Why is it becoming more difficult to obtain new 4k releases? (2 Viewers)

[Ronald Epstein]

Right, I haven’t been as excited to buy new titles as I was when many 3D ones were coming out. It was a huge mistake to put out the 4k format with no 3D capability also, it’s a better 2D picture but still just 2D and not making me want to buy a lot of it like I was with 3D.

I don't agree with that. 3D was not a booming format. Outside of a small sect of devoted fans like us, most of the public wasn't interested.

If manufacturers and studios were making a sizeable profit from 3D hardware and software sales the format would have probably spilled over into 4k. The fact that it didn't and the studios completely ceasing home video releases tells you all you need to know.

 

[dpippel]

I don't agree with that. 3D was not a booming format. Outside of a small sect of devoted fans like us, most of the public wasn't interested.

If manufacturers and studios were making a sizeable profit from 3D hardware and software sales the format would have probably spilled over into 4k. The fact that it didn't and the studios completely ceasing home video releases tells you all you need to know.

That and the fact that TV manufacturers pretty much completely stopped producing 3D-capable displays in 2017, six YEARS ago. You're absolutely right Ron, in that 3D has always represented a tiny percentage of the market.

 

[Malcolm R]

Not to divert this further into a 3D discussion, but I think the technology was too cumbersome for most people. To get it to work right, you had to have the right disc, then set your player right, then set the TV right, make sure you had compatible HDMI cables, and make sure the glasses worked and were charged up (if using an active system). Lots of variables that required attention, then the 3D wasn't even that great on some early displays before they worked out the kinks.

At that point, most people just didn't want to bother.

 

[Josh Steinberg]

At that point, most people just didn't want to bother.

And I think that’s ultimately true of every technology that there have been further evolutions on - that really gets to the heart of the matter. Outside of enthusiast circles, people don’t have loyalty to the process, they have loyalty to the result. In other words, they want to watch stuff they like on their TV. Whether the source is a roof antenna or cable or a video tape rental or a disc purchase, the commonality between all of those things is that each was popular in their own day when they were either the most convenient or only option consumers had.

 

[Malcolm R]

And I think that’s ultimately true of every technology that there have been further evolutions on - that really gets to the heart of the matter. Outside of enthusiast circles, people don’t have loyalty to the process, they have loyalty to the result. In other words, they want to watch stuff they like on their TV. Whether the source is a roof antenna or cable or a video tape rental or a disc purchase, the commonality between all of those things is that each was popular in their own day when they were either the most convenient or only option consumers had.

I think I'm headed in that direction. I was going to watch Army of Darkness a few nights ago and even though I have it on disc, I pulled it up on one of the streamers so I didn't have to fool around with the disc.

Resistance is futile, even with us old goats.

 

[Lord Dalek]

No I think the comparison to 3D is apt because in many ways what has suffocated 4K is one of the things (not necessarily all of them, see the Disney disaster) that did do in 3D. That the studios treated it as an expensive glorified bonus feature to tack on to the price of existing standard blu-rays and not a new format. Again, broken record here but collecting 4k has always been a turn-off for me because you were expected to spend 20-30 dollars for even the oldest of catalog titles* . The only studio that kinda got it was Universal because the supplements are on the 4k discs but even then they still manged to make the same mistake making every damn release mulitformat anyway. We don't want multiformat, its nothing more than a price gouge that just ends with titles either not getting stocked or collecting dust on shelves! You know... JUST LIKE WHAT HAPPENED WITH 3D!!!!

*Case in point I just bought Goonies because I finally get it for under 10 because of Prime Day. Last year at Wal-Mart that was 25 bucks. How would this ever succeed?

 

[Jesse Skeen]

Point is, there’s been many innovations that have kept me excited to buy new movie releases, 3D being a big one, and with that “failing” I just don’t have that excitement anymore (I’ll buy 2D movies on 4k, but that’s just not as big a deal to me.) Agree it is frustrating to not find 4k discs in stores especially when they do have the same title on regular DVD. Sadly at this point the retail environment is just going to keep getting worse before it gets better.

 

[jayembee]

Walmart will probably follow suit in next couple of years and when they do, that will truly be the end of physical media. Target gave up for the most part over the last 4-5 years.

Walmart uses 3rd parties like GRUV and Deep Discount for many of their media sales online. I would assume if they continue to do this there will be media available on their website.

Interestingly, one news item about this says:

Says "Walmart, meanwhile, remains a massive source of physical media sales, which likely aren’t going away any time soon."

(They don't say, but I assume it's on-line sales, not in-store sales.)

Best Buy Will Reportedly Stop Selling DVDs and Blu-Ray Starting Next Year | Cord Cutters News

Best Buy could be saying goodbye to physical media — DVDs, Blu-Ray and 4K Ultra HD discs — for good. The consumer electronics retailer will exit out of the physical media business as soon as the end of the first quarter of 2024, according to The Digital Bits. The move is another hint at the […]

cordcuttersnews.com

 

[Lord Dalek]

Interestingly, one news item about this says:

Says "Walmart, meanwhile, remains a massive source of physical media sales, which likely aren’t going away any time soon."

Yeah well they'll probably keep the vat o' dvds going until the heat death of the Earth. But for the purposes of this thread, Walmart's UHD support is teetering on extinction.

 

[Jesse Skeen]

It really makes no sense to even keep putting new movies out on regular DVD now that 4k is out; that means there’s THREE levels of quality. They finally killed off VHS once HD-DVD and Blu-ray came out.

 

[Malcolm R]

It really makes no sense to even keep putting new movies out on regular DVD now that 4k is out; that means there’s THREE levels of quality. They finally killed off VHS once HD-DVD and Blu-ray came out.

I think the end of VHS was a convenience issue made by consumers. No bulky tapes that you had to rewind and could be worn out or eaten by your player. Small shiny discs, durable, no rewinding, made them an easy choice over VHS.

DVD's are still a big seller because there are no convenience trade-offs between DVD/BLU/4K and most consumers don't really care about A/V superiority. For most, it ends up being the same movie only for a higher price on BLU/4K vs DVD.

Discs are now losing out to streaming, again largely because of convenience. No physical media or players at all, just push a couple buttons on your remote and you have a movie playing.

 

[Worth]

It really makes no sense to even keep putting new movies out on regular DVD now that 4k is out; that means there’s THREE levels of quality. They finally killed off VHS once HD-DVD and Blu-ray came out.

DVD still outsells blu-ray and UHD by a significant margin. If they were going to phase anything out, it would make more financial sense to get rid of UHD.

 

[compson]

Yeah well they'll probably keep the vat o' dvds going until the heat death of the Earth. But for the purposes of this thread, Walmart's UHD support is teetering on extinction.

What leads you to think Walmart is abandoning UHDs? Their website shows over 1200.

 

[Andy Dwyer]

Well over half of the Walmart listings aren't even sold by WM. Many are just random 3rd part companies.

 

[Bartman]

Interestingly, one news item about this says:

Says "Walmart, meanwhile, remains a massive source of physical media sales, which likely aren’t going away any time soon."

(They don't say, but I assume it's on-line sales, not in-store sales.)

Best Buy Will Reportedly Stop Selling DVDs and Blu-Ray Starting Next Year | Cord Cutters News

Best Buy could be saying goodbye to physical media — DVDs, Blu-Ray and 4K Ultra HD discs — for good. The consumer electronics retailer will exit out of the physical media business as soon as the end of the first quarter of 2024, according to The Digital Bits. The move is another hint at the […]

cordcuttersnews.com

I remember a news segment from a few months ago where Walmart were in negotiations to buy the huge distribution company behind Gruv.com, that in itself was a conglomeration of manufacturer distribution companies brought together several years ago.

 

[Indy Guy]

Point is, there’s been many innovations that have kept me excited to buy new movie releases, 3D being a big one, and with that “failing” I just don’t have that excitement anymore (I’ll buy 2D movies on 4k, but that’s just not as big a deal to me.) Agree it is frustrating to not find 4k discs in stores especially when they do have the same title on regular DVD. Sadly at this point the retail environment is just going to keep getting worse before it gets better.

3D as you say was the most exciting development since DVDs. 3D tech was a big stumbling block to it's acceptance but the tech used in 4K (particularly DolbyVision) still has bugs that keep it from being regarded as a 100% quality upgrade for all 4K viewing equipment.
"Avatar the Way of Water" is far more engaging on the 3D disc than in 4K because the exploited sense of depth dramatically outways any additional perception of detail in 4K. The same is true of the "Guardians 3" 3D disc from Japan. When objects leap out into the black bars during scope sequences, it delivers an uncanny effect that is far more exciting and fun than the standard 4K flat viewing or theatrical version as well..
When projected, "Blue Hawaii", "Saturday Night Fever" and this week's release of "Snow White" have 4K dullness issues in comparison to their included blu ray discs. With Snow White, I'm forced to decide between an darker uptick in clarity (4K) or a sparkling bright and more colorful picture (BR). Coming to market with such dramatic tech incompatibility is no way for a media upgrade to jump into prime time as was also the case for 3D in its day.
Given the choice between perfecting one format or the other, for me 3D would win in an instant. The 3D experience is transformative rather that just added detail refinement. I would trade DolbyVision for 4K 3D in a heartbeat!

 

[Robert Crawford]

3D as you say was the most exciting development since DVDs. 3D tech was a big stumbling block to it's acceptance but the tech used in 4K (particularly DolbyVision) still has bugs that keep it from being regarded as a 100% quality upgrade for all 4K viewing equipment.
"Avatar the Way of Water" is far more engaging on the 3D disc than in 4K because the exploited sense of depth dramatically outways any additional perception of detail in 4K. The same is true of the "Guardians 3" 3D disc from Japan. When objects leap out into the black bars during scope sequences, it delivers an uncanny effect that is far more exciting and fun than the standard 4K flat viewing or theatrical version as well..
When projected, "Blue Hawaii", "Saturday Night Fever" and this week's release of "Snow White" have 4K dullness issues in comparison to their included blu ray discs. With Snow White, I'm forced to decide between an darker uptick in clarity (4K) or a sparkling bright and more colorful picture (BR). Coming to market with such dramatic tech incompatibility is no way for a media upgrade to jump into prime time as was also the case for 3D in its day.
Given the choice between perfecting one format or the other, for me 3D would win in an instant. The 3D experience is transformative rather that just added detail refinement. I would trade DolbyVision for 4K 3D in a heartbeat!

It's too bad the industry and most consumers don't agree with you.

 

[John Skoda]

Walmart uses 3rd parties like GRUV and Deep Discount for many of their media sales online. I would assume if they continue to do this there will be media available on their website.

Apparently Amazon does the same thing with physical media sometimes. I bought a new CD from Amazon a few weeks ago (not though a 3rd party, a regular Amazon purchase). When it arrived, the package said it was shipped to me from MovieMars.com, even though I'd never dealt with that company before.

 

[Robin9]

. . . . . . . . When projected, "Blue Hawaii", "Saturday Night Fever" and this week's release of "Snow White" have 4K dullness issues in comparison to their included blu ray discs. . . . . . .

I haven't watched the Blu-ray disc of Blue Hawaii included with the 4K package. So, thanks for that. I'll have a look.

 

[Jesse Skeen]

It's too bad the industry and most consumers don't agree with you.

There used to be a name here for "most consumers"- it was "Joe Sixpack".