60 and $106 respectively on Tigerdirect. Seems like a pretty good sale.
     
  6. schan1269

    schan1269 HTF Expert
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    Correct...but unless you want to buy an SPL meter($20 on Amazon) and use Audiocheck.net for soundwaves...

    You won't know "exactly" how much louder. The AVR does have level controls for all speakers. So you can "dial back" any speaker you buy to create an even sound across them all. There is another center(I've never heard it) by Pioneer. It is part of the Andrew Jones series. The only thing I don't like(which in your case will fit in better) is their relative "lack" of efficiency around 85db. I haven't looked at the Pio AJ in a while...so I have no idea of price/availability.

    But regardless, there are numerous centers* you can buy, that you'll "eventually" be able to buy again as budget allows to replace all 7 of your current speakers. That AVR, even if it is "low end", has one major plus. It has a 8 channel analog input. That means somebody will always want it. Even if $40 at a garage sale. The 8 channel(labeled 7.1 I think?) allows you to connect anything you want to it, so "in theory", you could in the future use it as an amp for Zone 2/3(look up zone controls on newer AVR). I have a feeling if it were only tasked with 2 or 4 channels at a time...it would more than satisfactory.

    *Examples...
    Polk Monitor (Monitor, Monitor II and New Monitor...yes there are three variations. Monitor II was a NewEgg exclusive)
    Infinity Primus (it appears Infinity has cancelled the Primus line, as the center has disappeared "new"...but can be found used on CL and Ebay)
    Sony SS (another series that might have a new version coming)
     
  7. schan1269

    schan1269 HTF Expert
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  8. schan1269

    schan1269 HTF Expert
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  9. chunkywater

    chunkywater Member

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    Ah, those Fluance speakers look mighty tempting to get. If it wasn't for the size of the standing speakers, i think i would get em. If i would get them though, wouldn't the AVR the a huge bottleneck though?

    I think it's important to note here that I am currently in a small room, so sound is pretty easy to please here. Probably why ive been fine with the Samsung speakers for so long.
     
  10. schan1269

    schan1269 HTF Expert
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    Actually...

    1. Dropping from 7 to 5(page 23 of the manual)
    2. Greater efficiency

    Your AVR won't have to work as hard. And when you do upgrade to a newer AVR...you'll already have speakers.

    Also the "default" crossover of the Samsung(because of the speakers) was 150. You, with those Fluance, can move it down to 80hz(again, page 23)
     
  11. schan1269

    schan1269 HTF Expert
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    Side benefit to "new speakers". Because the current crossover is 150, if you move it down to 80...the subwoofer will probably work even better than it does now. Most subwoofers lose their effectiveness over 100hz. So, letting them play "where they are supposed to"...helps them immeasurably.

    And if the Fluance(linked) is "too big"...

    Back to the trusty BIC. The DV62 is(today) $110. The DV52(center and bookshelf) is a combined $130(the DV52 is available in black or white). And you'll still be able to set the crossover at 80.
     
  12. schan1269

    schan1269 HTF Expert
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    You could even forgo the DV62 and pick up just a pair of DV52 and DV52CLRS for the $130(barely more than you currently asked) and replace the front stage...keep your present "rear 4".

    That way your front three...

    1. Match acoustically(of paramount importance)
    2. Still allows an 80hz crossover. Your rears won't have much to do anyway below 150hz.

    The BIC DV has been around a long time. They aren't going anywhere any time soon. You might, maybe, even find them on CL or Ebay close. I've seen the DV52 sell for as little as $40 on Ebay. That is what happens when you can get them new for $70.
     
  13. chunkywater

    chunkywater Member

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    Could you link to me where you found the combined speakers for $130? I might just do that. And ill definitely set the crossover to 80Hz and see how that sounds. What i seen to be lacking is a good test material. Any suggestions for that?
     
  14. chunkywater

    chunkywater Member

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    Oh also, I can't believe i omitted this but i am using the 5.1 setup. Not the 7.1, and i made sure to disable the speakers i am not using.
     
  15. schan1269

    schan1269 HTF Expert
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    Here goes...

    http://www.amazon.com/America-Adatto-Dv52Si-Outdoor-Speakers/dp/B0000Y2WXE/ref=sr_1_4?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1373741412&sr=1-4&keywords=bic+dv52 (ignore the "outdoor". just means they are plastic and not MDF)

    http://www.amazon.com/BIC-AMERICA-DV-52CLRB-Channel-DV52CLRB/dp/B00009WBYJ/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1373741412&sr=1-1&keywords=bic+dv52

    If you'd rather buy via BestBuy.com(to use their credit card or whatever), they are there as well. But they are NOT in store. And I assume these two are at BB.com...the others in the DV line are.

    Movies for great sound(I recently did a review for the SVS Ultra using these)...

    Immortal Beloved. May, or may not, be your cup of tea...but it is a glorious soundtrack
    Curious Case of Benjamin Button
    Underworld: Awakening (this soundtrack separates the men from the boys)
     
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  16. chunkywater

    chunkywater Member

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    Hey thank you so much, It's nice to know some good recommendations on this subject. Ill definitely be on the lookout for those on CL or eBay and maybe save a little more.

    Those DV52si speakers look really small. Good for my room, but it would be hard to believe those sound better than the ones i got from a layman's perspective.
     
  17. schan1269

    schan1269 HTF Expert
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    I bet your first reaction will be...

    "Good God, what have I been missing all this time???"
     

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