Curtains for the Mac Pro? (1 Viewer)

[Nelson Au]

I still have faith that Cook's statement earlier this year that they have something special planned for the Mac Pro in 2013 will still hold true.
I need a Pro machine. I just got a Retina MacBook Pro and it's a big jump from my dead G5 and '09 MacBook Pro. I do CAD work and illustration and photoshop stuff. So the speed bump is appreciated.

 

[Carlo_M]

Hey Sam, I fully acknowledge the Mac Pro [and overall Pro] market is small. All I'm asking Apple is to "fish or cut bait".
If you want to support the Pros, many of whom swore by and stood by the Apple brand during the Dark Days (yeah, remember those? less than 5% PC market share, no iDevices, stock at $10 a share) then put out the machine that will allow them to do their work. And that is a robust piece of machinery in the tradition of the Mac Pro line.
If you want to get out of the Pro market, that's fine too. Just be up front about the reasons why [i.e. how it comprises .001% and it's not worth your time] and bow out gracefully. Sure it will piss off some people, but for others, we'll at least just be thankful that we know what's up, and will engineer our own solutions.
It's kind of like being in a relationship with a girl and you don't know if she really loves you or not. If she'd just let you know, then you can either take the relationship to the next level or have a mutual breakup and find another girl. Apple is keeping the Pros in that grey area (are we just friends, or am I getting to home plate tonight?) and that's the hardest part of it all.
I can build a Mac Pro-like desktop next week, for 33% cheaper, but it won't have OSX which I want. But if they'll at least be up front with their plans, then I can build it and get on with life.

 

[DVDvision]

I think it's pretty clear now that Steve is gone, that Apple will burn all the cash they can based on the legacy, then fade away. You just have to look at the faces of the people doing the keynotes, to see it's all over. They all look like they are starring as the bad guy in an Hammer film remastered in 4/3.

 

[Sam Posten]

Terrific troll. I give it a 7 outta ten cause it's got a well repeated chorus and a beat I can really dance too.

 

[DVDvision]

Thanks Sam. I do feel a disconnect with the brand since Steve stepped out.

 

[Sam Posten]

Bummer. Personally I don't get the love affair folks have with companies, they can't love you back. I buy tools that help me get things done, and I don't anthropomorphize them. There are things I wish my tools did better and that's fun to discuss. There are interesting developments going on in how we buy and use media too, including DRM and Walled Gardens and locked systems, that's fun to debate too. But I never conflate those things with a brand. I do appreciate that Apple is more concerned with the humanistic side of things and puts customers ahead of third parties, but it does that in order to expand its HUGE bottom line more than because it loves its customers... It's a business after all, and one of if not the most profitable ones ever created. They got that way because they put the customer first, something a lot more companies could learn from... They aren't perfect and they make mistakes, and they lost a visionary and face of the company, but I have no reason to suspect they will change at their heart for a long time. But if they do, someone else will take up the charge. I wouldn't bet against them in the short term tho!

 

[Carlo_M]

Yeah I'm with Sam - I buy the best tools for the job, with price definitely playing a part in the consideration. Despite Apple being more expensive, in general their tools have been better for me than Windows tools. Even though many of my projects and associated software are now cross platform (Adobe Creative Cloud, Avid Pro Tools, etc.) some do work better on Windows (MS Office, and Outlook especially for work are superior to their Mac counterparts). Unfortunately there are some Apple-specific software that I have to decide whether to keep using or not on the desktop level, such as Logic Pro.
If I go all-in to Pro Tools and abandon Logic Pro, I can build my next desktop with Windows 7 and get near Mac Pro level (slightly slower CPU because I won't use the server chip, but better GPU because Apple never puts the most powerful GPU nVidia makes as an option) for 33% less price. And I'll get native Blu-Ray playback and burning to boot.
That's where I'm at now, and I'm intrigued about the rumor that Apple may start assembling the Mac Pro in the U.S. With the holidays killing my finances, I'll likely wait until late Q1 2013 to make my desktop decision, and I'm hoping that Apple will have revealed their plans for the Mac Pro by then. I know they're going to update it, Tim Cook has said so, but I'd like a few leaked specs from reliable sources before making up my mind.

 

[DVDvision]

Well that's the point. Steve had the tools for sale. Now it seems they are heading into getting to sell us a multi functional manual sheet of paper for 2000 $ in the future, with no possibility to install any third party sofware, re computer. I don't mind the iPad, I think it's great and my app was huge in France. I do mind computers becoming the iPad. I still want computers for professionals.

 

[Sam Posten]

Tell you what, when they make the mac app store non optional you won't have to look for me behind you parachuting into cupertino, I will be in the front rallying the charge.
I don't see it happening and Apple has some clever security defaults and other strategies that make that even less likely.

 

[Carlo_M]

Like Sam, I have some faith that Apple isn't going down that route. In fact, many were worried that Mac OSX was going to merge with iOS and make the Macintosh a touch PC environment.
The irony is that Windows is the one attempting to do that, with 8, and Apple has gone on record as saying that while they want to merge similar aspects of iOS and OSX to make a seamless experience (i.e. messages, notes, calendar, reminders, notifications, mail, etc.) they acknowledge that people don't want an iOS touch environment on their personal computers. So they do recognize that third party software will always play a role in their desktop environment.
While the iPad may someday be enough computer for 80% of the population (and I agree that it may indeed become that) there's always the 20% that will need a full desktop computer and I thnk Cook, Ive, Mansfield and Cue all recognize that.
My problem is that I'm in the 0.5% (maybe less ) that actually needs just a bit more than what the iMac can offer but isn't a gamer. If I were a gamer the answer would be simple: build a PC. But I use programs like Logic Pro which keep me invested in OSX. Maybe when Pro Tools XI comes out and is fully 64 bit I may change my tune and go all-in with Avid and the PC environment.

 

[DVDvision]

I suggest you go my route, I took last year middle range mac-mini (the one with a graphic card), replace the disc with a SSD and boosted it with 16gb ram. It feels not every purpose, but most of them now.

 

[Sam Posten]

You aren't getting what he is saying. He needs more power than what the iMac provides. So the Mini will not cut it for his uses. I'll be stepping down from a Mac Pro to an iMac, not without some trepidation. But I feel the iMac finally has enough juice for what I need it to do given the speed of Thunderbolt and the 680 graphics. Carlo needs raw processor power tho, and the iMac does not match the Mac Pro in that realm, and the 2013 Mac Pro should push that even further.
Plus the ability to have 4 internal bare drives cannot be forgotten, 64gb or RAM, and using a full extra card GPU (or multiples!) for CUDA work puts the Mac pro into capabilities most people don't need and cannot afford....

 

[Carlo_M]

Yeah what Sam said.
Seriously, I'm really getting into video editing and most of my devices capture at 1080p (Canon 7D, iPhone 5) and manipulating those video files in Adobe Premiere takes it toll on both the CPU and GPU. While the new iMac, as Sam has mentioned, has made huge improvements in both CPU and GPU, the fact remains that they are both fixed targets (i.e. non upgradable). New video cards come out frequently, and can make a huge difference in video editing even if the rest of your system stays the same. While the GTX680 that the iMac uses is top of the line right now, it will not be so shortly. Also, and correct me if I'm wrong, I believe the iMac uses the mobile versions of the GPUs so the GTX680 PCIe card you can put in your desktop will be significantly more powerful than the version in the iMac.
And yes, in the build I'm assembling at Newegg, I have a 240GB SSD as my primary, with 2x1TB RAID 0 mirror array inside for my data. While I'm only going with 16GB of RAM now, on 2 8GB sticks, knowing that I can go up to 64GB is a bit comforting
My desktop just turned 5 years old. It's not bad for its age, it actually runs everything not CS6 really well, but I need to step up to more horsepower if I want to get into serious 1080p video editing. I run a 32-bit Vista and the machine only recognizes 3.2GB of RAM! My newegg build, with a 2560x1440 IPS monitor is about $500 less than a maxed out iMac (in terms of CPU, GPU and 1TB Fusion) and will come with more RAM, internal 2x1TB Mirror RAID and a GTX680 video card.
I really want to see what Apple has in store for the Mac Pro but I'm afraid that with an Apple Cinema Display I'll be at $1K above this price.

 

[Sam Posten]

They are fairly close. Nobody but the most hardcore of FPS guys is going to be left wanting tho, at least on paper....
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1474578&highlight=680m
We'll see how it looks when they start getting into people's hands and tested with real world games, both on OSX native and Boot Camped.

 

[Sam Posten]

Don't Panic. http://9to5mac.com/2013/01/31/apple-to-discontinue-mac-pro-in-europe-in-march-over-new-product-certification-standards/

 

[Sam Posten]

CONFIRMED! So weird. http://www.loopinsight.com/2013/01/31/apple-confirms-mac-pro-sales-will-cease-in-eu-on-march-1/

 

[Carlo_M]

Yeah I've been looking around trying to find the actual language to UL 60950-1, Second Edition but have been so far unable to get to the actual documentation (I get links to deadlines, date,.etc.) just to try and figure out what requirement the Mac Pro doesn't meet. I don't take this as the end of the Mac Pro, just that the current version doesn't pass UL 60950-1, Second Edition so they're pulling it off the market as required. Probably something they can't alter in the current version so we'll see if the next rev. of the MP meets that spec.

 

[Sam Posten]

Right, but it seems clear that the next MP update will be LATE 2013.

 

[Carlo_M]

Yeah, it clearly won't be Q1 and likely not Q2. But I'm still hoping for summer.

 

[Carlo_M]

If you ever feel neglected If you think that all is lost I'll be counting up my demons Hoping everything's not lost... http://www.macrumors.com/2013/02/06/apple-tells-reseller-that-the-new-mac-pro-is-arriving-in-spring-2013/