DVD's with uncompressed audio tracks?

Discussion in 'DVD' started by BrianBo, Nov 13, 2005.

  1. BrianBo

    BrianBo Stunt Coordinator

    Joined:
    Jan 9, 2004
    Messages:
    155
    Likes Received:
    0
    Does anyone have a list of DVD's with uncompressed (PCM) audio tracks?

    I know the Beatles Anthology has a PCM track.
     
  2. Ravi K

    Ravi K Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2003
    Messages:
    707
    Likes Received:
    0
    Do The Right Thing (Criterion)
     
  3. David Jay

    David Jay Stunt Coordinator

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2004
    Messages:
    55
    Likes Received:
    0
    Criterion's DVD of Ingmar Bergman's The Magic Flute has an uncompressed PCM track.
     
  4. Rolando

    Rolando Screenwriter

    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2001
    Messages:
    1,326
    Likes Received:
    4
    How would one hear the PCM track? I assume it's as simple as selecting it right? no special connection other than the coaxial digital out? or since this is analog I need a different connection?
     
  5. Mark Lucas

    Mark Lucas Second Unit

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2005
    Messages:
    497
    Likes Received:
    0
    Stop Making Sense has one. MST3K: The Movie has one too. I wish we would get more PCM tracks instead of inferior quality AC3 at 192kbps.
     
  6. Damin J Toell

    Damin J Toell Producer

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2001
    Messages:
    3,762
    Likes Received:
    6
    Location:
    Brooklyn, NY
    Real Name:
    Damin J. Toell


    PCM is digital. And your coax out will work fine.

    DJ
     
  7. Grady Reid

    Grady Reid Stunt Coordinator

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2002
    Messages:
    130
    Likes Received:
    7
    Location:
    Olathe, KS
    Real Name:
    Grady
    A few I can think of...
    Pink Floyd- The Wall (very nice- I prefer it to the 5.1 mix)

    in the same vein: Roger Waters- In the Flesh (concert dvd)

    Paul McCartney's Wing Span (one of the few dvds I know of that doesn't have a DD track- PCM only)
     
  8. Clinton McClure

    Clinton McClure Casual Enthusiast
    Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 1999
    Messages:
    4,161
    Likes Received:
    302
    Location:
    Central Arkansas
    Real Name:
    Clint
    The Eagles - Hell Freezes Over DTS has an uncompressed PCM track .
     
  9. CraigF

    CraigF Cinematographer

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2002
    Messages:
    2,637
    Likes Received:
    116
    Location:
    Toronto area, Canada
    Real Name:
    Craig
    Rolando: you might have to select something like "raw" on your digital input to your A/V processor. I don't know about other ones, but mine require that selection, default to Dolby I think... Other than selecting the PCM track if necessary, that's all.
     
  10. Dean L

    Dean L Stunt Coordinator

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2000
    Messages:
    205
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ziggy Stardust And The Spiders From Mars-The Motion Picture (The 30th Aniversary remaster)
     
  11. Arnie G

    Arnie G Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    May 29, 2002
    Messages:
    662
    Likes Received:
    1
    Some I know of:

    Barbra Steisand: Timeless Live in Concert
    Celine Dion: All the Way
    Cher: Live in Concert
    Donna Summer: Best of Donna Summer
    Fleetwood Mac: The Dance
    kd lang: Harvest of Seven Years
    Kylie: Live in Sydney
    Lisa Stansfield: Biography
    Madonna: Immaculate Collection
    Madonna: Video Collection 93-99
    Michael Jackson: Dangerous
    Michael Jackson: HIStory
     
  12. Vincent_P

    Vincent_P Screenwriter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2003
    Messages:
    1,871
    Likes Received:
    205
    Maybe it's just me, but I really think it should be standard practice to offer movies with either mono-only or 2-channel-stereo-only (i.e., classic Dolby Stereo) soundtracks in PCM as opposed to Dolby Digital.

    Although, in the case of Criterion's VIDEODROME, at least they offered the Dolby Digital 1-channel track at a higher bitrate (192 KB/S, the usual bitrate for DD 2.0 tracks).

    Vincent
     
  13. Anthony Clifton

    Anthony Clifton Stunt Coordinator

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 1999
    Messages:
    157
    Likes Received:
    0
    Many Sony Music DVDs have uncompressed PCM.

    I think (not positive) that the James Taylor live and Bruce Springsteen videos and Live in NYC have PCM tracks ... maybe some of the other Bruce DVDs as well.
     
  14. ChristopherDAC

    ChristopherDAC Producer

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2004
    Messages:
    3,729
    Likes Received:
    0
    I agree that PCM should be used for mono and stereo tracks, although I understand the question of bumping the bitrate ceiling when you get above 2 or 3 channels, particularly if you're looking at 24-bit and/or 96 kHz. Of course, there's no excuse for cutting down a mono or stereo AC-3 track to 192 kbps [the rate used for AC-2 on old satellite TV systems]; my own unscientific A/B comparisons on an unusually-encoded LaserDisc suggest that AC-3 stereo at 384 kbps [DVD allows a somewhat higher rate] can sound very nice.
     
  15. JulianK

    JulianK Supporting Actor

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2000
    Messages:
    843
    Likes Received:
    0
    A few early R2 DVDs from BMG had PCM audio tracks: Manhunter and Flash Gordon, for example.
     
  16. Aaron Thorne

    Aaron Thorne Stunt Coordinator

    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2003
    Messages:
    199
    Likes Received:
    0
    The latest Zeppelin DVD has a PCM track.
     
  17. Matthew Clayton

    Matthew Clayton Stunt Coordinator

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2005
    Messages:
    148
    Likes Received:
    0
    The Star Wars music DVD that came with the Revenge of the Sith soundtrack has both PCM 2.0 stereo and Dolby Digital 5.1 tracks.
     
  18. DaViD Boulet

    DaViD Boulet Lead Actor

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 1999
    Messages:
    8,800
    Likes Received:
    3

    Indeed.

    Dolby Digital bit-shares accross channels so if there's not much happening but dialogue in a 5.1 mix, the center channel gets to use most of that 384 or 448 kbps for better fidelity...which works great bcs when that's all you're hearing you "tune in" to that one channel.

    So if 2.0 and 1.0 DD mixes were encoded at these higher "5.1 rates" the fidelity would markedly improve. By capping a 2.0 mix to 192 kbps a limit is put on the maximum fidelity either channel can ever reach...which is well below what a "channel with focus" in a typcial 5.1 448 mix would be able to use.

    2.0 and 1.0 mixes at 448 kbps would probably sound good enough that most of us "PCM on laserdisc still sounds better" guys wouldn't mind so much...though genuine LPCM would still be preferred.

    One thing to note: LPCM on DVD can only accept sample rates based on 48 kHz, whereas CD and Laserdisc sampled at 44.1 kHz. This means that many times the PCM on DVD has been sample-rate-converted at the studio to encode it at 48 kHz...which can noticably degrade the sound quality IMO. I've noticed that in general the PCM on laserdisc still often sounds better than the PCM on DVD, I think this may often be why (the sample-rate-conversion issue on the DVD). Of course, if a true A/D was performed at 48 kHz or higher-rate (like 96 or 192 kHz) and then downconverted to 48, it could potentially sound better than the 44.1 on laserdisc.
     
  19. ChristopherDAC

    ChristopherDAC Producer

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2004
    Messages:
    3,729
    Likes Received:
    0

    Curious if true, since professional digital equipment ordinarily operates at 48 kHz, and often at 24 bits; on the other hand, if the final product was destined exclusively for "consumer" use, in the days before DVD [remember prerecorded DAT was 44.1] I suppose it would not have been unusual to record the two-channel master mixdown directly at 44.1/16, eliminating the necessity of downconversion at the mastering lathe. Reconversion back to 48 would be a definite quality drop. Do you have a source?

    Not to stray into deeper waters, but I might mention the apparently little-known fact that the home dts audio codec, "Zeta," has a fixed per-channel bitrate: 220 kbps in the original design. Since AC-3 and Zeta belong to the same family of codecs, the two active channels in 448 kbps Dolby Digital should be expected to have sound quality on a par with the corresponding channels of full-bitrate dts, which through another unscientific comparison ["Babylon Sister" stereo mixdown from the Gaucho dtsCD vs. stereo PCM from the "20 Years of Steely Dan" CD] I find to be reasonably close to PCM in quality. [The channel-sharing and peak-bitrate phenomena might also explain the oft-quoted assertion that "DD surrounds a room with sound, and dts fill the room with sound," but that is neither here nor there.]
     
  20. MikeEckman

    MikeEckman Screenwriter

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2001
    Messages:
    1,085
    Likes Received:
    0
    The Trans-Siberian Orchestra DVD has a 2 channel PCM track. The DVD is pretty good (although it could have been a lot better had they included a whole concert) and I'd recommend it to anyone looking for a nice Christmas themed DVD.
     

Share This Page