***Official SPIDER-MAN 2 Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'Movies' started by Adam Portrais, Jun 28, 2004.

  1. Chuck Anstey

    Chuck Anstey Screenwriter

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    This may be true but as others have constantly posted: "Film is a visual medium." Stop telling us how much Peter Parker's life sucks and really show us. How about a 20-30 minute section where we see Peter go out at night, fight petty crime, then come back at 4am to try to finish a paper. Then we see him in class trying to stay awake and receiving paper after paper with D's and F's with comments from the professors that he will fail. We are told how he is screwing up his homework but we never see him actually do any. Then we get the "Rain drops are falling on my head" song and even more exposition about how his grades have improved.

    I think the film has too many short sequences to represent entire months of time or represent a constant problem in one shot. The one pizza delivery represents all of the times he fails to live up to his word. Missing the one 8pm showtime represents EVERY time he didn't make it on time. The "Rain drops" sequence represents months? of normal life. The first meeting and subsequent speech with Dr. Connors when he was late for class represents all those nights he chose to go out as Spiderman instead of doing his homework and being on time for class. But when it comes to money problems, we get this one over and over and over again about how he has money problems but not how being Spiderman caused it especially seeing how his pictures of Spiderman get him the most money. Sure there was the one job firing but there are other jobs.

    I agree that Spidey villians are not world dominators so the smaller scale works just fine but it would have been nice to see more than the one bank scene where Doc Ock steals some of the money. It seemed clear to me from the stuff lying around when he was working that he stole more than once to order (steal maybe?) the material he was assembling.

    As I said in the review thread, I liked the movie and I am sure it will grow on me over time but I did not think it was great.

    Chuck
     
  2. Patrick Sun

    Patrick Sun Moderator
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    I really don't think we needed another 20-30 minutes of seeing Peter's life in more turmoil. Most viewers got the point with the footage shown.
     
  3. Stephen_L

    Stephen_L Supporting Actor

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    I must disagree with some of the criticisms of the film. The idea that a superhero film must spell out a goal for the hero and a goal for the villain and that they are diametrically opposed is false. Why must it be that way? So it can be exactly like other superhero films? This film was not about Doc Oc or his plan. He was a device to force Peter to confront his willingness to sacrifice his personal life to his hero mission. I also disagree with the criticism that Peter's decision to assume a normal life was selfish. Think about it. Is Peter selfish when he sleeps? Dang, crime is happening all night; why isn't he up fighting it? He wanted a normal life, to be with, support, and maybe help the people he loves (MJ, Aunt May) He was a brilliant student; he wanted to show up for class and maybe learn to use his scientific gifts. While these are more personal goals they are hardly trivial or selfish. The conflict is sacrificing these good things for a higher good. I also disagree with the idea that a sequel must ratchet up the action. That cliche is what I dislike about most sequels. The desire to ratchet up the special effects, villains, danger, scale usually result in less realistic characters or situations. I also feel that allowing a film to have quiet moments gives added jolts to the action scenes. To much action just becomes noise
     
  4. Galen_V

    Galen_V Second Unit

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    Well, he didn't even take any money from the bank! He just threw the cash/gold coins/Chanukah gelt at Spider-man and then ran off with Aunt May (and we all know how it goes from there). [​IMG]

    In all seriousness though (and hopefully this won't sound like a cop-out), you have to remember that the source material here isn't a Tom Clancy novel -- it's a comic book. Although it looks like our world, the fact is that it isn't; Spider-man's NYC is a far cry from our own, even if they share the same skyline (although definitely not the same subway system). I think that one of the great aspects of the movie is that it's aware of this fact, and uses it to its advantage. Spider-man 2 can get away with the "bad science" because the setting doesn't force the viewer into believing that its real (compare this to Hulk, for example); it captures both the suspension of belief and the imagination and care that make a good comic, and consequently, a good comic book movie.
     
  5. Richard Kim

    Richard Kim Producer

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    I agree that we'll see this in 3, however I have a hard time picturing James Franco hamming it up and cackling like Willem Dafoe did in 1.
     
  6. david stark

    david stark Second Unit

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    Totally agree with that. Too many sequels have gone down following this route (Matrix, Blade recently spring to mind). What a sequen needs to do is see why the first film was so good and continue doing this. In Spidermans case it was the character development, the story (good script/dialogue). Spiderman 2 is an excellent film because it continues Spidermans/Parkers personal character development. We also start to see more development from other charcters (MJ, aunt may, harry). They have again produced an excellent script, the character development is there, there is good action, good humour (I personally liked the car alarm, and spidey in the elevator).
     
  7. Lou Sytsma

    Lou Sytsma Producer

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    Great film. The goal of the film to show Peter's struggle with his personal dreams against a larger canvas were excellently handled. Any of the oversimplifications in the film are inconsequential when compared against the emotion generated. On that basis the movie succeeds in spades.

    It will be interesting to see where Raimi et al take the next film. The Peter Parker/Spiderman dynamic has been pretty welled mined. They may get some distance out of Peter and MJs relationship but I think they would be best served to bring some some issues to the table in the next flick.

    Technically the CGI scenes were definitely a step up and any obvious shots didn't take me out of the moment.

    Raimi Rules!
     
  8. TedT

    TedT Second Unit

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    Yeah, but why did he take off his mask in the first place? I remember he took it off himself, but can't understand why. Must've missed something.
     
  9. Dan Rudolph

    Dan Rudolph Producer

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    I thought it was because one of the eye-lenses was broken, but when he put it back on, they were fine.
     
  10. Adam.Heckman

    Adam.Heckman Second Unit

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    I thought that he took it off cause it was smoldering. And that would be hot. Ouch.
     
  11. Patrick Sun

    Patrick Sun Moderator
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    I thought it was because he couldn't see through the lenses at the time.
     
  12. Matt Stone

    Matt Stone Lead Actor

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    That's what I thought too. Regardless, though...if I was just blasted in the face wearing a mask, my first reaction would probably be to yank the mask off.
     
  13. Andrew_Sch

    Andrew_Sch Cinematographer

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    Hey, just a warning to anyone reading this thread who hasn't seen the film yet. IMDB's page for the movie has a slight spoiler on it.

    For those who have seen it, the page lists Willem Dafoe in the cast.


    Not a real big deal, but kind of a spoiler.
     
  14. Jon_Are

    Jon_Are Cinematographer

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    And, all of the tears in his Spidey costume repaired themselves as well.

    Jon
     
  15. Greg_S_H

    Greg_S_H Executive Producer

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    Andrew, I was a little surprised he was in it. I knew where they were leading with Harry, but didn't expect a cameo.

    I agree with Chuck in that I want to see Spidey going out to fight petty crime at night next time. I take that for granted when reading the comics, and know he does it because of what happened to Ben, but it would still be interesting to explore what makes somebody get out of bed and swing around looking for crimes to stop. I hope he doesn't get married right off the bat next time, as there are great things to explore with Peter as a bachelor. I liked in the comics how he used to have to trick the sunbathing beauties so he could sneak into the building when he was dog tired after fighting crime. [​IMG]
     
  16. Rob Gardiner

    Rob Gardiner Cinematographer

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    The obvious next step in the Peter/MJ relationship would be to introduce the Black Cat and give MJ someone to be jealous over. [​IMG]

    Also, I seem to remember Aunt May spent a lot of time in the comics sick in bed. This would put Peter in a dilemma: do I head north to stop the villain from robbing the bank, or do I go south to pick up Aunt May's medicine.

    Can't wait for SM3. [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
  17. JonZ

    JonZ Lead Actor

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    Since were nitpicking[​IMG]- when Spidey took the mask off, didnt he just throw it away?

    Where'd the kids get it from?[​IMG]
     
  18. Dan Rudolph

    Dan Rudolph Producer

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    Also, while we're being nitpicky, Peter never seems to have hat-hair, even though i would think he would.
     
  19. Nick Sievers

    Nick Sievers Producer

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    You're worrying about whether or not he should have hat hair when you are watching a movie about a Spider man. [​IMG]
     
  20. Jose Martinez

    Jose Martinez Screenwriter

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    Well, isn't it enough that we now know that his costume itches and that it rides up his crotch? That elevator scene is a classic!

    One nitpick I have with the film (I love this movie BTW) is why would Doc Ock throw a vehicle towards Peter and MJ when he might have killed them? He knows he needs them to get to Spidey.
     

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