Diva Swan 2.1, Axiom M22ti, [your fave here] - what's the finest budget bookshelf? (1 Viewer)

[Sean D]

I don't know what to say Rich. It sounds to me like you don't really want to go with the Divas. Why not get the Axioms then? Although I haven't heard them I'm sure they are very nice speakers. Many people seem to give them very good reviews so why not.

 

[Rich Malloy]

'Cause I'm afraid I'll change my mind right after I make my decision!
(And, because, deep down there's some ineffable but undeniable quality that attracts me the Divas, plus I'm fairly certain I'd prefer the quality of sound for music, and I keep hoping that all these little "issues" with the Divas are easily resolvable - "rewire this, check out these stands, I'll go in with you on a pair of 2.1's" - that sorta thing. I think, in my heart, I really want the Divas, but my brain keeps telling me the Axioms are the way to go!)

 

[BryanZ]

I also wanna cure the upgrade bug.

Me? I ended up with the 4.0 package. It definately has a coolness factor there and sounds wonderful. It also comes in different colors (or wood) so the wife may find that appealing. Perhaps she would change her mind if she was able to see a pair in person. They are also significantly cheaper than the Swans.
But you might as well be happy with what you get. From what I've read it appears you are trying to find a reason to get the Swans. I say take the plunge. If nothing else you should be able to sell them locally for pretty much what you paid for them (including shipping).
Enjoy!

 

[Dan_Jones]

Interestingly, the Axioms have started to make a splash over at the highly Swan-centric AVSFORUM in the following thread:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/show...threadid=131221
Though I notice some HTF regulars - Dan Jones, I'm looking at you!
(Dan, if you're lurking about, do you have any idea how your M50s compare to the M40s or M22s? Do the dual woofers simply allow for louder and slightly deeper sound, or do you feel the mid-range/upper bass is given any greater liquidity?)

Haha yes..I'm guilty of being an Axiom advocate...
From what I've read, and what I've talked with Marc H. at the Audioshop (where I ordered mine), the M40 is essentially the M3Ti in a larger cabinet, therefore allowing for deeper excursion then its bookshelf brother. As there is only one real review of the M40's online that I know of, it seems they felt the same way (M3Ti's that have their own stands I believe they said). I've also read the Axiom forums and have read that the M50's have a more controlled bass then that of the M40s due to the dual woofer arrangement; I've heard them called a more "robust" speaker then its sibling. I don't want the bass of the M50s to be sloppy at all, rather very tight and surprisingly strong (I ran without a sub for a while...easily shook the floor on some movies). I run with a sub now so I have the 50s as small with an 80Hz crossover. Midrange clarity and pristine highs, as well as great detail is what I think sets Axiom apart from its competitors. They are extraordinarily detailed speakers IMHO.
As for the M22 I'm not really sure where it would fall in relation to the M50's, but from what I've heard it noticeably bests the M3Ti overall. Of course it wouldn't have the bass of any of the towers.
Anyways, hope I've given some useful information lol...
Enjoy the hunt for the perfect speakers for ya Axiom of course gets my vote

 

[Sean D]

Well Rich,

Most of the problems you mention can be overcome. Buyers regret on the other hand is a little more of a hassle in my opinion. If the Divas are in your heart you might be better off trying to clear up the details that are weighing on your brain. I bet if you posted looking for someone to split on a pair of 2.1's you might be able to find someone. I've seen a few people at the AVS forum who might be interested in this type of thing. It's worth a shot. BTW, the backorder for the Divas is a drag but they are definately worth the wait in my opinion.

 

[Alex Bischoff]

I don't even know if I've ever seen stands that are strong enough to bear the weight of these speakers and which are tall enough for appropriate placement (in my room, it's 2 feet above my ears while sitting, or about 6 feet from the floor).

The weight issue aside for a moment, where would you find 5-foot (?) stands, anyway? The tallest stands I've come across are about 28" high. And, even if they did exist, wouldn't they have to be pyramid-shaped or something, to avoid toppling over?
FWIW, I consider an additional point in Axiom's favor is that their surrouds aren't monopoles (I would normally use the specific term "dipole" or "bipole", but I'm still not certain as to how the terms differ).
PS Rich: This Axiom-compared-to-Diva thread is highly interesting to me, as I'm going through the same thought process (I plan on upgrading my HT speakers within the next few months, likely to either Diva or Axiom). Anyhow, when/if you make a decision, please let us know (or even e-mail me).
-- Alex

 

[Rich Malloy]

Alex, I'll certainly let you know, and I'm sure we'll be occupying the same threads for some time to come. My plan is to hold off on a final decision until the Divas are once again available, hoping for a new deal or a great buy on a blemished set of 4.1's maybe!
Then again, in the time I've been mulling over this decision, Axiom's raised its prices by 12%. Still the best deal going, but not quite the deal it was only a week or so ago.

The weight issue aside for a moment, where would you find 5-foot (?) stands, anyway? The tallest stands I've come across are about 28" high.

You can find taller stands all over the place (audioadvisor.com soundcity.com even partsexpress.com has a few), but most of them top out at 48" (adjustable down to 28" or so). Axiom sells its own 28-48" adjustable stand here: http://www.axiomaudio.com/products.cfm?productID=QSS4 but it's not the kind I'll need for their QS8 speaker (see below). If you need them even taller, as I do, simply add a base (something very heavy and sturdy - even a cinderblock if you can live with the look). A 48" stand will get the tweeters up to about 5' for most speakers, which I think is acceptable for most of us.
Of course, when the speakers don't weigh 30 lbs, wall-mounting becomes the easiest option. But I had to look into speaker stands because of a former room configuration that wouldn't allow for wall-mounting and have since preferred using stands for more flexible placement (slightly away from the wall and toe'd slightly forward toward the listening position - I've found this placement/toeing sounds better in my room than directly to the side or just forward of the listening position, especially when integrating a center-rear speaker).
FWIW, the Axiom surrounds I'm looking at (the QS8s) require either wall-mounting or Axiom's uniquely-designed stand because the woofers are upward/downward firing. But unlike the other Axiom stands, these are only 36", and so I'll have to add a rather tall base or consider the wall-mounting option (speaker is only 11 lbs). What I'd prefer to do is use a pair of those little half-moon "tables" sold in office supply stores as a base because they match the shape of the speaker itself, but the bottom of the Axiom stand is more rectangular looking so I may have to find a different (rectangular) option

 

[Dan_Jones]

Then again, in the time I've been mulling over this decision, Axiom's raised its prices by 12%. Still the best deal going, but not quite the deal it was only a week or so ago.

Hi Rich, I'm a bit curious of this... according to AxiomAudio.com the prices are all still the same (in U.S.)..I noticed the AudioShop did raise their prices a bit though..kinda odd I guess. Axiom also has the factory outlet option which can chop off quite a bit in terms of price, plus from what i've read you'd be hard pressed to find the blems.

Well, anyways, good luck!

 

[Alex Bischoff]

Axiom also has the factory outlet option which can chop off quite a bit in terms of price, plus from what i've read you'd be hard pressed to find the blems.

Just to chime in here, one of my neighbors has a pair of M22Tis that he bought from -- as he likes to call it -- Axiom's "scratch and dent dept" (the Factory Outlet). However, I looked over his speakers thoroughly, and I could find a single blem. Really, they looked like brand new speakers to me.
-- Alex

 

[SkiingNinja]

Hi Rich. As the other Sean mentioned, an AVS member that goes by the handle sheppard came over in February. Here is a comparison pic:

Sheppard's review is here.
His review is generally favorable towards the Diva, but of course only you can be the judge.
Take note of the disclaimer he posted re: the 2.1's bass. My 2.1's were indeed not broken in and having heard what a broken in pair sounds like vs, I can tell ya that the difference is not subtle. If anyone in the Bay Area wants to hear this first hand, please PM or e-mail me...I can get us set up with a broken in pair and a not so broken in pair to illustrate the differences...
Anyway, my take on the two was similar to his. I preferred the highs of the 2.1 over the M3 whereas he thought it was a toss up. I also give the nod to the Diva mids....anyway, just read his take...
Sean

 

[Russell _T]

I was just reading down this thread when I saw the posts concerning the R3's. I don't have the R3's myself, but I remember the discussions about them. They are wired in a configuration that makes them an adaptive dipole. They were never wired wrong to begin with which is why AV123 never corrected it. In fact the people who were concerned about not having mirrored pairs decided that the existing design made sense and worked very well. I would call Steve Ozmai at AV123 if you have ant further concerns along these lines, and I'm sure he can explain it to you better than I can. You can also search the Swans Diva - Best speaker for the money ever part 2 thread on the AVS Forum.

 

[SkiingNinja]

As I remember (and I certainly could be wrong), the woofers are wired in phase for better response. It doesn't matter how the tweeters are wired in this senario because high frequency wavelengths are so small. Get your SPL meter and play a 1KHz tone. Move the meter slightly (and follow with your head). The needle will jump 3dB or more as you move...and you definately hear it as you move your head. This would work the same regardless of how the tweeters are wired.
If I've got this worng, please let me know
Sean

 

[WilliamJay]

Rich,

I live in Brookline and own 4.1s along with an SVS 20-39cs. If you have any interest in listening to them email me and I would be happy to let you hear them. The 4.1s are greats speakers for the money.

Bill