HSU vs SVS (1 Viewer)

[Chris_A_J]

Hi,
I am new to the forums, I stumbled across this website while researching the SVS sub. I have no intentions of starting a flame war between SVS and HSU(I have read the previous threads and am not interested in SVS marketing tactics or why people get banned).
Let me first start off by saying that I really value the opinions of the members here. There are a lot of knowledgeable people here. The sub I am looking for needs to be for music and HT. Both music and HT are equally important in the sub that I am seeking.
I have already spoken to to Tom V(BTW thanks for your quick replies and your willingness to help me ) and his suggestion was to go with a dual 25-31 CS+ setup.
Let me give you a little background info:
I am currently running a Marantz SR8200, Monitor 9's,a CC-370,& ADp-370's. My room dimensions are 20 X 13 X 8 ft. I have 3 doorways which measure 32" x 80" for 2 of them and 48" X 80" for the 3rd.
I want something that is going to rattle my windows and blow my pants legs. I should also add that my budget is $1,500 or less for the sub.
Any opinions would be welcome and greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance,
Chris

 

[EricHaas]

The problem is that although you will get nothing but honest opinions, very few people have demoed the new Hsu VTF-3. Only 2 people that even post here have heard it. If you read Barry's thread, then you know his opinion. Aside from that, you will get many people recommending SVS. Dual VTF-3's are a bit beyond your budget, and dual VTF-2's may be a bit below what you are looking for. Hence, dual cs-plus could be a good option. Another option is Barry's suggestion: order one of each sub. The loser goes back, and the winner gets a twin brother. This is the only way you will really know. Also, you may decide after listening to the two that you don't need a second one. That would save a lot of doh.

 

[Mike Matheson]

Chris,
We all well know that sort of anxious feeling that arises before making a purchase, wanting to get the best deal, the best product, etc. (well, at least I've dealt with that feeling a WHOLE lot )
But rest assured, which ever way you go (VTF-3 or dual CS+) you'll probably be SHOCKED by what you've gotten yourself into.
A good kind of shocked.

 

[Scott Oliver]

With a budget of $1500, I figured you might be interested in exploring some other options.
Here are some used subs listed on Audiogon right now.
Genesis 928 $825
Talon Roc $1700
Mirage BPS 400 $700
Bag End Infrasub $925
M&K MX-200 $850
I have a Bag End and find it to be quite nice.
Then the Talon stuff has always been very intriguing to me as well. Genesis is out of business. What a shame. Heard very good things about the Mirage too.
Anyhow, I once had three subs connected and found them all to be uneccesary. My remaining Bag End still rattles the room if I desire it to. Besides, a collection of black boxes and cylinders laying around the room just are not very appealing to me, and there is only room to hide one behind the sofa

 

[ling_w]

I think the VTF-3 could be had from Ebay from some wierdo for around $760. Dr. Hsu seems to know him and could certify that the guy is crazy, so I presume they know each other and he is a dealer.

Doing dual of anything usually requires some serious real estate in your room, especially when the sub looks seriously big.

Another option would be the Hsu TN series sub. Even better sounding than the VTF-3 sub. Skinny enough in profile to fit behind equipment rack or behind sofas.

 

[Robert_Gaither]

First of Chris I don't know what you mean by SVS's "marketing tactics" but the way it seems worded seems very judgemental in a negative way towards a manufacturer who seems to bend over backwards to help their customers and others who are in this hobby to either buy or build themselves a satisfactory sub and to me are one of many representatives of manufacturers that imho are exemplory of the status quo (you will also see reps from Adire, Servo, Blueprint, Stryke, etc and all of you have both my respect and thanks for your free and great advice).

Though I do not own a SVS product the thing is that I have downloaded software and modeled subs for my personal projects and notice that all the bang for the buck dealers (imho Adire, SVS, HSU, VMPS, Stryke, Blueprint, PartsExpress, Vision Accoustics, etc those that help us DIYers) follow T/S parameters and build/sell subs that just simply kill what you can find at your local stores for less than half cost. Whichever of these brands you settle on will be more for form as their function is very well stated and most effective at what they do (imho the worst sub that these guys offer will easily smoke most store bought subs under a $1000 and we're talking their entry level subs under $500!).

Pretty much a common trend you will not find among these manufacturers is a tiny sub for marketing for SAF, these are hardcore audiophiles who believe a sub is supposed to go lower, louder, and cleaner than a product that costs twice as much as what's offered at your local dealers. Though there are heated debates that have happened on this forum it usually was more over splitting hairs over ego's than performance. If you want to rule out one company without consideration of testimonials and people passionate about their great performing addition then the disservice you do is to yourself as without actually having heard any of these products you will either have to crunch numbers with a program (such as WinISD) or take a leap of faith based on the emotions of those who haven't read far enough back on some of these threads to find out how some of these arguments have started (SVS have some real haters who simply haven't heard the product making claims contrary how a product in an EBS alignment perform).

My advice is to build it if you can, buy it if you can't or don't want to build it, and read a few white papers on sub designs (Adire's site has a lot of nice papers for such simple research) and see if the sub can match to the size of your room, spl of your listening choice, and match to what you listen too. Trust me, there are no losers for those that buy from the manufacturer's that I recommended earlier but maybe except for the neighbors.

 

[Scott Oliver]

Wow Robert calm down.

He just simply mentioned some previous threads, and you start accusing him of heresy or something. Did you even read his thread past the first couple lines? He has already contacted SVS and received there recommendation, how does that action translate into him ruling them out.

By the way he is also doing a disservice to himself, if he doesn't listen to as many subs as he possibly can to make up his own mind as to what he likes best, especially with a budget as high as $1500.

Chris if an SVS or HSU is definately what you want take Eric's advice and order them both, then let your own opinions and ears determine the winner.

 

[EricHaas]

Robert:

Pretty sure Chris meant that he wasn't interested in hearing people's opinions about SVS' marketing tactics, which opinions have been bandied about quite a lot lately. He was saying he just wants opinions about the subs, nothing else.

 

[Chris_A_J]

Robert, I'm afraid you misunderstood me. I was in no way making a reference that I feel SVS is using devious tactics in their sales. My point was that I did not want to get in a flame war or here negative comments about either of the manufacturers. From the little experience I have had with guys at SVS they have been nothing but honest and informative.

Anyways, I have listened to a few subs out there: i.e. PW-2200, PS-1200, Mirage($1,500 model, dont remember actual model #) etc....

I was impressed with all these subs but I can't help but think that there is more bang for the buck out there. I definetely don't have the room to go with dual VTF-3's. I do however have enough space for 1 VTF-3 or dual 25-31's. Another option I was considering was going with the PCi+ when it comes out or maybe 2 of them. What opinions do you guys have of the PCi vs 25-31 vs VTF-3?

BTW, thanks for all the advice so far...

 

[Frank Carter]

I got a my CS Ultra(w/new driver) and Samson S1000 under $1500. I don't know SVS' package price is but I picked up the Samson for $399 at www.marsmusic.com. I have one locally so I didn't have to pay shipping.
I've only had my sub for 3 days and I must say that this thing rocks! I previously had a 20-39CS Plus and what a great that was as well. The main difference is I found is how musical the Ultra is. While the Plus series is no slouch when it comes to music, the Ultra just gets it right every time. I placed my Ultra right when I where I had my previous SVS and now my room is rattling again(it was fine with the plus). The Ultra hits with a little more snap and lights up the room with all it's glorious subsonic energy.
While not in my home, I store demoed all the big name subs like Paradigm Servo 15, Velo's HGS-18, Aerial SW-12, what ever REL had to offer(can't remember), and many more. The SVS CS Ultra does everything those other subs do but better.
My CS Ultra, Samson S1000, and SVS black box cost more than my five speakers and receiver put together and I still think it's the best value in my system. Now that's really saying something. Thanks SVS

 

[Mike Kao]

The SVS will take up about the same room as a VTF-3, the VTF-3 being slightly deeper and the SVS being taller. Obviously they maintain diferent design enclosures, it's really up to you what you feel is more attractive (if that's a factor). You could probably get a dual VTF-3 setup for about $1650 shipped, I believe a dual CS+ 25-31 setup would be about $1460 shipped, and if you wait, the PC+ series with similar performance would be probably slightly more. HSU and SVS both manufacture excellent subs, and I doubt either will disappoint. You might want to wait for more definitive tests/comparisons on these rival subs before you make your final decision though.

 

[Mike Kao]

Well I guess you could consider the Ultra as well... now I'd love to see the CS-Ultra stacked up against the VTF-3! Any VTF-3 owners live close by to any Ultra owners ?

 

[Martice]

Though I do not own a SVS product the thing is that I have downloaded software and modeled subs for my personal projects and notice that all the bang for the buck dealers (imho Adire, SVS, HSU, VMPS, Stryke, Blueprint, PartsExpress, Vision Accoustics, etc those that help us DIYers) follow T/S parameters and build/sell subs that just simply kill what you can find at your local stores for less than half cost.

I agree with all of the above except for one thing. It's Link Removed not Vision Acoustics.

 

[JerryW]

Martice, that's Link Removed. Your link's messed up.

 

[Martice]

Martice, that's Acoustic Visions. Your link's messed up.

What makes it worst is that I'm just as messed up as my link.

:b

Oh and by the way Jerry. How's that monster sub of your doing?

 

[Brian Bunge]

Martice is so giddy from his new speakers that he can't get his URL's right!
Brian

 

[Gil D]

Another option would be the Hsu TN series sub. Even better sounding than the VTF-3 sub.

Ling,

Is the driver used in the VTF-3 the same as that used in the TN1220? Has Hsu improved the driver in the past three years and can you still purchase only the driver.

Also, have you heard both of these Hsu subs and can tell me what sounds better with the TN(model?)

Who's this crazy guy on ebay and is he reliable.

Thanks,

Gil

 

[Sean D]

I currently have a dual 20-39CS with Samson S700 setup. I should be receiving my dual VTF-3 setup in a few days. I'll post my opinion shortly after they arrive.

 

[John A. Casler]

I want something that is going to rattle my windows and blow my pants legs. I should also add that my budget is $1,500 or less for the sub.

Chris,
I just took delivery on an Earthquake SuperNova 15" yesterday and spent most of the afternoon listening to "bass heavy" cuts and scenes.
This WOOF can be had for a price close to what you are looking for and is amoung the best performers I have heard, and felt.
Their 12" is an equally good performer and is well within your budget.
http://www.earthquakesound.com/serv02.htm
Also, the VMPS "Larger" sub is one of the most "unsung" SUBs around and it too, is a monster when it comes to prodigious BASS. It is a passive sub (needs an AMP) but mine is highly efficient and will "shake your world" on demand for $699 (cheaper in a kit) additionally it might even be considered an "audiophile" sub due to its accuracy and musicallity.
http://www.vmpsaudio.com/sub1.htm
Regards,
John Casler

 

[SkiingNinja]

Thanks Sean. I know I'm interested in what you hear.

Sean